SupCom-esqe spawning of the commander

[Licho]

Limiting boost to only some units is uber stupid idea and goes against CA main design principles..

[Pxtl]

Rather than limited boost units, I'd rather see a boost timelimit or replacing boost with deployment of buildings (only buildings, since the deployment replaces the Comm's boost, and comm only builds buildings). Limited to fixed-area around Comm if spawning in preset locations, or the start-zones if using choose-in-game.

[Raxxman]

I think the concept of boost decay, IE boost slowly ticks down to zero over the period of say 60 seconds would be a nice way of doing things.

[CarRepairer]

Limiting boost to only some units is uber stupid idea and goes against CA main design principles..

You think it's stupid, let's look at the next two suggestions:

Rather than limited boost units, I'd rather see a boost timelimit or replacing boost with deployment of buildings (only buildings, since the deployment replaces the Comm's boost, and comm only builds buildings). Limited to fixed-area around Comm if spawning in preset locations, or the start-zones if using choose-in-game.

Time limit? What if a dropped player comm starts in a bad spot and can't walk to a better one before limit ends? Same goes for preset area.

Any buildings? Even LLT and HLT? Then you can still boostrush.

Some buildings? Then it's the same as what I just did with limited boost.

I think the concept of boost decay, IE boost slowly ticks down to zero over the period of say 60 seconds would be a nice way of doing things.

This is way too stressful. If player A starts right next to three mexes and builts his whole base with barely losing any ticks, while an opposing player B started a small walk away from some mexes, player B is severely punished and loses a lot of boost in the extra few seconds his slow comm walks to them!


There Licho, see how less stupid my implementation is now? I think my implementation is an arbitrary rule and that's bad, but it's less bad than these other floating ideas.

[Pxtl]

I meant Deployment, as in the deployment mutator - as in _before_ the game starts you build structures (including HLT/LLT) in the Comm area. If it's a fixed/random startpoint game, you get a fixed radius around the commander. If it's a "choose start points" then you can drop units anywhere you like within the team area.

You can't boostrush if it's confined to the area, and you can't save the boost for later for weird cheese actions. You use it at the beginning. You just need to be able to /take the deployment resources if a guy drops during deployment.

[Raxxman]

I think the concept of boost decay, IE boost slowly ticks down to zero over the period of say 60 seconds would be a nice way of doing things.

This is way too stressful. If player A starts right next to three mexes and builts his whole base with barely losing any ticks, while an opposing player B started a small walk away from some mexes, player B is severely punished and loses a lot of boost in the extra few seconds his slow comm walks to them!


There Licho, see how less stupid my implementation is now? I think my implementation is an arbitrary rule and that's bad, but it's less bad than these other floating ideas.

Factoring in A: sucking at placement and B: dropped players as the only counterpoint is fairly retarded. Dropped guy starts near no mexes? Get him to boost up either A: A lab and some energy, B: a fusion (assuming communisum)

People place near mexes anyway, the maps are designed to give you a clutch of close up mexes and dropped comms nearly always appear right next to a mex anyway, your sweeping counterarguement is essentially a none issue anyway.

So your implementation still looks exactly the same.

[CarRepairer]

Trust me, the "decaying boost meter" idea would create a huge huge penalty one one player and severely imbalance the game far worse than any boost rush ever done.

Pxtl: Sorry I misunderstood you. I've long ago recommended that deployment be changed to only buildings. The problem with deployment is probably the fact that it's even slower to start a game than no boost at all, what with waiting 120 seconds for the timer to end. Yeah I'd say that's probably the failing. Boost is much better.

[Pxtl]

No reason it has to be 120 seconds.

[knorke]

boost - its the new dgun?

