Final Frontier 1.18 (Website and first FF-map released)

Optimus Prime · Post by **Optimus Prime** » 27 Feb 2006, 15:21

like i said i m not at my real pc, so i cant change FF atm. I will do it when i m back at my home (hopefully tomorrow). I hope someone can tell me then what to do with the sounds...

Edit: I think i have found whta causes the soundproblem. The soundtrigger=1; tag is probably the reason. Without this tag the weapons sound should not be a constant sound (like a beamsound should be) but perhaps they fixed this in the new version by having automatical soundtrigger=1 when having a beamweapon. I will test with that a bit more when i m at home.

Optimus Prime · Post by **Optimus Prime** » 28 Feb 2006, 16:22

Ok i tested the soundtrigger=1 tag and this not the reason (or not only) for the soundproblems. I have atm really no idea what the problem reason is and so i need your help.
I dont believe that its the wav file and i compared the weapon fbi files of the annihilator and some of the laser weapons. The only difference between them are the soundtrigger=1 tag and the burnblow=1 tag, but i tested them without any result.
HELP or FF is not compatible with spring 70b

Edit: ok i was wrong - IT IS the soundfile. I gave the annihilator the sound of a defect laser and than the anni had no sound too). But i m not a soundspecialist, so what could be the reason and how can i fix it. I sure want the same sounds...

Edit2: Ok i can fix it :) Its hard and needs some time, but i just have to convert the files to another wav file with these settings: 44,100khz;16bit;Stereo 172KB/Sec

Optimus Prime · Post by **Optimus Prime** » 01 Mar 2006, 04:29

FINAL FRONTIER "The Next Generation Of War" 1.12

Change Log

========================================================
- Balance: Increased Damage of Energybombs +100
- Balance: Decreased Range of Titanweapons: Antimatter Lasers 1800 (2000) Rockets 2100 (2200)
- Balance: Changed the fury weapon to a guided projectile so it should hit more like its core version. Sadly this was only possible by giving the weapon a smoketrail
- Balance: Balanced Core and Arm Fighterweapons (Core were a bit to good in comparison to arm)
- Balance: Increased Damage of FlakTowers (lvl 2) vs Fighters 140 (120) and Decreased Reloadtime 0.42 (0.45), also increased HP +500
- Changed: New Models for Plasmashots and Ionshots (now they are 3d models)
- Changed: Decreased Metal Costs of Mega Fusion Reactor -2000 Metal
- Changed: Increased Metaloutput of Commanders 10 (8)
- Changed: Increased Metaloutput of lvl 1 Metal extractors 0.00167 (0.0013)
- Changed: Decreased Cost of lvl 1 Yards 600 metal (800)
- Changed: Decreased Energy Cost and Buildtime of Nanotowers (-2000 Energy, - 2000 Buildtime)
- Changed: Added dontland=1 tag to all gunships bigger than fighters.
- Changed: Decreased Acceleration and Breakrate of ODS to fix a bug with the dontland=1 tag.
- Fixed: Soundproblems with the new Springversion 70b1 are now fixed

XigXag · Post by **XigXag** » 01 Mar 2006, 04:45

Nemo wrote:Not really mistakes, just differences in how we think the game should be played. Optimus wants huge, epic battles that last for 10+ minutes with huge titan ships and whatnot, but little before that. I'd like a game where raiding and such IS possible, and big ships that DO fall to smaller ones.

Besides, we're all working on the Spring port of FF - I have no idea which style of play savant and his crew would have preferred.

I might do my own mod eventually, but my lack of modeling and scripting ability makes that difficult, so for now I'll tweak help test/tweak other mods.

That's all right Nemo, I didn't mean to get prickly. I'm actually curious about what your version is like, but I'm still awfully skeptical about the whole thing. I mean, is the idea to make it like Homeworld? I remember it only took like 20 fighters to kill a capital ship in that game. It seems like the massive investment of metal it takes to build big ships should be worth something at least. Otherwise there's no need to build anything but fighters.

I agree with OP, in my battles against AAI in various states of handicap, I can always win very quickly if I raid right at the beginning, but then there's never any need to build lvl 2, lvl 3, lvl 4.... Where it gets interesting is versus several teamed-up AIs, because then you can combine the early raiding with the big ship building for the cool fights and big beams. (Love those beams! hehe)

Optimus Prime · Post by **Optimus Prime** » 01 Mar 2006, 05:11

One game this evening i played a 3 vs 3 and one on the other team was saying that its still impossible to raid at start (it was about 7 mins after the start) and just in this moment i sent about 6 ironangels into his base which was completely undefended and i destroyed his whole economy. He was a hard techer and had at this time about 8 advanced mines which i all destroyed ^^. That was really funny.

