NTai XE10.1b
Moderators: hoijui, Moderators
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hollowsoul
- Posts: 665
- Joined: 06 Jun 2006, 19:49
Maybe add feature to run outside program to deal with rotating the logs. Either via Single Spring program for windows.
* rotate logs by how old they are & total space been used up by logs
In linux it easy enough to make up a script for peep to use & set to "run script"(use lograte program to do most of the work) via cron. Thus would be able to set to run @ such a time each day.
Find similar program in windows / or throw 1 together in java. And add to windows spring client for spring.
* rotate logs by how old they are & total space been used up by logs
In linux it easy enough to make up a script for peep to use & set to "run script"(use lograte program to do most of the work) via cron. Thus would be able to set to run @ such a time each day.
Find similar program in windows / or throw 1 together in java. And add to windows spring client for spring.
The problem with that is:
Spring SP isnt my program, and I dont have the necessary stuff to compile it in VB, it always gives errors. If anything it's AFLobby I'd end up using and working on.
I dont know howto do that in linux.
Any program i write will block NTai and Spring execution when ran from NTai.dll displayign a command prompt
For now you're stuck with logs.
Spring SP isnt my program, and I dont have the necessary stuff to compile it in VB, it always gives errors. If anything it's AFLobby I'd end up using and working on.
I dont know howto do that in linux.
Any program i write will block NTai and Spring execution when ran from NTai.dll displayign a command prompt
For now you're stuck with logs.
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Lindir The Green
- Posts: 815
- Joined: 04 May 2005, 15:09
OK, I just ran a 72 minute test, and I have a lot of feature requests.
Currently, NTai has a very strong early game. It sends swarms of level 1 units, and expands well. But the problems is that it keeps sending swarms of level 1 units, even when it should be teching up and sending level 2 units.
And so I would like a few more commands to ease the transition to level 2 infrastructure:
Late game, the level 1 factories have many many k-bots guarding them, but the level 2 factories have very few. This is because the level 2 factories haven't been around as long, accumulating guarders. So I would like a command to guard an advanced factory. The unit could decide which factories are advanced by metalcost, with the lind between basic and advanced defined in the mod.tdf
Whenever an advanced construction unit is built, it immediately is told to B_RULE, and so it always runs far far away to build a mohomine. B_RULE should have a distance limit for how far away it can tell something to build something, defined in the mod.tdf. If it can't build the mex within range, then it should just skip it and more on to the next B_RULE item, the power. If I want NTai to expand really far away, I can just manually tell it to build a cormex or a B_MEX.
There is also still a problem with construction units rushing towards the enemy and getting slaughtered. This should be an extremely easy fix, and will really help NTai.
I NEED B_GLOBAL BACK. B_RULE has NEVER built any advanced infrastructure. But with B_GLOBAL, I could tell the construction units to first build a mohomaker, then a cloakable fusion, then a few more mohomakers, and eventually a good economy.
The commander is always moving to the middle of the map to build a radar, losing valuable construction time. This is new, and very bad.
When anything is told to B_MEX, first it chooses the mex, and then it chooses the spot. It should be the other way around. But currently, it chooses a UW mex, and then runs off to the puddle of water.
And... that's all I can think of for now.
I *might* have an updated buildtree tonight, designed for the current NTai, not a fixed NTai.
Currently, NTai has a very strong early game. It sends swarms of level 1 units, and expands well. But the problems is that it keeps sending swarms of level 1 units, even when it should be teching up and sending level 2 units.
And so I would like a few more commands to ease the transition to level 2 infrastructure:
Late game, the level 1 factories have many many k-bots guarding them, but the level 2 factories have very few. This is because the level 2 factories haven't been around as long, accumulating guarders. So I would like a command to guard an advanced factory. The unit could decide which factories are advanced by metalcost, with the lind between basic and advanced defined in the mod.tdf
Whenever an advanced construction unit is built, it immediately is told to B_RULE, and so it always runs far far away to build a mohomine. B_RULE should have a distance limit for how far away it can tell something to build something, defined in the mod.tdf. If it can't build the mex within range, then it should just skip it and more on to the next B_RULE item, the power. If I want NTai to expand really far away, I can just manually tell it to build a cormex or a B_MEX.
