End game statistics

sparkyhodgo · Post by **sparkyhodgo** » 06 Mar 2005, 05:57

I know CC Generals had some great stats, as did Age of Empires 2. I also heard that Rise of Nations did a good job. Take a look at them for inspiration.

smokeynseinor · Post by **smokeynseinor** » 06 Mar 2005, 06:07

what about having a timeline graph with different colored lines resembling different stats, for example red might be your total kills while yellow may be your total metal produced etc etc and it could go along in 5 or 10 minute intervals so you can see how many kills you inflicted on your enemy and see how many you lost at one point in time

just an idea

[K.B.] Napalm Cobra · Post by **[K.B.] Napalm Cobra** » 06 Mar 2005, 07:00

Could we have stats saved as part of the recording? For aftermatch debates and such.

PauloMorfeo · Post by **PauloMorfeo** » 06 Mar 2005, 20:40

Alantai Firestar wrote:... if I wanted data analysis I would have gone somewhere else, keep it simple keep it easy ...

Dude,

PauloMorfeo wrote:First, if you don't want to see detailed stats, close the screen and go on with your life. That's no reason not to make detailed closing statistics.

Ofcourse the most important ones would be highlighted...
The minor ones could cascade from clicking the most important.

Also, i fancy very much data analysis!

AF · Post by AF » 06 Mar 2005, 21:15

I didnt say I didnt want to see stats, but I dont want to be searching for the stats I want through great lists

Benito · Post by **Benito** » 06 Mar 2005, 23:12

An overall score is a must, even if the overall score shows the loser having a higher score than the winner.

I love the idea of having mouse clicks recorded. This could also count as a negative against your overall score.

If you do have an overall score and you count both units lost and units built, make sure they have different weightings, otherwise the end result is just a score for the number of units that remained at the end of the game: 10*units lost + 10*units built = 10*units remaining, so. Obviously all the weightings would have to be balanced, but in this case the weightings have to be different to be meaningful.

aGorm · Post by **aGorm** » 07 Mar 2005, 13:40

Humm, Maybe there should be several tabs. Im thinking one for Military, One for Resorces, One For Tech Lvl. And A Genral Tab (which should be the one presented to you when you finsh)

Each Tab Would contain different things, so military would have units killed, units lost, units lost to friendly fire, and anything else that fits in this catagory... Same for the other 2 tabs. Each tab will give you a total score for that tab overall.
And then the genral tab will contain the totals, and a final total made from the sub totals.

Graphs could be toggled on and off on each tab perhaps?

aGorm

Warlord Zsinj · Post by **Warlord Zsinj** » 07 Mar 2005, 13:48

I reckon you should limit yourself to 6-8 values (or as much as you can fit in a player line in a screen without it becoming too crowded), much like TA. Once you've established a limitation like this, ask what the most important values are that should go in those 8 or so slots. Sifting through endless lines of battle reports doesn't sound like well-spent time regarding spring, but it'd be great to see some more useful information than what is currently offered by TA...

aGorm · Post by **aGorm** » 07 Mar 2005, 13:58

Ahh but thats where the tabs work, as you can just look at a few final scores and maybe the one tab that intrests you insted of siffting through a page of small fnot statistics. As thered be only a few stats a page they would be very easy to read... And the most important ones would be easy to get at. Depth should be there for those that want it (like me...) but it should not stop other people from just taking a casule glance.

aGorm

Dragon45 · Post by **Dragon45** » 09 Mar 2005, 04:06

I believe that you should have a basic dump of some of the major points of the game (resources, death, territory, etc) shown at the end of the game on a special "statistics" screen.

However, I would also like to offer an addition to this:

Why not just extract all the data you may possibly extract from a game (mouseclicks, number of corpses, territory, how long it lasted, deaths on each side, total units produced, number of each type of unit produced, etc) and
then dump it as an XML file somewhere? Anyone could then easily write some basic parser or something to crunch the data and display as however they wanted to display it. Might also lead to some interesting analysis of the data and offer some insight into future AI design like that.

Naturally, with all the data present, there might need to be an option in the skirmish screen itself that enables/disables the Mega-Dump, for example, in casual games where the parties didnt care to analyze what happened. Not to mention it might take a few computing resources, so enabling it as an option might cut down on the resources needed if only a basic game was wanted to be played.

Yet, the real-time aspect of this would be quite daunting, so it might even be better to have a program that crunches the data of the recording of the game not during the game itself, so that the recording and gameplay itself is normal, and any processor intensive task takes place afterwards- the data cruncher program would dump the information in XML format somewhere.

The plus side of this is that whenever a semi-competitive or competitive game would be played, especially between good players, you'd have people all ovre the place offering their own analysis of the data, etc etc. Would be very cool, and no other game to my knowledge has done it.

Doomweaver · Post by **Doomweaver** » 09 Mar 2005, 04:52

i think we shouldn't just count kills. but damage.
i.e. 8670 friendly fire damage
i.e. 5432454 total damage inflicted to enemies

jouninkomiko · Post by **jouninkomiko** » 09 Mar 2005, 04:59

I don't see why a nice, organized listing of statistics is something anyone wouldn't want. Besides, I doubt it'll be very difficult to incorporate a setting in your "profile" which enables which stats you want to see at the end of each game, or even save them to an xml for later viewing.

Gabba · Post by **Gabba** » 09 Mar 2005, 16:04

Alantai Firestar wrote:What about video replays for those of us who chose to video record our games?