XigXag you told me that you found a way to balance the arm and core lvl 1 defenses without adding smoketrails, but i tried that on my pc and i had a completely different result. By increasing weaponspeed (to 5000 or smaller) and decreasing accuracy (even to 0) of the arm projectiles, the weapon still dont hits the targets better than before. So i had to put guided projectiles which looks odd, but i wasnt able to find another good solution. If I would have increased the damage or decreased the reloadtime drasticaly the arm weapon would be much better in countering hordes.

XigXag · Post by **XigXag** » 01 Mar 2006, 07:34

Optimus Prime wrote:FINAL FRONTIER "The Next Generation Of War" 1.12

Just played my first game with the new version. Kickass!

The Furies are a LOT more effective now. The smoke looks a little weird, but not that bad. The main thing is that it kills things now :)

I like the new bullet graphics, for instance the new Warhawk bullet looks really cool.

Good job!

Optimus Prime · Post by **Optimus Prime** » 01 Mar 2006, 16:41

thnx!

Ok cause i think that with the newest version FF is nearly bugfree and good balanced i start with the third race. (i actually have no idea how to make it that you can select a third race...)

Edit: to not missunderstand me, i said i m working on the new race, i dont guarantee that the race will ever be finished cause there are a lot problems i see and i have to learn a lot on this. So perhaps my skill is not high enough to bringt the race really into the game.

IMSabbel · Post by **IMSabbel** » 01 Mar 2006, 20:05

Optimus Prime wrote:One game this evening i played a 3 vs 3 and one on the other team was saying that its still impossible to raid at start (it was about 7 mins after the start) and just in this moment i sent about 6 ironangels into his base which was completely undefended and i destroyed his whole economy. He was a hard techer and had at this time about 8 advanced mines which i all destroyed ^^. That was really funny.

I have the replay RIGHT here, and at the same time I was with 8 batteship hunters in YOUR base and killed YOUR advanced mexes... (also you lost in the end :) )

Nemo · Post by **Nemo** » 01 Mar 2006, 21:15

See, for me, 7 minutes into the start is a long time. Just as comparasion, you can have 5-6 flash tanks (or peewees, or AKs) on their way towards the enemy in AA or XTA after maybe 2-3 minutes.

The changes I've made have a similar effect - you can have a few light gunships or fighters up very quickly, but you risk not expanding enough by not building a con unit.

No, I'm not trying to turn this into AA in space, but I DO like the ability to attack effectively right away.

I'll update my version (I *just* added the dontland tag, myself. I figured everything would use it though *shrug*) and fix the bomber's weapon, test a bit, then post it up.

As for homeworld...well, I've never played it, so I don't know if I'm making it more like homeworld or not, but yes, big ships without fighter cover in my version die in one or two runs from 3-6 bombers, and can be killed by a number of fighters (although it takes a bit of time, unless you have 12 or so of them)

AF · Post by AF » 01 Mar 2006, 21:23

add Commander=1; to both unti fbis of the command cruisers, then I can remove the hardcoded fix I had to make in NTAI XE7 to make the command cruiser stop loading the builders buildtree isntead of the comamdners buildtree ahk

clericvash · Post by **clericvash** » 01 Mar 2006, 22:22

Nemo wrote:See, for me, 7 minutes into the start is a long time. Just as comparasion, you can have 5-6 flash tanks (or peewees, or AKs) on their way towards the enemy in AA or XTA after maybe 2-3 minutes.

This is a different mod, i wish people would stop trying to make mods match up to other mods.

I like this mod for its differences.

Good job!

Nemo · Post by **Nemo** » 01 Mar 2006, 22:49

Nemo wrote:
No, I'm not trying to turn this into AA in space, but I DO like the ability to attack effectively right away.

Read = win?

This mod is different, and I like that, but what I don't like is playing SimSpace for ~8 minutes before I can do anything effective.

XigXag · Post by **XigXag** » 01 Mar 2006, 23:50

Nemo wrote:See, for me, 7 minutes into the start is a long time ....
yes, big ships without fighter cover in my version die in one or two runs from 3-6 bombers, and can be killed by a number of fighters (although it takes a bit of time, unless you have 12 or so of them)

Holy attention deficit disorder, Batman!

I am reminded of my cousin Marvin. One time I took Marvin deer hunting. About 7 minutes into stalking a 10-point buck, Marvin suddenly screamed, "Screw this! I wanna KILL something!" Then he unloaded his clip in all directions, bagging two squirrels and a Douglas fir. (This is a lie. I have no cousin Marvin.)