Boost offers great versatility for start strategies, and there are so many of them that it is completely impossible to counter all of them at once. [...]
This basically turns the game opening into the simple blind Rock-paper-scissors. Which i dont like.
It especially unbalances 1v1 games on small maps, where the opening makes up 70% of the game, and seeing that your enemy uses a start strategy that counters yours means that you are pretty much fucked.

what "start combinations" are there where one player is fucked from the start? (on a small 1v1 map)
ie if a player tries to start air and gets flashrushed maybe he should play more conversavative then. air and fusion start _can_ work but you have to know if your enemy is aggressive it will be harder to take advantage of your strategy. a kbot lab on the other side is always a good idea.
and yes, with a early radar it is possible to react to boostrushs, especially on small maps. ive played a few 2v2 on darkside (that small moonmap) where the enemy shared a lab and boosted tanks. thanks to radar we saw all the dots streaming at us and boosted flashs ourselves.

maybe some replays please that show the problem of boostrush? or play me

In bigger team games it might be a problem as there you often have different skill levels. ie new players starting in the back get comdropped. but the "noobs" commander should be able to survive (just ran away!) and build a new base with some help from the team. the attacking com is at great risk of not making it back.

[knorke]

on the original topic i wouldnt mind a "teleport in" or "crash down from the sky" animation of the commander if doesnt take too long, ie 2 seconds.
maybe its possible to combine the arrival of the commander with the countdown already we have?

3 seconds - you hear a uiiiiiiiii "falling" sound
2 seconds - landing pod comes down, with a trail of fire
1 seconds - boom, impact. tada! game starts.

it could also clear the trees around your start position.

[jK]

make me a pod model and i will include something like that

[maackey]

Thats pretty much what I was thinking of earlier. Except the pod from the sky would be only for the logos commander. Nova would have a teleporting pad down on the ground, where a gigiantic beam of light would come from the sky (a la the super weapons corresponding to each faction)

I started on the pods btw, all I have to do is finish them.

[123vtemp]

you could combine the teleportation with the crash down by having the com warp into the empty atmosphere and then crash down to the map surface :p

[knorke]

yes, some "ion cannon" laser would look nice too.
or the rocket hula hop square. you wear it around your hip:

(actually its a wip landing thing but it will probally suck anyway)

[Pxtl]

Trust me, the "decaying boost meter" idea would create a huge huge penalty one one player and severely imbalance the game far worse than any boost rush ever done.

Pxtl: Sorry I misunderstood you. I've long ago recommended that deployment be changed to only buildings. The problem with deployment is probably the fact that it's even slower to start a game than no boost at all, what with waiting 120 seconds for the timer to end. Yeah I'd say that's probably the failing. Boost is much better.

We just played a bit. We tried a boostrush and pwned, then tried again with facinabox.

For large teamgames, facinabox is definitely the superior option. I highly recommend it for your next DSD monstrosity. The only way to do an obscene rush with facinabox is to burn your starting metal on offense instead of econ.... and that plan has an obvious drawback.

[CarRepairer]

We just played a bit. We tried a boostrush and pwned, then tried again with facinabox.

For large teamgames, facinabox is definitely the superior option. I highly recommend it for your next DSD monstrosity. The only way to do an obscene rush with facinabox is to burn your starting metal on offense instead of econ.... and that plan has an obvious drawback.

And did you try the limited boost option yet?

[TheFatController]

As for doing stuff during the countdown, I never found a way to detect when the countdown started with Lua, closest was the GameStart call in which indicates the countdown was finished.

[Saktoth]

We have the little lua cones placed down over the selected starting points, so you can definitely detect that before the game starts. And it spams another point when you click 'ready' doesnt it? so possibly a way to detect that?

Dont need to detect when the countdown starts, if you can detect when a player has readied. Start the FX, have it do its thing, then have it slow down to a sort of glowy ball thing over 5 seconds that goes 'pop' when the countdown finishes.

[maackey]

Oh, btw here is the model of the commander pod I was referring to, uploaded to modelbase. The screenshot really isn't that good, as its closed up and everything, but the model is there if you really want to see it.

http://planet-wars.eu/ModelBase/ModelDe ... ModelID=78