Supreme Annihilation U75 V1.0 discussion

[Tribulexrenamed]

wow....

But the only air unit i care about is the atlas, and it APPEARS to suck more than the atlas of other mods. It probably has NOTHING to do with the unit, but actually the fact that units tend to have an unnaturally strong ability to be able to kill it, particularly llts and coms.

[Gota]

Use it more to transport troops behind enemy lines and not to combomb and you'll do fine.I'd recommend Zeuses Cans and Warriors...

[Tribulexrenamed]

I rarely combomb intentionally. Dgun is so much more useful than a nuke.

[Wingflier]

Alright so here's my latest update of bugs/fixes that I've found.

I've already mentioned the Arm Spiders paralyzing themselves.

Here's something "big" too (no pun intended).

The Core BlackDawn "Flak-Resistant Gunship" may be resistant to flak, but it might as well be a magnet for everything else. Look at the size of the thing!



Compare it to the size of the much smaller and more sleek Arm Blade, which by the way, is also significantly faster in flight and strafing.

I would suggest a reduction in model size for the BlackDawn, for obvious reasons.

And one more thing, Why is the X-Ray shader lua not part of the widget line-up? I love that one. Please add it for the next version.

Wing

[Gota]

I really don't think the size of the BlackDawn has much influence on how much it gets hit.
AA weapons usually do not miss,and its not that fast anyway so the chances of it actually avoiding fire are minimal.

[Wingflier]

I wasn't talking about AA fire. I meant fire from regular ground units. Surely you don't think it's supposed to be hit by that kind of fire? Isn't that what gunships strafe for?

I'm merely saying that it seems the Blade is a much better ship. It's much smaller, seems faster, and therefore has a lot more survivability then the BlackDawn.

Here's something else I recently found. The Arm has yet another advantage over Core when it comes to facing T3 mechs.

Not only does Arm have the Annihilator. A 1400 range, 5000 damage per shot laser which is relatively cheap to build by T2 defense standards.

The Penetrator, the mobile version.

The Sharpshooter, which has special damages vs. mechs. Who knows how much damage it does per shot.

The Spider, a 750 hp all-terrain paralyzer kbot.

But now I also see that only the Arm can build a T2 transport with a paralyzing laser on it. And Arm is the only faction with the EMP bomber. Both of these actually work on mechs by the way. And keeping a mech paralyzed is just as powerful as having the weapons to bring it down from a range.

What does Core have against T3? Nothing. I wouldn't even count the Doomsday Machine. First of all it's extremely expensive, secondly, at 950 range vs. the Anni's 1400, in many cases a mech can just go around it.

If Core spams Sumos/Goliaths, I guess it would work okay, but that is the equivalent to Arm spamming Bulldogs and Fatboys. How shitty is that compared to just using Penetrators/Snipers?

And don't even bring the Core Bladewings into this. A tech 1 paralyzer drone with 60 hp a piece, who drop like flies, and tend to die in hordes, is hardly an answer. These pesky things can be countered by the most minimal of air support. Especially by Tech 3.

The point I'm trying to make is that Core has a huge missing role in its units. At the very least, you could give their T2 transport, which by all standards is already far inferior to the Arm T2 transport which can paralyze AND is invisible to radar (a nice thing to have when transporting units wouldn't you say?) - The ability to Paralyze. At least this way, Core would have an answer in at least 1 of their 3 tech trees. Still pretty sub-par, but better than nothing I guess.

Originally, Arm was never intended to have T3 mechs. In the beginning, the only mech buildable by either side was the Krogoth. The addition of new mechs and the mechs for Arm was done by third parties. Which explains Core's inherent lack of ability to deal with this kind of threat.

But now that you have given Arm mechs, you must give Core the ability to deal with them.

Just common sense.

[Gota]

The only anti t3 units in arm arsenal is the sniper.
everything else u need to rethink.
Annihilator and penetrator are not anti t3 and they don't do full dmg since they are laser weapons(core has the DD?!).
Black dawn is balanced differently so what if its slower?doesnt mean its worse and even banshee get hit by ground units sometimes ..i don't see the big deal about it since the damages are very small.
Woul'dnt it be silly if a bulldog was to hit an air unit and do no damage?
Core has other units like the sumo for example,or the goliath etc etc...
I don't think arm and core should be mirror sides...
Some difference is fine.
The units are all balanced for their costs and that's what matters.
Snipers,penes,annis all need tons and tons of e.
core has it's own awesome and unique units.
Core has the goliath,the dominator,the banisher,the tremor,the KROW,the Sumo.


IN short.
The arm has only 1 anti T3 unit which is the sniper.
Core has Other cool stuff and T2 porc breakers.
There are no T3 counters unless you make weapons that do special dmges vs T3 mechs..
The only unit that has that is the sniper,besides it I'm not sure what you mean.