Btw, if you can find Homeworld for cheap, it's pretty fun, but it gets old REAL fast. (And the missions suck. Asteroids.... ugh.)

Zoombie · Post by **Zoombie** » 02 Mar 2006, 00:57

Hey! I liked Homeworld!

It had a cool plot, cool battles. But some of the missions were really really really annoying...

Nemo · Post by **Nemo** » 02 Mar 2006, 02:35

XigXag wrote:
Nemo wrote:See, for me, 7 minutes into the start is a long time ....
yes, big ships without fighter cover in my version die in one or two runs from 3-6 bombers, and can be killed by a number of fighters (although it takes a bit of time, unless you have 12 or so of them)
Holy attention deficit disorder, Batman!

Heh, I suppose. Either that or I don't like sitting and queing resource structures for 7 minutes before I can do anything worthwhile <_<

Expect a version up for download sometime this weekend.

Optimus Prime · Post by **Optimus Prime** » 02 Mar 2006, 04:42

IMSabbel wrote:
Optimus Prime wrote:One game this evening i played a 3 vs 3 and one on the other team was saying that its still impossible to raid at start (it was about 7 mins after the start) and just in this moment i sent about 6 ironangels into his base which was completely undefended and i destroyed his whole economy. He was a hard techer and had at this time about 8 advanced mines which i all destroyed ^^. That was really funny.
I have the replay RIGHT here, and at the same time I was with 8 batteship hunters in YOUR base and killed YOUR advanced mexes... (also you lost in the end :) )

lol i have the replay too

1. you only destroyed me 2 adv mexes and some other mexes.. nothing important :D
2. you only could do so, because i didnt got any warning, else i would have killed your frigates with my commship
3. 8 battleships? Eh u sure we speak about the same game? (if so u must be a mage or cheater

actually there were 2 frigates when i noticed them in my base)

@Nemo: i really have no problem with some peace time at start. I hate games where all the time its calm, but strat games are different from 3d shooters where you have action right after the start. I really can live with the actual version, but if you need a sec faster FF just do it.

@AF: OK if that has no effect on the rest of the game, i sure can do that. But the next version will need some time (untill i find some real balance issues or bugs)

smokingwreckage · Post by **smokingwreckage** » 02 Mar 2006, 13:26

I like a game to be involving from the start. Being able to scout or run small skirmishes with other scout forces in the first 3 minutes is a great thing IMO. If not, then being able to build faster so I feel less like I set a queue and then wait for 2-3 minutes.

I don't mind spare time in a game like Rise of nations, where there is SO MUCH to do managing your economy, multiple bases, and resources and so on, but the start of FF, as much as I LOVE FF, can be tedious.

IMSabbel · Post by **IMSabbel** » 02 Mar 2006, 15:15

Optimus Prime wrote:
IMSabbel wrote:
Optimus Prime wrote:One game this evening i played a 3 vs 3 and one on the other team was saying that its still impossible to raid at start (it was about 7 mins after the start) and just in this moment i sent about 6 ironangels into his base which was completely undefended and i destroyed his whole economy. He was a hard techer and had at this time about 8 advanced mines which i all destroyed ^^. That was really funny.
I have the replay RIGHT here, and at the same time I was with 8 batteship hunters in YOUR base and killed YOUR advanced mexes... (also you lost in the end :) )
lol i have the replay too
1. you only destroyed me 2 adv mexes and some other mexes.. nothing important :D
2. you only could do so, because i didnt got any warning, else i would have killed your frigates with my commship
3. 8 battleships? Eh u sure we speak about the same game? (if so u must be a mage or cheater actually there were 2 frigates when i noticed them in my base)

1): 2 advanced mexes, 3 or 4 normal ones, plus 3 anti something towers
2): the same for you: I micromanaged them over your base and only discovered that you were killing back home when i saw them on the minimap. Or do you think i wouldnd have switched the nanotower to fighter production if i had noticed?
3): yes, there is a "battleship" in "battleship hunter". Just like there is a "butter" in "butterfly". Reading comprehension :)

Optimus Prime · Post by **Optimus Prime** » 02 Mar 2006, 16:27

but battleships are the BIG ones, i dont think that you had some right after the start

. BS = Broadside, Thunderlancer, and so on.

Yes that no warning syndrom sucks ^^

IMSabbel · Post by **IMSabbel** » 02 Mar 2006, 18:54

hm.
I never noticed the warnings... until they were gone.

And btw: why dont you get that "battleship hunters" are those fighters that are designated as "BATTLESHIP HUNTER" ingame?

Spring RTS Engine

Final Frontier 1.18 (Website and first FF-map released)