There is also still a problem with construction units rushing towards the enemy and getting slaughtered. This should be an extremely easy fix, and will really help NTai.
I NEED B_GLOBAL BACK. B_RULE has NEVER built any advanced infrastructure. But with B_GLOBAL, I could tell the construction units to first build a mohomaker, then a cloakable fusion, then a few more mohomakers, and eventually a good economy.
The commander is always moving to the middle of the map to build a radar, losing valuable construction time. This is new, and very bad.
When anything is told to B_MEX, first it chooses the mex, and then it chooses the spot. It should be the other way around. But currently, it chooses a UW mex, and then runs off to the puddle of water.
And... that's all I can think of for now.
I *might* have an updated buildtree tonight, designed for the current NTai, not a fixed NTai.
Switching round the what i want to build then where I build it would go against the entire cosntruction system, it would require a rewrite of CManufacturer.
As for guard nearby advanced, i guess that can be done easily. Perhaps a priority queue with say a list of unitnames startign witht eh highest priority ARMALAB, ARMAVP, ARMASY, ARMSY, ARMVP, ARMLAB.
I have a solution as I've said before that will end up fixing the mex problem among other problems. aka Givign NTai awareness of the terrain, and its landmasses/seas/oceans/ponds, allowing for much more intelligent behaviours. Such as building seaplane platforms in ponds but only building shipyards in major water masses, not building kbots labs on a small island, and streamlinign the random move and points of interest things.
As for guard nearby advanced, i guess that can be done easily. Perhaps a priority queue with say a list of unitnames startign witht eh highest priority ARMALAB, ARMAVP, ARMASY, ARMSY, ARMVP, ARMLAB.
I have a solution as I've said before that will end up fixing the mex problem among other problems. aka Givign NTai awareness of the terrain, and its landmasses/seas/oceans/ponds, allowing for much more intelligent behaviours. Such as building seaplane platforms in ponds but only building shipyards in major water masses, not building kbots labs on a small island, and streamlinign the random move and points of interest things.
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hollowsoul
- Posts: 665
- Joined: 06 Jun 2006, 19:49
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Lindir The Green
- Posts: 815
- Joined: 04 May 2005, 15:09
Sounds good; I guess I'll wait for the fix instead of hacking my buildtree to work with the current version of NTai.AF wrote:As for guard nearby advanced, i guess that can be done easily. Perhaps a priority queue with say a list of unitnames startign witht eh highest priority ARMALAB, ARMAVP, ARMASY, ARMSY, ARMVP, ARMLAB.
I have a solution as I've said before that will end up fixing the mex problem among other problems. aka Givign NTai awareness of the terrain, and its landmasses/seas/oceans/ponds, allowing for much more intelligent behaviours. Such as building seaplane platforms in ponds but only building shipyards in major water masses, not building kbots labs on a small island, and streamlinign the random move and points of interest things.
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Lindir The Green
- Posts: 815
- Joined: 04 May 2005, 15:09
Ooh, I thought of something else. Something like B_GLOBAL, but it will ONLY move on to the 2nd item when the 1st item is done; any B_GLOBAL_AWESOME command will just repair the 1st item. And if the 1st item is blocked due to the anti-stalling algorithm, it will just try the 1st item again later when it recieves another B_GLOBAL_AWESOME command
It would be like B_GLOBAL, but better. Because it would fufill what I had in mind for B_GLOBAL much better.
Ooh, another thing. B_GUARD_UNIT_LIKE still doesn't work.
It would be like B_GLOBAL, but better. Because it would fufill what I had in mind for B_GLOBAL much better.
Ooh, another thing. B_GUARD_UNIT_LIKE still doesn't work.
Are you sure?
Doing a rcent test on NTai XE9RC19 I found that con untis didnt exhibit the behaviours you identified.