[Wingflier]

Penetrators and Annihilators counter T3 because of the game dynamic. They do huge damage in a short time at a range. This by its very nature is a good counter to T3. The fact that Snipers have EXTRA damage vs. T3 is just a bonus. With or without that extra damage, they are dynamically suited to killing T3.

Not to mention that Arm also has 3 ways to paralyze T3, while Core has 0.

It seems to me you are totally forgetting the game dynamic part of my points. Units usually counter each other not because of special damages, but because they act in such a way as too exploit the weaknesses of the unit in question. Usually while avoiding its strong points.

The weakness of T3 well...T3 doesn't really have that many weaknesses. The biggest weakness would be the huge build time and resource cost. But once it's built, that's obviously not a factor anymore.

So the "weakness" of T3 is its total HP and units that can stay out if its path of destruction or paralyze it for long enough to do so.

Arm has this ability in every tree: Vehicle, Kbot, and Air.

Core has it in no trees. Core has no realistic counters to T3.

But whatever. I play Arm, so I could care less.

Wing

[Gota]

Well in the same sense u could say arm has better counter to bulldogs or gollies cause it has a penetrator...
a unit/building is balanced based on its entire capabilities not just vs 1 tier or 1 lab or 1 unit.
So arm has slightly better T3 countering abilities but core has heavier air units and better close range and spam control units.
T3 is not some different balance step..its balanced jsut like t2 and t1.
So whether you build 12 bulldogs(just guessing)or 1 bantha you penetrator will have the same balance worth since it is judged by its capabilities in all respects.
Sure pene is good versus heavy big units but its weak against air raids and many small units.

[Gota]

Supreme Annihilation U11 V1.0:

Commanders take a bit more dmg from com explosion.
T1 AA kbots and T1 boats shoot land targets as well(balanced accordingly).
Added a random option to side selection.
Fixed Ti fighters chasing land units.
Changed description of blackdawn to make it clear it is flak resistant.
Increased dgun dmg to commanders slightly.
Removed the dgun area of effect and direction lines.
Added a widget that turns labs to the center of the map.
Removed special dmgs of plasma turrets vs sea units.
Fixed core energy converter metal output.
EMP spiders no longer emp themselves.
Bombers are more agile now.
Updated AdvancedPlayerList widget.

http://spring.jobjol.nl/show_file.php?id=1677

[Gota]

yet another quickfix!!(kick me in the head).
SA U14
fixed a widget that caused games to just exit before even beginning.

http://spring.jobjol.nl/show_file.php?id=1677

[Gota]

Supreme Annihilation U15.

http://spring.jobjol.nl/show_file.php?id=1677

changes:

Fighters now act differently,They will move like gunships but when attacking will do flybys.
com icons made bigger.
Pitbulls and Vipers removed.
MetalMaker costs lowered.
T2 metal makers now have more hp.
Repair rates lowered.
area effect of juno los weapon increased,reload time decreased.
Lowered scout dmgs substantially upped hp a bit.
All weapons shoot through allied units now.
LLTs now have the stats of the beamer and hllt.
Hllt and beamer removed.
Removed T1 laser ships,scout ships are now more expensive,have more hp and shoot land.
T1 popup turrets removed.
Missile Towers and Floating Missile Towers shoot land now.balanced accordingly.
Com explosion will do a bit more dmg to commanders now.
Added dynamic music and sound and music volume.
some widgets updated.
Missile Towers and Floating Missile Towers removed from Commanders buildlist.

This release would not have been possible without Lurker's and Car repairer's help.

[Anyone]

Why the hell does your mod automatically set the shadows to off and saves this in the Spring settings? It's annoying to have to manually rechange this after every game.

fwiw, i got loads of OGG file failure messages in the console before i quit and deleted the mod.

[Gota]

A pastebin would have been nice.

[Neddie]

Why the hell does your mod automatically set the shadows to off and saves this in the Spring settings? It's annoying to have to manually rechange this after every game.

fwiw, i got loads of OGG file failure messages in the console before i quit and deleted the mod.

Probably FPSManager.

[Gota]

Cause of the LOS actually.
SA modifies los a bit and turns it on...
If you dont want that you can deactivate the widget that does it.

[Gota]

Yes,i am aware of the error about the music files.
It happens rarely but when it does you can just restart the widget that is responsible for the music.

[Anyone]

Cause of the LOS actually.
SA modifies los a bit and turns it on...
If you dont want that you can deactivate the widget that does it.

Which would be?

[Gota]

I don't remember the exact name,but it has LOS in it.

[Anyone]

Ok it works. (GreyLOS is the widget's name btw). And disabling the TA music widget helped with the OGG isues.

Many Thanks and sorry for being somewhat rude in my first post