Skirmish AI: E323AI 3.22.4

[Master-Athmos]

Ok - not sure if it's because of the latest executables but when putting two AIs on Comet Catcher Redux the upper right one has severe problems...

In MA:


In XTA (here it actually gave move south a bit orders for quite a while that got extended before having reached the destination until near that mex spot):


Southern one seems to behave fine (it builds mexes on the respective spots just fine and pretty much does a good job as you can see on radar)...

[Error323]

Hmmm that is strange indeed. I can duplicate the behaviour, gonna look into it. Thanks!

[FaerieWithBoots]

I have watched a couple of games of this AI now. Here is what i have noticed so far. (you probably are aware of those points, but ill still point them out in case you havent )

The games where on cometcatcher and altair crossing playing e323 vs RAI, vs two RAIs and vs me. Using XTA 9.585

- Commander doesnt use the D-gun, it ignores any attacks on its commander.

- AI makes very long buildques in its factorys, this isnt necisary for an AI i think.

- It doesnt build storms, (did the AI decide they arent cost efficient?)

- Economy works well at the start, but later on it goes nuts on T1 eco and still E-stalls (but continues to build MM & MMM)

- It sticks to only one lvl1 lab, but spams lvl2 labs. *1

- Most combat units are idleing in its base. Especially in the late game.

- Attackgroups are too small i think. During the first 10 minutes the size is perfect, but later on 4-8 units arent going to achieve much. *2

- Attack groups seem to ignore some threats. *3

- Units try to move on wreckages *4

- The groupmove widget that you added seems to cause some troubles if the group is moving through a small passage.

- It builds too much scouts. Keeping a scout on the wishlist all the time is good, but now it seems to spam zippers out of T2 labs.

- Con bots dont exit the lab if they want to build something next to the lab. Theyll block the lab.

- (this has been noted before) You can only have one E323 ai. The second will act strange.

*1) Maybe you should add a limit to the number of conbots that can assist a factory to prevent pathfinding troubles. Add support for nano turrets and make them when that point is reached?

*2) Perhaps it is possible to make the attack size of an army dependant on the economy and game time? or even take into account the army/eco size of the opponent.

*3)E.g. if there is a solar next to a LLT the units will shoot at the solar and ignore the turret while they could take it out and kill the solar afterwards.

*4) This makes the pathfinding go crazy and makes the unit useless. It gets worse when they are part of an attack group moving together. The entire group seems to get lost and change direction so often they cant shoot anymore.


Note about the mod (XTA)
This raiding thingie works pretty well with XTA, in other mods (ie BA) this will be a lot harder since its scout units cant take that much damage. Units in general are weaker, making it less likely to reach a mex or windgen.


The good things:
Your concept of a continuesly raiding AI works perfectly! I think this AI is very strong in the early game. Some humans may have trouble living through the first 15 minutes of E323.
Expansion works nicely too. Not as quick as the other AI but it makes up for that with its intensive raiding.
Really laughed at the first time i saw it spamming 10 peewees and overrunning RAI. Good job!

I am looking forward too new versions of E323

[elias79]

How do i install this AI ?

[FaerieWithBoots]

i just downloaded the file in the first post. Put it into the spring\AI\skirmish directory and it works

[Error323]

Hey FaerieWithBoots,

Thanks for your extensive feedback! I've created a TODO list in the git repo where most of the issues you've announced reside :).I'll be working on the bugs first.

The git repo already has some new features like unitcategorization parsing. It now works much better in BA using the BA config which can also be found in the git repo.

[HeavyLancer]

I've been testing this AI out, mainly in 1v1s on Comet Catcher. Most matches are against RAI (Which I consider the gold standard of AIs atm).
My thoughts:

• Using XTA this AI clearly wins with it's raiding activity, but it is still rather uncreative because it only builds kbots, where as RAI builds vehs and air.
• Using BA v7.00 E323AI only builds jethros and fleas as arm, until it hits T2, where it builds only archangels. This is a severe problem. It could be fixed with some config changes though.
  Would you care to elaborate on how the config system works so that people can make suitable ones for OTA-like mods?
• This AI has some great features, in particular it's raiding and econ. Excellent job there!
• It still needs some defensive capabilities though. If you want to have a truly competent AI that can mimic good player behaviour then skipping static defenses and going for defense in depth groups could be a real winner. Perhaps you could implement a system where it builds unit groups, and then allocates them roles? Roles would be scout, attack, defense for this sort of set up.