Instead they still rely more on repair commands and B_GUARDIAN comamnds more, whcih makes for a much nicer system imo, because they switch between factories and nearby defences and what not.
B_GLOBAL is an outdated idea and it wont be making a comeback in any hard defined way. If you want it you'll need to give me the rules allowing it to eb generated in realtime dynamically through B_RULE.
As for atatcking, I found a problemw here there're spikes int eh threat matrix around active factories, whcih I've sicn fixed.
The test showing this bgu was in a KAI v NTai on small supreme battlefield. NTai had the attack forces to win but they kept being pulled between factories and KAI forces, with around 60 or so units attacking KAI at any given time, a mixture of lvl 1 kbots, bombers, lvl 2 bots and the odd fighters.
Lindir, I think you should lower the threshold for not building lvl 1 further down to encourage new adv kbot factories. The attacker to con ratio is still to heavily weighted in favor of cons, and the command should guard the first factory within the first minute of it being finished...
I'll also look into B_GUARD_UNIT_LIKE, and I'm gonan fix interpolation not placing B_RULE_EXTREME inbetween the repairs in B_GUARDIAN.
Doing a rcent test on NTai XE9RC19 I found that con untis didnt exhibit the behaviours you identified.
Instead they still rely more on repair commands and B_GUARDIAN comamnds more, whcih makes for a much nicer system imo, because they switch between factories and nearby defences and what not.
B_GLOBAL is an outdated idea and it wont be making a comeback in any hard defined way. If you want it you'll need to give me the rules allowing it to eb generated in realtime dynamically through B_RULE.
As for atatcking, I found a problemw here there're spikes int eh threat matrix around active factories, whcih I've sicn fixed.
The test showing this bgu was in a KAI v NTai on small supreme battlefield. NTai had the attack forces to win but they kept being pulled between factories and KAI forces, with around 60 or so units attacking KAI at any given time, a mixture of lvl 1 kbots, bombers, lvl 2 bots and the odd fighters.
Lindir, I think you should lower the threshold for not building lvl 1 further down to encourage new adv kbot factories. The attacker to con ratio is still to heavily weighted in favor of cons, and the command should guard the first factory within the first minute of it being finished...
I'll also look into B_GUARD_UNIT_LIKE, and I'm gonan fix interpolation not placing B_RULE_EXTREME inbetween the repairs in B_GUARDIAN.
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Lindir The Green
- Posts: 815
- Joined: 04 May 2005, 15:09
sigh.
OK, I'll just tell you what I want NTai to do:
I want it to build advanced infrastructure. Currently, it doesn't have the resources to, and so it is stuck in an endless cycle, compounded by the construction units running off to the killzones looking for metal. If you don't believe my, test it on deltasiege, which has very well defined chokepoints and not too much metal.
I want some way to tell NTai to build a single moho mine, then a single cloakable fusion, even if doing so would cause some stall. I want NTai to tell its builders to help out with them, instead of just starting there own. But then I want NTai to later be able to build several at once, and so putting them in solobuild won't work.
I don't know what will work, besides my modified B_GLOBAL. B_RULE won't work because it, rightly, tells NTai to build mexes. The only problem is that the mexes are being built in killzones. Just putting it in the buildlists won't work, because then, if I had them antistalled, they would never be built, and if I didn't have them antistalled, they would all be built at once causing massive stall.
B_GLOBAL worked decently, but not as well as my modified B_GLOBAL would work.
Actually, how about a B_PRIORITY. B_PRIORITY would have a list in the mod.tdf, and it would build the 1st item on the list that it either hasn't built yet or that it has built but the thing that was built was destroyed. And, like my modified B_GLOBAL, it would keep trying to build that item until it is finished.
Would probably be difficult to code, but would be extremely useful in several mods.
Just something, anything to help NTai go advanced.
Because, in XTA, the swarms should be ENTIRELY lvl 2 by the 30 minute mark.
OK, I'll just tell you what I want NTai to do:
I want it to build advanced infrastructure. Currently, it doesn't have the resources to, and so it is stuck in an endless cycle, compounded by the construction units running off to the killzones looking for metal. If you don't believe my, test it on deltasiege, which has very well defined chokepoints and not too much metal.