This gives me an idea: if recording is turned on during the game, when the end-game screen comes up you will have the stats displayed as graphs or bars or whatever, but as background you will get replays of the most intense moments of the game (easy to determine: most kills/minute). And maybe, if you have a graph that shows the progression of score during the game, you can click at any point in time in the graph, and you can replay instantly that part of the game, to see what you/your adversaries were doing.

So, just a nice idea to think of, SJ... of course, if it doesn't delay the game's release!!!

aGorm · Post by **aGorm** » 09 Mar 2005, 20:55

Now that would put it way ahead of the compation! That would seriosly rule! Please make sure that gets into a releas at some point even if not the first! (hopefully not teh first we just want the game for teh first release...)

aGorm

PauloMorfeo · Post by **PauloMorfeo** » 09 Mar 2005, 22:33

In my last proposal, about fighting i proposed to give info about how much units destroyed and about metal destroyed.

But then i thought about units like planes. They cost little metal but cost alot of energy and take a very long time to build.
Probably, that should be taken into acount.

I'm thinking that maybe we could have:
- Amount of kills,
- Amount of Metal destroyed,
- Amount of Energy destroyed,
- Amount of Build-Time destroyed,
(just for beeing there. From these only the Number of kills would be considered important)
and
- Amount of value destroyed.

Each unit would have to be associated with a value (that could also be used for handing out XP to the enemy...). There are some ways of associating them a value:
- It would be defined in the unit description.
- It would be something like: Metal+(Energy/2)+(Build-Time/5)

Before getting scared at how many diferent informations would be presented, read my following post.

PauloMorfeo · Post by **PauloMorfeo** » 09 Mar 2005, 22:33

Just so my post don't get too lengthy and people will get less bored...

About organization of the end-game informations, it's very simple. I'm only proposing this example so no one gets scared as having too much numbers.

They can all be expandable info, that is, the screen could come like this:

- Players: ...... JohnyBravo .... TAUIP ..... LordSatan
- Resourcing ...... 139K ............ 12K ........ 2400
- Building ............ 1200 ............ 854 ........ 432
- Fighting ............ 3143 ........... 354 ........ 4312
- Orders ............. 5000 ........... 7321 ....... 25675
- Units Built

Supose you click in "Fighting", it would expande into:

- Players: ...... JohnyBravo .... TAUIP ..... LordSatan
- Resourcing ...... 139K ............ 12K ........ 2400
- Building ............ 1200 ............ 854 ........ 432
- Fighting ............ 3143 ........... 354 ........ 4312
- ....Units destroyed 412 ......... 325 ......... 532
- ....Value destroyed 5213 ....... 53232 ..... 54232
- ....Units lost ........... 342 ......... 423 ........ 564
- ....Value Lost ....... 3542 ........ 4322 ....... 523
- Orders ............. 5000 ........... 7321 ....... 25675
- Units Built

Clicking in, for example, Units destroyed or Value Destroyed:

- Players: ...... JohnyBravo .... TAUIP ..... LordSatan
- Resourcing ...... 139K ............ 12K ........ 2400
- Building ............ 1200 ............ 854 ........ 432
- Fighting ............ 3143 ........... 354 ........ 4312
- ....Units destroyed 412 ......... 325 ......... 532
- ....Value destroyed 5213 ....... 53232 ..... 54232
- ........Fighters destroyed
- ........Buildings destroyed
- ........Factories destroyed
- ....Units lost ........... 342 ......... 423 ........ 564
- ....Value Lost ....... 3542 ........ 4322 ....... 523
- Orders ............. 5000 ........... 7321 ....... 25675
- Units Built

or

- Players: ...... JohnyBravo .... TAUIP ..... LordSatan
- Resourcing ...... 139K ............ 12K ........ 2400
- Building ............ 1200 ............ 854 ........ 432
- Fighting ............ 3143 ........... 354 ........ 4312
- ....Units destroyed 412 ......... 325 ......... 532
- ....Value destroyed 5213 ....... 53232 ..... 54232
- ........Metal destroyed
- ........Energy destroyed
- ........Build-time destroyed
- ....Units lost ........... 342 ......... 423 ........ 564
- ....Value Lost ....... 3542 ........ 4322 ....... 523
- Orders ............. 5000 ........... 7321 ....... 25675
- Units Built

And so on. Just a matter of deciding on how to organize info.

AF · Post by AF » 09 Mar 2005, 22:52

Whoa that took you ages to see my idea and pounce! How about a scoreboard? See how you compared to other players in other games on similair maps? Perhaps use ti as a scorign system to keep track of the best player through rankings based one xperienced based on the end game stats? It could be used for other things such as which mod is the most popular and wether arm wins the most or core

aGorm · Post by **aGorm** » 09 Mar 2005, 23:19

Thansk PauloMorfeo exactly what i wanted to say but didn't have time to as i was at work... Expandablity is the key so you see what you want, but not everything you dont. And it would be easy to add graphs into that...

aGorm

zwzsg · Post by **zwzsg** » 11 Mar 2005, 17:09

I still say that results would be more meaningfull if they were graphs, instead of final values.

Warlord Zsinj · Post by **Warlord Zsinj** » 13 Mar 2005, 08:41

I agree to an extent with zwzsg. Graphs are very good at showing data very easily, and I'd love to see them. I wouldn't want them to take up much of your time when it could be used for other purposes...

Spring RTS Engine

End game statistics