Thanks for creating such a great AI, it has huge potential with improvements.

[Error323]

UPDATE v2.54 Wed Aug 26 00:49:40 CEST 2009
Version 2.54 (Ultralisk) is out, changelog:

• Economy refactor
• Categorization configs
• More intelligent military unit selection
• Bugfixes

E323AI SO/DLL: E323AI-Ultralisk-v2.54
E323AI SRC: E323AI@github

The config files (included in the tgz) should be in:

Code: Select all

AI/Skirmish/E323AI/2.54/configs

Feel free to update them, especially the BA config file. And if it performs better, upload the file or mail me please!

Thanks for all your feedback so far!!!

[Error323]

Oh damn, I've experienced some massive flaws in the latest version. Some segfaults even using the config file. Back to the drawing boards -_- I suggest picking a previous version for playing. (Unless you wanna help debugging).

[Agon]

Oh, I just added the 2.54 release to the rpm build process...

[Error323]

Crap, sorry I'll work them out now.

[Umrug]

Hello!
Played a few test games (about using BA 7.0 vs me and RAI. Maps: crossing4final, small divide, darkside, barren.

Was nicely surprised by flea coming to my mex so early :)

Good things:
1. Amazing degree of maturity for such a new AI
2. Nice micro of units, (with many exceptions)
3. On macro scale, not bad econ

Bad things (in order of importance):
1. As ARM, always starts bots and builds only 3 kinds of units: flea, jethro, conbot. Putting unitcategory SEA instead of LAND didnt solve the problem. Its easy to see that nothing can win the battle with only those 3 units.
1.1. As CORE, same thing, but AK can actually be useful, so it can give RAI a hard day (kinda)
1.2. The only time it reached t2 it built only t2 conbots and manticore (aa), so no way of winning even in t2.

2. Some real bad thing here - don't know how you missed it. Typical buildorder: bot lab, flea, con, winds (estalls while building first wind in parallel with con but whatever), now: builds 2nd con, runs out of m, starts twilight (expensive, useless cloaking mex - see the suggestions), and m-stalls for about 4 minutes (crucial early-game) while struggling to finish this mex in parallel with con. There are several ways to solve this, and IMO before you solve this, your AI will not be competitive. I'll be happy to discuss possible solutions.

3. If the enemy has llt - disregard it, just rush fleas next to it, repeat. So if enemy has about 2 llts on the map, EAI is as good as dead.

4. Nice thing there with building of storages on demand - perhaps consider making converters (metal makers) at some point instead of storages? Typically ends up with lotsa storages.

5. Minor - when (using "choose before game" startpositions) EAI's com was trapped inside a feature, the PC was slowed down to a degree that I could hardly quit the game. Curious detail - the "B" info screen ingame doesn't seem to reflect EAIs CPU usage.

Suggestions:
- Its exciting to make configs for AI (*looks sadly at stillborn NTAI*), can you add DONTBUILD unitcategory to config? Trust me it'll be useful.

Also, you deserve a cookie.

[Error323]

Hi Umrug,

Thanks for your reply, I'll give you some feedback here:

Good things:
1. Amazing degree of maturity for such a new AI
2. Nice micro of units, (with many exceptions)
3. On macro scale, not bad econ

thank you :)

Bad things (in order of importance):
1. As ARM, always starts bots and builds only 3 kinds of units: flea, jethro, conbot. Putting unitcategory SEA instead of LAND didnt solve the problem. Its easy to see that nothing can win the battle with only those 3 units.
1.1. As CORE, same thing, but AK can actually be useful, so it can give RAI a hard day (kinda)
1.2. The only time it reached t2 it built only t2 conbots and manticore (aa), so no way of winning even in t2.