I want some way to tell NTai to build a single moho mine, then a single cloakable fusion, even if doing so would cause some stall. I want NTai to tell its builders to help out with them, instead of just starting there own. But then I want NTai to later be able to build several at once, and so putting them in solobuild won't work.
I don't know what will work, besides my modified B_GLOBAL. B_RULE won't work because it, rightly, tells NTai to build mexes. The only problem is that the mexes are being built in killzones. Just putting it in the buildlists won't work, because then, if I had them antistalled, they would never be built, and if I didn't have them antistalled, they would all be built at once causing massive stall.
B_GLOBAL worked decently, but not as well as my modified B_GLOBAL would work.
Actually, how about a B_PRIORITY. B_PRIORITY would have a list in the mod.tdf, and it would build the 1st item on the list that it either hasn't built yet or that it has built but the thing that was built was destroyed. And, like my modified B_GLOBAL, it would keep trying to build that item until it is finished.
Would probably be difficult to code, but would be extremely useful in several mods.
Just something, anything to help NTai go advanced.
Because, in XTA, the swarms should be ENTIRELY lvl 2 by the 30 minute mark.
I'll lower the threshold, but I don't se any problem with the attacker to con ratio. It's about 5:1, but the attackers keep dying, se eventually it becomes closer to 1:1. But it seems to work, as the cons are mostly used to pump out huge amounts of attackers.AF wrote:Lindir, I think you should lower the threshold for not building lvl 1 further down to encourage new adv kbot factories. The attacker to con ratio is still to heavily weighted in favor of cons, and the command should guard the first factory within the first minute of it being finished...
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Lindir The Green
- Posts: 815
- Joined: 04 May 2005, 15:09
hmm...
How about a rule B_INFRA that will build either a mm or a power, depending on whether (metalIncome-metalOutput) > ((energyIncome-energyOutput) * K) where K is defined in the mod.tdf. And don't let it build a mex.
It would be useful for the switch to level 2 infrastructure. Which is what NTai currently stinks at.
How about a rule B_INFRA that will build either a mm or a power, depending on whether (metalIncome-metalOutput) > ((energyIncome-energyOutput) * K) where K is defined in the mod.tdf. And don't let it build a mex.
It would be useful for the switch to level 2 infrastructure. Which is what NTai currently stinks at.
hmm, that isnt encompassed by the B_RULE keyword, it'd have to be a seperate one.
btw RC19 has a lot fo threat amtrix handlign removed, aswell as groups and targettign as it was hindering NTai's performance. Instead now NTai performs better, and a lot of routines have now been remvoed, which makes for even less lag.
It also means NTai will form groups out fo consequential behaviour, and will be better at scaling itself and distributing attack units accordingly, aswell as actually putting them to work and preventign them from idling.
Also lindir I did a basic check on mexes now, if ther're enemy units with weapons near tota mex spot it's discarded during the search.
Also the radar tower emplacement routine has had its range dropped in accordance with something lindir said further up.
btw RC19 has a lot fo threat amtrix handlign removed, aswell as groups and targettign as it was hindering NTai's performance. Instead now NTai performs better, and a lot of routines have now been remvoed, which makes for even less lag.
It also means NTai will form groups out fo consequential behaviour, and will be better at scaling itself and distributing attack units accordingly, aswell as actually putting them to work and preventign them from idling.
Also lindir I did a basic check on mexes now, if ther're enemy units with weapons near tota mex spot it's discarded during the search.
Also the radar tower emplacement routine has had its range dropped in accordance with something lindir said further up.
http://ntai.from-hell.net/
I'd appreciate it if this all carried on in the comments on that page instead of in this thread
NTai XE9 RC19 See above link
I'd appreciate it if this all carried on in the comments on that page instead of in this thread
NTai XE9 RC19 See above link
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Lindir The Green
- Posts: 815
- Joined: 04 May 2005, 15:09