0.77 release lobby discussion

[AF]

There are tasclient files everywhere all over the place, they should be in a tasclient folder just like the other lobbies/bots (even the AIs) do

[reivanen]

There are tasclient files everywhere all over the place, they should be in a tasclient folder just like the other lobbies/bots (even the AIs) do

+1 !

Why is this not fixed ? Spring is the engine, tasclient or springlobby should be optional installs in the installer.

[AF]

IIRC springlobby keeps everything in a springlobby folder. TASClient treats the spring folder itself as its own personal playground

[reivanen]

IIRC springlobby keeps everything in a springlobby folder. TASClient treats the spring folder itself as its own personal playground

Yes, this is what i meant. Springlobby should be the default lobby coming with spring if the maintainer of tasclient cant be bothered to clean up their program, imo.

Its not the first time this issue is raised, and i believe almost everyone agrees that it would be better for tasclient to house in an own directory and not all over the place.

[AF]

I do nto believe it would eb fair to switch to spring lobby as the default and instead tasclient should still eb included but with other lobbies provided too. We need to encourage a more diverse lobby ecosystem, and removing tasclient would harm that goal while being unfair to satirik and all who have contributed to that project.

Nonetheless, tasclient needs to store its files in tasclient folders rather than dropping tasclient specific files here there and everywhere. This is a simple quick change to make and the other lobbies already do it.

[clericvash]

I agree about the TASClient changes, it needs some cleaning done.

[Otherside]

multiple lobbies will confuse new people and detract from springs userfriendlyness which is probably its biggest problem at the moment (id say more so than performance)

[Satirik]

what files ... please tell me ? all TASClient files except the exe itself and the 7za.dll are in the lobby dir so please tell me ? tasclient 2files .... so please now stop trolling this thread and go away making something useful

edit: i won't even answer to other retarded questions

[Otherside]

imo each lobby client should make a case of why it should be the default client for the next spring release.

And an admin or public vote should be taken as to which lobby client should be picked as the default for the next spring version installer.

Im not against having different lobbies i actually do think its good to have multiple lobbies being developed to keep development lobby side active (which is important)

But new people will be confused by the option of multiple lobbies and will do spring way more harm than good.

Imo this is the best way to go about it.

Other lobby options should be available for download of course, for people who are regular spring players who understand how spring works and will appreciate it. But new players just want to play and giving them one option that works and does it job well is all that is needed any more than that and it will confuse people and put people off spring ( aswell as give extra problems and more noob questions when it comes to helping new players with bugs etc or general noobishness)

so really if you want spring to progress and increase in playerbase stick to one lobby option. And give all lobby dev's the option to be able to achieve the spot of default lobby by having the best user friendly lobby with the best features.

Imo TASclient is fine atm just needs a bit of work. I dont want to bash springlobby or battlehub imo they are both good projects which are intresting alternatives but i dont think new players need that just yet they just need to play!!

[reivanen]

what files ... please tell me ? all TASClient files except the exe itself and the 7za.dll are in the lobby dir so please tell me ? so tasclient 2files .... so please now stop trolling this thread and go away making something useful

How about putting the exe and 7za.dll in the lobby dir, and creating a shortcut to the exe in the main folder ?

[AF]

AFLobby:

Code: Select all

/lobby/aflobby/

Battlehub:

Code: Select all

/lobby/battlehub/

TASClient:

Code: Select all

/Campaigns/
/Missions/
/lobby/cache/
/lobby/logs/
/lobby/SPSkins/
/lobby/Var/

As you can imagine, a pattern is emerging, and I suspect in my 10 second look around I've missed some more folders tasclient uses as well as the numerous files it dumps in the root spring directory.

[Satirik]

AFLobby:

Code: Select all

/lobby/aflobby/

Battlehub:

Code: Select all

/lobby/battlehub/

TASClient:

Code: Select all

/Campaigns/
/Missions/
/lobby/cache/
/lobby/logs/
/lobby/SPSkins/
/lobby/Var/

As you can imagine, a pattern is emerging, and I suspect in my 10 second look around I've missed some more folders tasclient uses as well as the numerous files it dumps in the root spring directory.

[aegis]

imo each lobby client should make a case of why it should be the default client for the next spring release.

And an admin or public vote should be taken as to which lobby client should be picked as the default for the next spring version installer.

no client is in a position to replace tasclient right now.
no arguments, no debates.

[AF]

Aegis, can you make a checklist of what would be required of another client that the current rival projects do not fullfill?

[Crayfish]

At a guess, it needs to offer the functionality that TASclient does plus something extra. Identification of unmet market need is really the onus of a product developer. The market is hardly saturated though, it shouldn't be hard to find ways to compete.

[AF]

Well there are plenty of things tasclient doesn't have the others do, like the smileys in battlehub or the many features that keep getting leeched from spring lobby.

Replay listings comes to mind.

[Crayfish]

Also something like boneyards That'd get me to change.

One (minor) problem with open source projects is the fact that because there is no IP protection, competitiveness between subprojects (in this case content developers) becomes difficult. An established subproject can usually just take the bits it likes from rivals that would have been their patent protected unique selling points in a litigious, patent protected arena.

This does mean that the final product ends up having the best parts of a number of subprojects, which is a great thing for the project overall. However, I see competitivity as a major driver of innovation that would help to further motivate content developers, even if the only rewards are playerbase and recognition.

Maybe one way to encourage fair competition without making any severe changes to licensing (and open source is an amazing ideal, don't change it) would be to instil a convention whereby credit is given in some way to the original developer (or coalition) that made useful IP. For instance, all the bits that have found their way from CA to BA would need to be credited somewhere... maybe they are but it's certainly not obvious if so. This would mean that at least recognition, if not playerbase, would be a consistent reward for developers.

I'm not fully aware of the mechanics here though, maybe this already happens in some way, if only because it's a fairly small community and most people know who's done what anyway even if it isn't explicitly acknowledged anywhere.

[Forboding Angel]

no client is in a position to replace tasclient right now.
no arguments, no debates.

Completely untrue. Springlobby beats failclient with a rubber hose repeatedly.

And yes, a checklist like AF said would be nice.

[smoth]

currently springlobby cannot do multiple windows and last time I tried it, the lobby could not save my colors. I also do not like the way the battle window works.. blah blah blah blah.

[AF]

no client is in a position to replace tasclient right now.
no arguments, no debates.

Completely untrue. Springlobby beats failclient with a rubber hose repeatedly.

And yes, a checklist like AF said would be nice.