What about a Starcraft mod?

[Argh]

Actually, it's fair to say that Dawn of War is a lot like StarCraft, only with more factions, more unit types per faction, messy counters and no peons. Combat's actually really similar (under the hood)- stuff doesn't actually obey LOS or terrain, etc.

The economy is practically the same, minus peons, you even run out of resources (eventually). But you have about the same system of econ upgrades and unit upgrades. Game-design-wise, it's really not a lot different, there are more spells in DoW, and their armor system is a totally different animal, but it's broadly similar.

[SinbadEV]

I think DoW can be forgiven a few borrowed ideas seeing as Blizzard stole their Space Marines,Tiranids (with a hind of Chaos), and Eldar raced for their game... The didn't even bother renaming some of the units they stole...

[Argh]

Yeah, I think turnabout's fair play. They continued that tit-for-tat with DoW II using WC III's hero system pretty nearly verbatim, and SC II really looks to be WC III in space, with a pretty massive graphics update.

[JohannesH]

Lol Starcraft and DoW are nothing alike in almost any meaningful respect

[1v0ry_k1ng]

FOR THE EMPEROR

FOR AIUR

[Argh]

Lol Starcraft and DoW are nothing alike in almost any meaningful respect

They both feature a net-drain economy.
They both feature unit upgrades that are major features of the tech curve.
They both feature spells, as opposed to simulation, as a way to deepen the gameplay.
They both largely ignore terrain, and use instant-hit weapons.
They both use an armor system designed for very specific balance.
They both have simple LOS systems.
They both have areas of the maps that are totally off-limits.
They both have aircraft that are just normal units with a few extra rules.
They both have a pop cap.
They both emphasize micro over macro.
They both have factories with absolute limits on queues.
They both have pay-now systems for buying units, buildings, and upgrades.
They both have a lack of automation, by design- even basics like patrol.

TBH, I think that's a lot in common. Take away DoW's squad system, which was its major innovative feature (taken from Kohan II), de-emphasize the heroes, and DoW looks a lot like StarCraft, it just has more units and spells.

[JohannesH]

Yes, most of that is true (probably everything except SC having a micro>macro focus and largely ignoring terrain, I dont know so much about DoW and dont understand the patrol comment) but they play totally different anyway. You can find alot of similarities between any 2 RTS's you know.

Clearest difference is the economy, DoW is ways off of any traditional RTS like Starcraft because of the simplified econ. Micro in it is also very different from SC due to the squads (different control and frontline reinforcement) and high hp:dmg output ratio, which make it together with the necessarity of map control near-constant fighting.

[Das Bruce]

They both feature a net-drain economy.
They both feature unit upgrades that are major features of the tech curve.
They both feature spells, as opposed to simulation, as a way to deepen the gameplay.
They both largely ignore terrain, and use instant-hit weapons.
They both use an armor system designed for very specific balance.
They both have simple LOS systems.
*snip
They both have aircraft that are just normal units with a few extra rules.
They both have a pop cap.
They both emphasize micro over macro.
They both have factories with absolute limits on queues.
They both have pay-now systems for buying units, buildings, and upgrades.
*snip*

All those seem fairly prevalent in the RTS genre.

[smoth]

FOR THE EMPEROR

lrn 2 40k also funny enough chaos space marines use that and not regular spaec marins

[dizekat]

Hi, you have just come into our forum and broken like 10 taboos in about 6 lines, automatically marking yourself as a lazy inarticulate noob. Congratulations, if you ever want anyone here to respect you, you've now made it much more difficult for yourself.

