TBP owners are not in jail, and the judges were biased and both parties called for an appeal, try reading reports a bit.Argh wrote:Sure, there are countless trackers, and they're constantly getting C&D or sued or the owners are getting put in jail. Like those supposedly-invulnerable guys at Pirate's Bay.
The economics of Spring mod users
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Re: The economics of Spring mod users
Re: The economics of Spring mod users
Its not the looming ominous shadow of atari legal action that hurts us.
Its the lets steer clear of the whole mess because we don't want to deal with it shadow that other people who could help us are being scared off by.
We can calm ourselves by saying Atari si unlikely to ever move on this, because we're already here, we're in neck high. These other people though arent, and they're not going to accept our cushy explanations of why its okay. As far as they#re concerned, we're not legit, and ti doesnt matter hwo safe we are from atari, there's something illegal going on, and a lack of action by atari doesn't change that.
We're fools if we think we can carry on as we are and not suffer from it.
Its the lets steer clear of the whole mess because we don't want to deal with it shadow that other people who could help us are being scared off by.
We can calm ourselves by saying Atari si unlikely to ever move on this, because we're already here, we're in neck high. These other people though arent, and they're not going to accept our cushy explanations of why its okay. As far as they#re concerned, we're not legit, and ti doesnt matter hwo safe we are from atari, there's something illegal going on, and a lack of action by atari doesn't change that.
We're fools if we think we can carry on as we are and not suffer from it.
Re: The economics of Spring mod users
And the suggested solution is ... ?
- TheFatController
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Re: The economics of Spring mod users
DESTROY BA!!
Edit: or or have all the loonies from this forum send their crazy 3 page rants and theorys to cavedog so they never take us seriously or take the time to bother us.
Edit: or or have all the loonies from this forum send their crazy 3 page rants and theorys to cavedog so they never take us seriously or take the time to bother us.
Re: The economics of Spring mod users
My suggestion is that BA take steps to make itself more succesful, as counter intuitive as that is. BAs current situation is not because of what its doing its because its actively maintained and already has a sizeable portion of loyal players.
BA advertising out in the world, distributing tis own installer, with a token website explaining what BA is and where to download it wont harm the non TA based games, but itll make BA bigger.
Fat controller, while I appreciate you yoursef dont want to do this, you ejoy doing what you do best, but you don't have to. Post a thread requesting other people to help do this for you. The community under you playing BA has more than enough time and resources to do all this while you carry on as you did before.
BA advertising out in the world, distributing tis own installer, with a token website explaining what BA is and where to download it wont harm the non TA based games, but itll make BA bigger.
Fat controller, while I appreciate you yoursef dont want to do this, you ejoy doing what you do best, but you don't have to. Post a thread requesting other people to help do this for you. The community under you playing BA has more than enough time and resources to do all this while you carry on as you did before.
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Re: The economics of Spring mod users
Who is this "we" you're talking about?AF wrote:We can calm ourselves by saying Atari si unlikely to ever move on this, because we're already here, we're in neck high.
That attitude might fight to one half of the gamers or maybe more who just don't care. The rest owns TA and thus has the right to play this...
For the devs though nothing of that really applies and so I don't know why you're trying to play the schoolmaster now. It's not like people could pull a switch and replace all the OTA content with something new and fresh thus getting rid of the IP but just hesisate by saying "Nah - I'm fine with the way it is right now." as you're imputing. It's just because a lack of manpower, time or skill why this is going on so slowly but there sure are people trying to get things going on and I know of no modder who wouldn't replace his stuff once there is a complete set ready to go...
That's just the way it is and so it's no use doing the "OMG it's about the IP"-dance yet again. Replacing simply won't go any faster and there's nothing anyone can do about that except for helping. I also find it amazing that a topic about getting people to play Spring (i.e. discussing the entire managed to deviate into this whole IP things. Not that it's important but we're now discussing this for the 100th time and there's not going to be anything new about this so why derailing this topic to repeat the entire discussion?
