Help with tactics

[UAF]

Hi there, is there a strategy guide of some kind to BA?
I could use some help with tactics and such.
I'm not a totale noob, but I find that I'm uncomfterbly close to it...

I play Core under the impression that they have the bigger guns (though I sometimes doubt that). So if there is some site with build orders and such, or if people here could give detailed tactics that'll be greate.

And yes, I know about watching replays. But it's actually better IMO to read a set of general instructions and use replays to see variations for specific situations.

[Johannes]

There aren't very good BA guides unfortunately. There are some guides scattered around internet, but none which I've seen very complete picture of how to play, more just describing specific units and situations.
But there's somethings:

Help various smaller subjects
http://www.springinfo.info/category/new ... ihilation/
A nice guide on RTS basics, not BA specific though
http://www.smuggoat.com/blog/?page_id=148

A small piece I wrote on this forum to another guy asking for help

A simple start buildorder, and guideline how to play:

Start 2 mex, 2 solars, vehicle lab.
Queue 1 scout (send to annoy enemy, try not to lose it but drive around with it), then a constructor (send to build mexes), few more scouts, then light tanks.
Comm builds a 3rd solar (or wind, if it's strong on the map) while the constructor is making, then assists lab. If you notice you're e stalling at any point build more energy building with comm.

From then on try to see with scouts if the enemy has more or less expansions than you. Try to kill those expansions so that you're subtly ahead. If you have more mexes then you don't need to attack as fast (still do if its open), let the army size difference grow for a moment.

Then when your metal starts to rise so that you're not stalling, build more constructors. 2nd con should build mexes, 3rd should start a row of energy buildings, 4th makes a nano. Always try to keep your metal storagge low, invest in economy soon enough.

Stick to making gators & weasels until pretty long with core, then it's map/situation dependant what you should transition into. Getting airlab and bladewings is 1 decent choice.

You can fine-tune it a lot, once you know how the game works better, but its shold be an ok thing to start with. Experiment with the timings when you get different stuff, and see what works.

Also have good radar coverage at all times.

I remember seeing some other things too but don't remember where, or whether they are any good

If you want more specific help, you should give an idea what you're having trouble with, what kind of games you are interested in (size/map), and maybe post a replays of you playing.

[UAF]

Thanks, I'll read the links.

As for more specific questions:
Lets start with this - ARM or CORE?
I usually prefer the bigger guns faction (Soviets in Red Alert). But looking at states I'm not even sure CORE are the bigger guns faction in BA.

What exactly are the differences between the two factions? Which is easier to play? Which require more micro?


FYI, I prefer team games on 1v1 (although DSD is clearly not built for 8v8, I think it's a great map for 5v5).


I'd also like advice about economy building. Seems that people always get it much faster then I do...

[Yuri]

You know, BA stands for Balanced Annihilation, so CORE ~ ARM.

One advice which will clear all your questions: watch games/replays.

[UAF]

You know, BA stands for Balanced Annihilation, so CORE ~ ARM.

Notice the ~ which is not =
Because they are not really the same.
I was asking about the differences.

One advice which will clear all your questions: watch games/replays.

Allow me to qoute myself:

And yes, I know about watching replays. But it's actually better IMO to read a set of general instructions and use replays to see variations for specific situations.

[Gota]

Here,this is true of most ta mods not just BA.

Remember:
Balance has a lot to do with maps...Some units are better on certain maps cause of their characteristics.
If a unit can climb hills while another can't the first is better on hilly maps..

Flat maps versus hilly maps.
On flat maps start with vehicles.
On hilly maps start with kbots.
On maps with high wind(press "i" button) remember to make air after a while cause air units require a lot of E and less M and if E is cheap Air units are more efficient.

Faster units versus slower ones.
Faster units are better on bigger maps and while the map is mostly empty and nobody took many mexes yet.
As the game progresses slower,heavier,longer ranged units tend to become more efficient.
Generally this means that you make fast units at start,trying to raid your enemy's mexes and expansions while defending your own and as front lines begin to form you switch to heavier longer ranged units.
At some point you and your enemy might destroy the front lines of one another and your army size will become smaller than you can start making faster units again until the front lines are restored once more and there isn't much place to move again.
(in team games,usually,faster units become less efficient faster so be prepared to make slower units much earlier)

economy versus unit building
You can make another con and expand to get more resources and you can make more units to better defend your structures while also haivng more units to harass the enemy base.
Question is when to build which and how to balance making enough constructions units to expand fast while not making too little units to defend and attack properly...
This balance you'll have to learn yourself on every map you play.

Remembering Build orders
on most maps you usually have a choice of ho many mexes to build before you start making a lab.
These choices are important and can influence the outcome of the game.
example:
Comet catcher,BA.
If x player starts 1 mex 2 solars lab while y player starts 3 mex 2 solar lab x player will be able to reach y player's base and kill of his mexes before y player has a chance to defend them.
If on the other hand y player guy made mex, llt, mex, 2 solar,lab start than the scouts of x player, that did a quick start, will not have much to do and thus that quick attack lost its purpose.

Defensive towers versus expansion:
When one player makes a lot of defensive turrets you should make a lot of constructions units and expand quickly without making many defenses.
When someone makes a lot of construction units while you were making a balanced amount of construction units and attacking units you need to start attacking him since you have a bigger army.

Scouting:
to see what sort of game your opponent is playing you must constantly scout him and see what sort of game he is playing.
At first you usually scout with land scouts but later in game you can scout with air scouts.

