XTA future

[manolo_]

then u also have to change the flea its more op than the lvl1 scout (okay its lvl2, but its fast,...)

[AF]

In the vast majority of RTS games, the scout unit is cheap and can be blown up very quickly. But scouts are also very fast. Their lifetime is proportional to the micro skill of the player.

What we have here are scouts that do not die fast, as such the advantage of micro-ing them is blown massively out of proportion, and the ability to defend is dramatically reduced. Investing in a wall of llts like BA isn't workable here, nor is spamming a tonne of units and spreading them out

[scifi]

And the hp/dps ratio makes it so that your own scouts cant kill enemy scouts before they kill your cons or winds... you have to defend from fast units with slow units, you cant spread your units thin at all or you will get raped.

this is a part of the game that i actualy like

why? its crap

Lets play XTA on a good sized map and see if you still like it?

im not saying i disagree in reducing scout hp im ok with that, but i love the way theres no scouts defending from scouts.

Also i play with scouts in comet catcher and red comet, sizable enough for ya, and i like the way xta 1v1 is played there

I can agree that scouts could have less HP and be more spamable, cheaper since theyr cost almost equals one of a flash.

But i want them to keep theyr speed and DPS.


Also dts around mexes protect v scouts

[pintle]

Aks own scouts.

Lol at AF calling himself a pro player.

Lol at Johannes talking like he is pro at XTA.

Lol at com morph breaking XTA.

Lol at emg fx and how it broke balance.

Lol at flash hit box.

Lol at amphib lab/kamikaze spam/minelayer sub broken hp.

Nobody even complained about missile wobble in this thread? (try playing on titan duel?)

The biggest thing that killed XTA, other than the repeated balance "tweaks" and untested units, is players insisting on playing the same 4 tiny maps, being terrified of large maps, and nobody playing 1v1 to a decent standard.

To fix xta:
- unfuck the particle fx/frame rate.
- balance coms
- fix t1 sub pen (sooooooo broken)
- up cost of aa hover/ decrease cost of hover tank/ nerf nixer/wombat (or buff merl/diplomat)
- deal with mines in some way the community approves (I think they were fine apart from op clearer bot, biggest problem by FAR with mines is missile wobble, and all the QQ nubs didnt even notice that...)

I lost interest in playing XTA "well" when the game got broken, and all the good players left. I lost interest in playing it for fun, when the game became more full of nub fail and random com dgun etc than actual RTS.

Shame, I gave 5 years of my life to it, and it has basically been ruined in my eyes.

[babbles]

From Shift:

a) need AHs back

b) people that play XTA a lot (ie, me and him) are taking a break atm

c) saying XTA is failing creates a snowball effect

people see thread --> see it failing --> don't play -- more fail

[pintle]

XTA has been in freefall for over 12 months. I spent a long time consciously not publicly calling it fail, precisely because of the slippery slope effect of threads like these, but really XTA needs to change significantly in order to capture (and keep) the interest of any players, let alone competent, or even skilled ones.

Just to be completely blunt: Dgun and live completely breaks any semblance of a strategy game, and makes the whole thing a total joke.

[JohannesH]

Lol at Johannes talking like he is pro at XTA.


players insisting on playing the same 4 tiny maps, being terrified of large maps, and nobody playing 1v1 to a decent standard.

Honestly I don't have a real clue how to play XTA well, but as you said - nobody else does either, if it's a game that's not ridiculously comm centered.

So as far as I see my view of things is still quite accurate compared to majority of XTA players. And I only talk of the most blatantly obvious things I see.

[pintle]

Lol at Johannes talking like he is pro at XTA.


players insisting on playing the same 4 tiny maps, being terrified of large maps, and nobody playing 1v1 to a decent standard.

Honestly I don't have a real clue how to play XTA well, but as you said - nobody else does either, if it's a game that's not ridiculously comm centered.

So as far as I see my view of things is still quite accurate compared to majority of XTA players. And I only talk of the most blatantly obvious things I see.

Tbh mate I was just flamebaiting, you are a good overall player

[==Troy==]

Tbh, one of the options that XTA community has, is to completely re-vamp XTA and brand it as a new mod. Considering that most of the TA models were re-modelled and hence the IP fuckup is no longer a problem, making a standalone XTA release would also bring a lot of new players.

Simple balance tweaks and complaining that XTA became a noobtown/etc arent going to get you anywhere. especially while BA is such a noobmagnet, most of the other mods get BA vets who are tired with BA.

[scifi]

http://springrts.com/phpbb/viewtopic.ph ... 1&start=80
Ive recovered this post
1v0ry_k1ng

Posted: 11 Dec 2006, 22:24

actually, XTA is damn well near perfectly balanced now. you might want to say, actually play it properly, before judging it. there is no OP unit and only 3-4 underP units.

and XTA early game was horrific in the 7.0 days.. zippers abound.
but 8.1 is really good.. no more missle spam, no more zipper rush.
its pretty freindly early game, the main reason its difficult is that
everyone who plays it is a vet so for noobs its a hard start.