Re: The economics of Spring mod users
Owning TA doesn't make seeding a TA based game on spring downloader any more legal.
Its like saying its okay for me to buy a copy of Adobe CS4 for £500+, then burn 1000 copies and hand them out for free, its the peoples fault for accepting them!
Its like saying its okay for me to buy a copy of Adobe CS4 for £500+, then burn 1000 copies and hand them out for free, its the peoples fault for accepting them!
- TheFatController
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Re: The economics of Spring mod users
I'm not interested in a community website for BA, I'd be happy to work with someone who was. I am interested in a packaged installer for the purposes of attracting new players and have made steps towards this for the near future.Fat controller, while I appreciate you yoursef dont want to do this, you ejoy doing what you do best, but you don't have to. Post a thread requesting other people to help do this for you. The community under you playing BA has more than enough time and resources to do all this while you carry on as you did before.
More like buy a copy of Photoshop 0.63 and save all the button icons then use them in a different photo editor and distribute 1000 copies of that.AF wrote:Its like saying its okay for me to buy a copy of Adobe CS4 for £500+, then burn 1000 copies and hand them out for free, its the peoples fault for accepting them!
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Re: The economics of Spring mod users
I never said it would be...AF wrote:Owning TA doesn't make seeding a TA based game on spring downloader any more legal.
Re: The economics of Spring mod users
fat controller, you really think people have tried to take down ba by contacting atari? why would they do that?
- TheFatController
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Re: The economics of Spring mod users
Honestly if you look at some people's post history on this topic I wouldn't be surprised.smoth wrote:fat controller, you really think people have tried to take down ba by contacting atari? why would they do that?
- CarRepairer
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Re: The economics of Spring mod users
L.O.L.el_matarife wrote:Personally, I wish we could just buy a non-commercial redistribution license for the content from Atari for some nominal fee of like $10,000 which we could easily raise.
R.O.F.L.TheFatController wrote:I don't already doubt that several other people have already desperately tried to report BA but the fact that you also feel the need to shout about it is not appreciated.
Awesome, this is super fun thread.
Re: The economics of Spring mod users
If you can summon up someone to do the website for you, I am happy to host it and maybe even design that logo you so wanted?
- TheFatController
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Re: The economics of Spring mod users
Well on a separate note BA does still need a logo for the loadscreens and I'm accepting submissions.
Re: The economics of Spring mod users
It's already been mentioned, but I'd like to clarify the hosting issue (I would have assumed this to be clear, but obviously it's not):
Our most famous/played current RTS, WC3 (and Starcraft before it), does not require port forwarding if you "host", because Battlenet is actually giving you a "dedicated" server to run your game on - this is for standard games (beyond and related to that, it also auto allocates you to the type of game you select - but this is obviously only possible due to large player base).
If you play a user-modified game (eg DoTA), then you do need port forwarding - (DoTA I guess has less of a problem with this as it's 10 people to a proper game anyway).
What I then would view as our solution to this problem, would be an expansion of the "host on Autoserver" function (which is pretty neat, by the way):
Sean
Our most famous/played current RTS, WC3 (and Starcraft before it), does not require port forwarding if you "host", because Battlenet is actually giving you a "dedicated" server to run your game on - this is for standard games (beyond and related to that, it also auto allocates you to the type of game you select - but this is obviously only possible due to large player base).
If you play a user-modified game (eg DoTA), then you do need port forwarding - (DoTA I guess has less of a problem with this as it's 10 people to a proper game anyway).
What I then would view as our solution to this problem, would be an expansion of the "host on Autoserver" function (which is pretty neat, by the way):
- Given there are sufficient compatible Autoservers, I would set Lobbies on this function as default
- have the settings choosable in a menu like you do when you self host - but have these settings locked when you open the "host" / open the game lobby
- and remove any "ready" functionality (so Host can start at will) or autostart when game is full.
Sean
Re: The economics of Spring mod users
Truth.TheFatController wrote:Honestly if you look at some people's post history on this topic I wouldn't be surprised.smoth wrote:fat controller, you really think people have tried to take down ba by contacting atari? why would they do that?
