I voted "Yes, i don't like the cheating.".
Although i don't regard it as cheating, i don't think that it should be so and regard it as quite important.
It makes a huge diference when we, for example, fps a Hlt. (ever seen a Brawler FPSed?)
And yes, AA laser towers can't be abused like that however it brings that very ill side effect of when beeing on higher ground, having it's range artificially increased, they aim at things they cannot hit.
Fps off Checkbox?
Moderator: Moderators
This is not a problem with FPS, this is a problem with the spring code... if simply taking control of a laser unit allows it to fire slightly beyond its range then something is wrong.. laser weapons in spring have a defined range in their TDF file and they must constrain to this.. other weapons dont quite work this way because they function on physics but not the lasers the spring code needs to be fiddled around with as far as weapons and aiming goes as right now its a wee bit buggy..
I think im missing something by not playing aa.
Do llts fire overange?
if so, how much more?
last time i checked, in default mod, it was like 10% more?
and ive used it in xta for fun sometimes.. or other times when something is "just outside of the range" .. like.. half a pewee-wide away of the laser's range..
There are other units far more exploitable, like that popup spitting missile tower the freaker builds. Ive seen it double its range, quite accurate.
Do llts fire overange?
if so, how much more?
last time i checked, in default mod, it was like 10% more?
and ive used it in xta for fun sometimes.. or other times when something is "just outside of the range" .. like.. half a pewee-wide away of the laser's range..
There are other units far more exploitable, like that popup spitting missile tower the freaker builds. Ive seen it double its range, quite accurate.
Honestly, I think that such so-called "exploits" give the game a bit of character beyond the physics simulation it currently is running...
Kixxe mate, TA is Strategy and Tactics. It isn't all about strategy, nor is it all about tactics. Like i said, FPS mode is very well balanced and fnu and all that... remembre hawk line dancing? bomber offscreening? pel-raids?
It's all part of the game, and as I said, it adds character and is really not that big a deal mate... the advantage gained isnt significant.
Kixxe mate, TA is Strategy and Tactics. It isn't all about strategy, nor is it all about tactics. Like i said, FPS mode is very well balanced and fnu and all that... remembre hawk line dancing? bomber offscreening? pel-raids?
It's all part of the game, and as I said, it adds character and is really not that big a deal mate... the advantage gained isnt significant.
Can't think of any in an RTS of the top of my head, but Quake sure has a lot of them. Take a look at http://www.reference.com/browse/wiki/Quake near the bottem.Kixxe wrote:I would like you to mention 1 or 2 commecial RTS'S excluding TA who has bugs the brings "charater" to the game.
Just playing devil's advocate.
EDIT: There are a few in Age of mythology. Most have to do with Egyption god powers.
I agree fully with Kixxe, and can post a replay to show exactly what he means.
I think an extra reason for getting rid of this bug is, that obviously only more experienced players will know it, leading to newer players thinking: How the hell did his laser towers shoot mine ?
In case they ask this question, their opponent might be friendly enough to admit FPSing them, still leaving you feeling cheated.
Even worse though,your opponent might not tell you how it was done, thus making you think that cheating is possible/ Spring has unpredictable bugs or similiar, generally not helping the opinion the user has of Spring.
So, get rid of it in any way possible of course.
I think an extra reason for getting rid of this bug is, that obviously only more experienced players will know it, leading to newer players thinking: How the hell did his laser towers shoot mine ?
In case they ask this question, their opponent might be friendly enough to admit FPSing them, still leaving you feeling cheated.
Even worse though,your opponent might not tell you how it was done, thus making you think that cheating is possible/ Spring has unpredictable bugs or similiar, generally not helping the opinion the user has of Spring.
So, get rid of it in any way possible of course.
Well gee, how EVER could experienced players know more about the game than newer players? That's not right!SeanHeron wrote:I agree fully with Kixxe, and can post a replay to show exactly what he means.
I think an extra reason for getting rid of this bug is, that obviously only more experienced players will know it, leading to newer players thinking: How the hell did his laser towers shoot mine ?
Heck, we should just make it TOTALLY even for all players, regardless of skill level! Who needs to actually play the game anyway? Lets just have a random dice game... you click the button, it rolls dice for you, and if its even number, player 1 wins. If its an odd number, player 2 wins. Who needs actual skill?