Just to point out your mistakes:

- Post is effectively a single run-on sentence.
- By writing "The title is self explanatory..." you imply that the rest of the forum is populated by morons.
- Also with "The title is self explanatory...", you skip the process of relating which parts of StarCraft you would like to translate into your game, leaving us to assume you actually mean "Make StarCraft for the Spring Engine"... which, as ha been mentioned, would get you sued back to the stone-age.
- Again, with "The title is self explanatory...", you basically provide ZERO effort whatsoever, and round these parts if your intro post doesn't contain an exhaustive design document we just assume you are a lazy fanboi who is basically begging someone else to do all the work for you. You enhance this image with the "I can't program" line which shows us you don't want to put in the needed effort to LEARN the skills needed to build a game for the Spring engine.
- You called it a StarCraft Mod when the more correct terminology is "Game".
- Again with "...please, try to recreate..." you are basically begging someone to do all the work for you.
- Also with "Im not a programmer" you show your lack of knowledge of game development, effectively trivializing the contributions of modelers and texture artists.

Now, I'm sure at least some of these assumptions are inaccurate and are just the result of you failing to articulate yourself effectively... but if you're not willing to design the game, texture, model or script units... go play BA on DSD with the rest of the noobs.

Hey, don't assault the newbie with a wall of text!

Why, he's not going to read it anyway... and it's a lot better then what I wanted to say... not that I should talk... I haven't made anything close to a Spring Game since the Chess mod... and then when Lua came around that would have allowed me to make it actually work with arbitration and stuff I just chickened out and meanwhile I have posted like 500 "I have this great idea for a Game, please make it for me" posts my self... but I've never claimed not to be hypocritical.

A wall of text is not enough for a successful assault on a newbie. Need a pyramid of text.

[KaiserJ]

this forum doesnt seem to support pyramids of text

[Lolsquad_Steven]

They both emphasize micro over macro.

lol

[Regret]

They both have areas of the maps that are totally off-limits.

Wrong. Air units can go anywhere in Starcraft.

They both have a lack of automation, by design- even basics like patrol.

Wrong. Starcraft has patrol, attack move and follow unit. Even order queuing similar to that of spring, if that counts as automation (hold shift and give several orders).

[Argh]

That pathetic two-point patrol resembles a proper Patrol command in no way that matters. It was worse than useless 90% of the time.

Seriously, a "patrol" is either as good as OTA's or better, or it just doesn't count, in my book. It's one of many features that set it apart at the time vs. SC.

And shift-click... uh... so, can you shift-click five movement points, with an attack-move at the end? It's been quite some time since I've played any SC, and I never bought Brood Wars, but IIRC, you couldn't do anything like that- you sent one order, period, and the only place where shift-click seemed to work was with builders... kinda.

[CarRepairer]

but IIRC, you couldn't do anything like that- you sent one order, period, and the only place where shift-click seemed to work was with builders... kinda.

You recall wrong. But I'm guilty too. I played a few measly games of TA back in the day and I didn't know at that time that TA had any command queuing.

And Starcraft's patrol wasn't that useless.

[momfreeek]

sc is chocolate
ta is steak

[yuritch]

SC had attack-move order that wasn't in TA afaik. Shift-clicking worked, but not with all orders (afaik it's not possible to que multiple buildings in SC, and some special abilities like tank siege mode are also not que-able). Factory rally points can only have 1 order as well, and that's always a move order to a fixed location (so no patrols for all the newly built units, no auto-harvesting for workers, etc.).

Most of those features were added in WC3 however, so SC2 is likely to have them.

[Regret]

That pathetic two-point patrol resembles a proper Patrol command in no way that matters. It was worse than useless 90% of the time.

Pathetic is that you keep talking bullshit about subjects you know very little about.

[smoth]

Who cares if argh is full of shit or not, we all know he likes to bs about stuff. I have gotten to the point that I really see it as silly to try and callhim on it because he doesn't care. I mean really beyond correcting him to save the noobs trouble we should just leave the guy alone. He means well(I think).


In the end there is still no reason to produce a Starcraft project, starcraft has an eminent sequal and already exists. I can understand wanting to see something like a port of your fave rts but really they all had sequals. Can this stupid thread get a lock?