Important points:
*do not send an attack unless you know your gonna make a devastating blow.
If you send a few units and they just die without doing a lot of damage while allowing the enemy to reclaim the wreckage you are losing...

*Try not to send blind attacks.If you send out a wave of flash try and scout the area your about to attack to see roughly what the enemy has there.

*if you play a large map with not many players(meaning each player has to control a lot of space and metal) think about putting your labs or at least one on repeat to spare yourself the micro of having to go back to it and queue up more units while you should be concentrating on microing your existing units.

*try not to waste units for nothing.
example:
If you send a scout but see there is nothing he can attack for now do not send him to die anyway, instead, back him up and try and use him later on.


Beyond the general guidelines i wrote above you will have to memorize gameplay on specific maps and get a feel for what exactly you need to do at what points by yourself.
Repetition...

[babbles]

You know, BA stands for Balanced Annihilation, so CORE ~ ARM.

Are you implying that in XTA, NOTA, BOTA, CA and any other mods for that matter have one side which is better than the other? If not, I fail to see the point of that statement.

[knorke]

when attacking, look for buildings that can be easily destroyed and will have a big impact on the game. for example:

wind farms: winds die so fast, if you get just a few tanks in there, its worth it even if you lose some tanks while driving there. a solar farm on the other hand, is harder to kill.

nanos: those die fast too, usually next to factories

geos: sometimes later in game you can bomb these spots without scouting even

if you are not good with tech/eco, avoid front lines forming.

[Wombat]

fight and reclaim, if u gonna do this , u are already better than 50% of ppl around here, rest will come together with experience imo.

[Yuri]

You know, BA stands for Balanced Annihilation, so CORE ~ ARM.

Are you implying that in XTA, NOTA, BOTA, CA and any other mods for that matter have one side which is better than the other? If not, I fail to see the point of that statement.

I will kindly explain my statement to you. Balanced in the name of the mod should make the fact that sides are balanced totally clear for everybody.

You simply made wrong assumption.

[[RRU]RockmoddeR]

Another thing that I see a lot of people failing at is when they tech up and M-stall, they fail to reclaim solars, old labs and adv. solars. These are quite a bit of M if you're going to t2 (145, 580-850m/lab and 348 M respectively) and it speeds up the tech tremendously. Like wombat said, reclaim the M your enemy leaves at your door, and BALANCE. Don't porc, conspam or unit-only rush. BALANCED Annihilation, remember. Another hint of advice: never play the same strategy over and over again. Change your tactics as often as possible, and find one that fits the situation. I.E. I'm not a particularly good techer, scout rusher, commdropper/bomber golly/fatboy rusher, nukerusher, tacnuker or commwalker, but I do all of these things all the time to make myself unpredictable. Also play as many different positions you can per map. North front, middle front, south front, north/south/middle back. Each area is different and if you can play well in all on a map you have a distinct advantage.

[babbles]

You know, BA stands for Balanced Annihilation, so CORE ~ ARM.

Are you implying that in XTA, NOTA, BOTA, CA and any other mods for that matter have one side which is better than the other? If not, I fail to see the point of that statement.

I will kindly explain my statement to you. Balanced in the name of the mod should make the fact that sides are balanced totally clear for everybody.

You simply made wrong assumption.

If they're balanced why do they need changing all the time.

Also, "fact that sides are balanced", considering balance is up to intepretation, I don't see how it can be justifed as a "fact".

The name of a mod doesn't explicitly mean it does what it says on the tin. It shouldn't make it clear for anybody, it's just a name. I could make a mod, call it "More Balanced than Balance Annihilation" (well I couldn't due to stealing the BA name but still) it wouldn't mean it was balanced.

[Johannes]

And no matter how balanced the sides are it doesn't answer which side to pick. They have pretty similar sized guns, but arm is faster while core is sturdier, if that helps you

Very important thing is to just watch that you spend your metal fast (not have much in storage, but preferably not stall either) and that you have enough energy.

[1v0ry_k1ng]

make jeffy until LLTs, then flash until youve spammed enough windmills, then stumpys. if game porcs up enough, make t2 bombers

[Hackfresser]

arm has better vecs and slightly better t1 kbots (with the exception of ak > peewee), better t3, and better t1 porc. core has better t2 kbots and better t2 porc.
core has slightly better t1 sea, while arm has slightly better t2 sea.
dunno about air or hovers or amphib.

now step back and watch as poeple rush to rip out my throat for my blasphemy.

[Neddie]

I think the idea is that the testing and changes are in pursuit of a concrete level of balance, which while partially invalid is at least a laudable dream.

[Pxtl]

Honestly, if you want a simpler, more brute-force game you should be playing Arm, not Core. Arm has a simpler vehicle game (Pitbull and Stumpies) than Core does. Core's "heavier" asset really just means access to a few anti-swarm vehicles that Arm lacks, but they pay for this failing with less-effective tanks and missing a heavy-hitting support fire unit (Penetrator).

Also, Core's emphasis on laser weapons (which do more damage at point-blank range) makes them more micro-management intensive.

Of course, this is ignoring the kbot game... but don't worry, everybody does.

[Johannes]

Balance is determined by maps in the end anyway, between arm and core, veh and bots, between different strategies...

[UAF]

Thanks for the info.
I think I'll move to ARM. I prefer brute force on micro. :)

[Gota]

There is no such thing.
Both sides need micro.
CORE have the heavier units.
CORE has the Goliath,the Sumo,the Krogoth,the Krow...
Since these are the heaviest units in the game it seems to be you should play CORE.

CORE do not lack anything TBH.