This is solved through configuration files, if you look into your personal springdir under AI/Skirmish/E323AI/2.54/configs you will find the categorizations, I've provided a categorization for BA 6.95, it will need updates. IF no categorization config is found it will create one which is fine-tuned to XTA thats why the above happens.

2. Some real bad thing here - don't know how you missed it. Typical buildorder: bot lab, flea, con, winds (estalls while building first wind in parallel with con but whatever), now: builds 2nd con, runs out of m, starts twilight (expensive, useless cloaking mex - see the suggestions), and m-stalls for about 4 minutes (crucial early-game) while struggling to finish this mex in parallel with con. There are several ways to solve this, and IMO before you solve this, your AI will not be competitive. I'll be happy to discuss possible solutions.

I'm EXTREMELY aware of this indeed and am fixing this with highest priority, thanks. I've been messing too much with the eco, it used to be better. I release too fast >_<

3. If the enemy has llt - disregard it, just rush fleas next to it, repeat. So if enemy has about 2 llts on the map, EAI is as good as dead.

This is a more complex problem that will be solved in the near future, the non-scouting army should be able to deal with this sort of.

4. Nice thing there with building of storages on demand - perhaps consider making converters (metal makers) at some point instead of storages? Typically ends up with lotsa storages.

Converters are build already when mexes are no longer an option

5. Minor - when (using "choose before game" startpositions) EAI's com was trapped inside a feature, the PC was slowed down to a degree that I could hardly quit the game. Curious detail - the "B" info screen ingame doesn't seem to reflect EAIs CPU usage.

Suggestions:
- Its exciting to make configs for AI (*looks sadly at stillborn NTAI*), can you add DONTBUILD unitcategory to config? Trust me it'll be useful.

That is a very good idea!!

Also, you deserve a cookie.

Yummie

[hoijui]

what License does this AI use, or what are we allowed to do with it/it's code?

[Error323]

what License does this AI use, or what are we allowed to do with it/it's code?

Well I guess it will be under the same license as spring itself GPLv2. Aslong as you improve it or learn from it and give credit where credit is due then I'm happy :).

[Error323]

UPDATE v2.81 Fri Aug 28 13:12:36 CEST 2009
Version 2.81 (Ultralisk) is out, changelog:

• Better eco predictions
• Better target selection
• Multiple instances of E323AI can now be created
• Several bugfixes

E323AI SO/DLL: E323AI-Ultralisk-v2.81
E323AI SRC: E323AI@github

IMPORTANT!!!!!!! The config files (included in the tgz) should be in:

Code: Select all

$SPRINGDIR/AI/Skirmish/E323AI/2.81/configs/

It really kicks ass now

[xyz]

hi,
For me the latest version of this AI is no longer showing in the AI list (tried with 80.0 and also with the latest git). I am using springlobby, and I also tried going directly into the game and selecting the script. It used to work with the other versions.

[Griffith]

AIOptions and AIInfo are in C:\Program Files\Spring\AI\Skirmish\E323AI\2.81\data in the version 2.81.

I put them in C:\Program Files\Spring\AI\Skirmish\E323AI\2.81 like it was in 2.54 and it works

Very good AI, nice work Error323

[Umrug]

xyz - you have to copy .lua files from "2.81\data" folder to "281\" folder so lobby can see them


I can't f@#$ing believe that. It currently plays better then 1/2 of silver star players imo. I'm stunned. You didn't just solve economy problem, you solved it in a way that gives AI advantage over human players!!! (I'm talking about wait commands to assisting com)


Tested on 3 maps - crossing4final, darkside, altair (why those maps btw? I notice that AI's usually perform well on them). E323AI crashed quite fast on crossing4final and altair, on darkside it raped RAI like a baby.

So, solve the crash (i couldn't find some clear reason for it, the logs end in "[CTaskHandler::remove] remove task BUILD(#)"), release new version, and have fame forever.

Ah, yeah, and the .lua files should be in version dir as mentioned above.

YAY.

[Agon]

I updated the rpm package with your latest source and it works great with XTA. But I started CA for a fast testing (it was selected before) and it crashed directly after the start. I dont think it is a good idea to crash on an Mod which it does not support. Maybe its related to CA only I dont know.