- CarRepairer
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Re: The economics of Spring mod users
I confress, it was me.
dear atari
please sue ba. they stoled your stuff so plz put them all in jail for lulz.
if possible plz also sue dsd cauz it sux to and everyone plays it and regret combomd me becoz he is a jerk.
thank u.
signed,
leonard ralph percy chalmers
p.s. thank u for sonic the hegehog its my faverite gaem i like sonic 3.
Re: The economics of Spring mod users
you son of a b... .wait, are you mechasonic!?!?CarRepairer wrote:I confress, it was me.
dear atari
please sue ba. they stoled your stuff so plz put them all in jail for lulz.
if possible plz also sue dsd cauz it sux to and everyone plays it and regret combomd me becoz he is a jerk.
thank u.
signed,
leonard ralph percy chalmers
p.s. thank u for sonic the hegehog its my faverite gaem i like sonic 3.
Re: The economics of Spring mod users
LOL.
Just for the record... I have never talked to them. So far as I know, the only person who ever has is Tobi.
When I do anything like that, you would know pretty fast. I write pretty effective letters
And the objective, as I see it, is not to "report" anybody. It's to cut a deal and end this nonsense with a legal solution.
At any rate, I don't see any consensus here about whether we should proceed or not, so I'm not doing anything.
I'll talk to that guy about it, put it theoretically, see what he thinks. He won't "turn Spring in" or anything like that. But I need some gut-level idea from a veteran of the Industry of how a publisher is going to react, if they're given a proposal to fix things, given the situation.
Just for the record... I have never talked to them. So far as I know, the only person who ever has is Tobi.
When I do anything like that, you would know pretty fast. I write pretty effective letters

And the objective, as I see it, is not to "report" anybody. It's to cut a deal and end this nonsense with a legal solution.
At any rate, I don't see any consensus here about whether we should proceed or not, so I'm not doing anything.
I'll talk to that guy about it, put it theoretically, see what he thinks. He won't "turn Spring in" or anything like that. But I need some gut-level idea from a veteran of the Industry of how a publisher is going to react, if they're given a proposal to fix things, given the situation.
Last edited by Argh on 03 Jun 2009, 00:49, edited 1 time in total.
Re: The economics of Spring mod users
Give me package.loadlib and I'll redirect them with my integrated launcher[Krogoth86] wrote:Another newbie trap that should be get rid of is the naming of the Spring.exe. I always have the feeling that every 2nd newbie tries to launch Spring this way instead of using the lobby which is quite understandable...
The current installer put a link to your start menu, that, as soon as you click it, downloads otacontent.sdz, tacontent_v2.sdz, tatextures_v062.sdz.Regret wrote:The current official Spring server does not in any way distribute (or helps to distribute) illegal content. No illegal data is relayed by the server either.
Argh wtfness at its greatest.Argh wrote:No, you can't... because the License of the engine does not allow you to.So...
Can i make money out of Supreme Annihilation?
How much warm and fuzzy in your insides does it make you to talk down upon us now that you feel the equal of Chris T. since you've gone commercial?Argh wrote:since I'm now a (runt) member of Stardock's "family" of developers, I could maybe talk to Chris Taylor about this stuff, see what he thinks.
That reminds me the day I asked Trepan for Lua doc and his response was to delete the only one. Again, what's the wrong the two solutions of:Tobi wrote:Maybe we should just stop releasing installers except from a password protected area to which only game developers have the password.
- Have an installer like previously, with tick boxes to select mode to download?
- Have Tobi say we can now put mod's installer in wiki download's page?
Stop the bullshit, if they were going to jail us, they would have show sign of life already. The risk of getting C&D is non-existant (and even if we were, that wouldn't be the death of Spring), but like AF said, the issue is more the taint that the TA thievery leaves all over the Spring project and that prevent it to get more exposure in the free movement.try to take down ba by contacting atari