Whoa! slow down there! You're telling me that new players might not be being force-fed every single strategy, tactic, and balance element? And that as a result of not being told everything off the bat, they'll quit the game! Holy shit!Even worse though,your opponent might not tell you how it was done, thus making you think that cheating is possible/ Spring has unpredictable bugs or similiar, generally not helping the opinion the user has of Spring.
really guys, i checked in 1.44 aa, and its a commander's wide of range extend.. that nothing really. Cant beleive that is worth that much important for the gameplay.
if you are deppending on that is because you are are "llt walking" your way into enemys territory.. lame tactic, but does that really happen?
on small maps, it could have more importance, but really.. should not be much either.... its just a little bit it gets extended..
e: oh!... and you are still talking about commander bombing in that other thread?! what a patience you have..
e: azu, that is because someone is "walking" defenses in your base.. what a crappy tactic in the first place.
Seccond, if someone is building something just few pixels away of YOUR OWN HLT, and you dont realize that, then you are blind and something is wrong with your gameplay.
if you are deppending on that is because you are are "llt walking" your way into enemys territory.. lame tactic, but does that really happen?
on small maps, it could have more importance, but really.. should not be much either.... its just a little bit it gets extended..
e: oh!... and you are still talking about commander bombing in that other thread?! what a patience you have..
e: azu, that is because someone is "walking" defenses in your base.. what a crappy tactic in the first place.
Seccond, if someone is building something just few pixels away of YOUR OWN HLT, and you dont realize that, then you are blind and something is wrong with your gameplay.
Last edited by mongus on 10 Apr 2006, 20:51, edited 3 times in total.
After > 10 years online, that kind of thing is almost like meditation.mongus wrote:e: oh!... and you are still talking about commander bombing in that other thread?! what a patience you have..
There are circumstances where this could happen anyway. But even if it doesn't have a big impact on gameplay now, it seems like a hypothetical balance pain for modders and mapmakers, as you'd always have to account for that little extra bit of range.Seccond, if someone is building something just few pixels away of YOUR OWN HLT, and you dont realize that, then you are blind and something is wrong with your gameplay.
Yup, that's what I was thinking. Throw up a jamming field that covers the area you want to build in, which is (IIRC) outside of the HLT's range, then start building there. Unless your enemy's got some Dragon's Eyes or other methods of increasing his HLT's sight range, they won't spot it until it opens fire.mongus wrote:Im thinking its related to jammed field/units, can some aa'er confirm?
(by confirm i mean, pick a replay, and watch it, tell if this is what happens->confirm here)
Not sure if it's viable or an issue in practice. I know that jammers are used to sneak up Guardians, but that's valid.
"What if someone builds something just outside of your defenses' range.
Are you also saying that Dragons Eyes and scouts may actually reveal these units?
And this pertains to FPSing units HOW?
Really, look at your argument again... it's just silly. I mean if you don't know what's happening just a single screenlength outside of your base, then you just suck.
Wait... are you saying that jammers can be used to jam... and therefore hide units from raday detection?Throw up a jamming field that covers the area you want to build in, which is (IIRC) outside of the HLT's range, then start building there. Unless your enemy's got some Dragon's Eyes or other methods of increasing his HLT's sight range, they won't spot it until it opens fire.
Are you also saying that Dragons Eyes and scouts may actually reveal these units?
And this pertains to FPSing units HOW?
Really, look at your argument again... it's just silly. I mean if you don't know what's happening just a single screenlength outside of your base, then you just suck.
Well its an aa problem i think, related to jammer ranges a lah, ..Dragon45 wrote:"...I mean if you don't know what's happening just a single screenlength outside of your base, then you just suck.
so you are actually saying, dragon45, that aa players dont know what happens "just a single screenlength outside of their base" -.-
again, i think its related to aa..
in resume.
-if you don't know what's happening just a single screenlength outside of your base, then you just suck.
-aa players don't know what's happening just a single screenlength outside of their base.
-
*wears asbestos swit, and enters asbestosmobile, then drives to underground nuclear shelter and locks the door."
Correction mongus, sucky players *period* have no idea what's going on immediatly outside of their base... this fact is mod independent... i cannot remember the number of times i have sent a few adv con airs a screenlength behind an enemy's base with a jammer and set up a firebase that eventually rapes them from behind...
Again, its a skill problem, not an engine problem >_>
Again, its a skill problem, not an engine problem >_>
You mean the base you were infiltrating had a jammer rigth?Dragon45 wrote:...sent a few adv con airs a screenlength behind an enemy's base with a jammer and set up a firebase that...
thats because lifted jammers (transported using planes), get "stunned" and dont jam at all.
so then enemy must have had a "more of a screenleght jammer" in base.
yeah, very possible. thats why i get radar towers all over.