WTF hapened

[babbles]

Oh God Scifi, what have you done.

[scifi]

Oh God Scifi, what have you done.

Its just that people still say always the same things as years ago, i mean i like AA spam to some extent and zipper rush but i seriously dont recall an XTA version that was so perfect o_o

makes me want to try and see whats diferent

[Noruas]

I know that XTA sea was near perfect back then....... There is alot of things need to be done and I am honestly tired of modding Xta.

[JohannesH]

http://springrts.com/phpbb/viewtopic.ph ... 1&start=80
Ive recovered this post
1v0ry_k1ng

Posted: 11 Dec 2006, 22:24

actually, XTA is damn well near perfectly balanced now. you might want to say, actually play it properly, before judging it. there is no OP unit and only 3-4 underP units.

and XTA early game was horrific in the 7.0 days.. zippers abound.
but 8.1 is really good.. no more missle spam, no more zipper rush.
its pretty freindly early game, the main reason its difficult is that
everyone who plays it is a vet so for noobs its a hard start.


WTF hapened

Well... Of course anything can be considered balanced.

Only empirical data you can get is considering balance of arm vs core on a specific map (& that's pretty unconclusive too most time). Beyond that, its all just opinions on what makes a game fun.

[AF]

i kicked your arse pintle plenty of times =]

[scifi]

I know that XTA sea was near perfect back then....... There is alot of things need to be done and I am honestly tired of modding Xta.

Me and some other people gladly ofered to help

ofc talking for myself here i have other things to do but i can help in any form i may know, raar and some other dude also offered asistance

If you want assitance in any form i think we can provide it

PS: not trying to take your place, you are important to the mod DONT LEAVE!

so i dunno what your plan is, but im available.

[AF]

I dont think he wants you to help him make a new release.

What he wants is for somebody else to do the release for once

[raaar]

I know Deadnight warrior has been doing stuff and so has raar.
If Noruas doesn't want to work on it any more than decide what are the popular demands for change and i am sure we can work something out and release a "bugfix" version.

What i actually did was tweak the scripts for one or two dozen units, mostly walk animations, fark legs. But i stopped there.

Then Noruas put that together with the stuff he and Deadnight did, i suppose.

What i wanted to do was to rework xta gameplay (what i really wanted was to port the "mod" i made for ota to spring format using xta as a base). But, being relatively inexperienced, i threw my ideas about general gameplay around first to get what ppl thought, and they didn't get support.

I also have a job and other stuff to do, like most of you probably do, and know projects like these take lots of time and ultimately fail, so i've been really hesitant to get involved.

I think there's also something wrong with segregating a small community like this in several flavors of improved ota. If you play ba, xta, sa, and the other one that is suppose to immitate ota, the relative strengths and weaknesses of stuff get messed up inside your head. Adding one more mod may add to the confusion.

I think the problems with xta (and other *a mods) start with the commander:

1 - Offensive com-bombing. I think that's the rational outcome of having that huge explosion, plus cloak, plus being able to be air-lifted, and not making much difference in resources and build-power except in the early game(doesn't matter if you bring the enemy com down with you). Blame the game, not the player .

2- Commanders are also too hard counters to clusters of short ranged warrior units, but suck against long ranged ones (not to mention air and sea), hurting variety (probably why people mass missile units in games with many commanders running around).

So, even if you remove dgunning and living, you keep those two problems, and problem 1 will probably get worse.

Imo, the way to go:
- give dgun a big cooldown (30 s?)
- give coms a med range med dps weapon (425 range 100 dps or something like that, would improve with morph)
- give coms an underwater weapon and make them move faster underwater (they become too slow).
- tweak down the death and self d blasts to that of a roach or even less.

[scifi]

Well Raar those ideas arent that bad at all

but i think it really needs testing in order to actualy see if it works.

Im not gona say, dont touch it fails, im open to sugestions, but you must recall that xta gameplay evolves on the com being strong and an active player in the battlefield. Still i wouldnt mind that being done.

Also what mod is that you made for TA^^, id like to see it
Also if your interested i have a project going with some other people(around a year), its kinda halted but i can direct you to the website and all. No previous modding skills required we need everything, people who can criticise, give ideas e.t.c.. pm me if your interested here or in the lobby.

[AF]

I think aside from dgun cooldown that would actually make commanders worse.

There is already a huge stigma amongst XTA players against com bombing. The idea behind a big blast is that if your com goes, so does a sizeable portion of your force/base.

The problem comes when 99% of players send their commanders to the front and push too hard, taking half their force and the enemies defensive line when they go boom.

The most effective way of fixing this it would seem is to make the commander slower, or increase the incentive to guard and protect.

Commander upgrades as well should be economic in nature, they already have a huge arsenal compared to any other unit. Make their cloak cheaper or bigger storage or build power, longer radar etc, not bigger weapons, faster walk or more armour/health