limit player number to 8-10 per game.

[Gota]

I didn't understand your post or the point you were making TBH.

The point was that you're a dumb clueless noob and should shut up.

You don't agree that the average player skill decreased?

[YHCIR]

Smaller games will mean better cooperation between players,more chances of newbies learning things from better players and maybe the revival of some sort of competitive sub community?

False.
There is little co-operation between players in any game. The only co-operation happens when you get 2+ clan players, or people that know the score, most players just play for themselves.

Larger games mean a newbie (or a person that isn't great) doesn't have as much of an effect on the game. If you play 4v4, and you have just 1 newbie, then there's gonna be a newbie shaped hole in 1/4 of your frontline, and there's nothing you can do about it because as soon as you start spreading your defences they weaken.

I do agree that 8v8 (DSD) can be a little restrictive because there are no effective tactics apart from techrush/porc and bertha/plane spam or commbomb.
But that's only because the map is too narrow for 8v8.

Limiting to 8 players is not a good idea though.

[Gota]

Smaller games will mean better cooperation between players,more chances of newbies learning things from better players and maybe the revival of some sort of competitive sub community?

False.
There is little co-operation between players in any game. The only co-operation happens when you get 2+ clan players, or people that know the score, most players just play for themselves.

Larger games mean a newbie (or a person that isn't great) doesn't have as much of an effect on the game. If you play 4v4, and you have just 1 newbie, then there's gonna be a newbie shaped hole in 1/4 of your frontline, and there's nothing you can do about it because as soon as you start spreading your defences they weaken.

I do agree that 8v8 (DSD) can be a little restrictive because there are no effective tactics apart from techrush/porc and bertha/plane spam or commbomb.
But that's only because the map is too narrow for 8v8.

Limiting to 8 players is not a good idea though.

Cooperation rises with decreasing player amounts.
And you just made a very good point...if you play a 4v4
and a noob is failing there will be more pressure on him to improve and more pressure on good players to teach others and help them.

[Spawn_Retard]

i do agree that average player skill has lowerd, but thats because theres a lot more people playing spring now. This happens with every game that gets popular, the player skill level will drop with the increase of populairty.

My point is this:

If you freeze out a section of gameplay, you will lose the section that that was created from that feature. which is like what, 100+ players?

Good bye player base, hello skill level.

[Gota]

Are you saying players will move to play other RTS with higher than 10 cap??name one please..
I don't think anyone will leave cause of it.
The average skill player dropped but also the raw number of good players,while the number of overall players rose(if overall player numbers rise the raw number of good players should rise as well but instead it decreased!).

EDITED --

I have never heard anyone saying he is playing spring cause the cap of players is 16.
I have never heard players posting how unbelievable it is the cap is at 16..and noobs joining do not expect there to be a cap of 16...

[YHCIR]

Cooperation rises with decreasing player amounts.
And you just made a very good point...if you play a 4v4
and a noob is failing there will be more pressure on him to improve and more pressure on good players to teach others and help them.

No, people will just not allow newbies in their 4v4 games, and newbies will not want to play 4v4 games because losing sucks.

You get good at spring by watching others and by playing lots of games. You can't teach someone how to play well in the middle of a game, it takes ages to learn. It just makes people frustrated.

[Gota]

Cooperation rises with decreasing player amounts.
And you just made a very good point...if you play a 4v4
and a noob is failing there will be more pressure on him to improve and more pressure on good players to teach others and help them.

No, people will just not allow newbies in their 4v4 games, and newbies will not want to play 4v4 games because losing sucks.

You get good at spring by watching others and by playing lots of games. You can't teach someone how to play well in the middle of a game, it takes ages to learn. It just makes people frustrated.

If that was true we would see a huge rise of player numbers never before seen in spring after the cap was raised but we didn't.
Less players DOES mean better cooperation and the fact your losing makes you learn.
Smaller games are much better for a player to learn how to play right...the are less random less chaotic and each player is more accentuated.
8v8 noobfests teach nothing and don't encourage people to improve.

Oh and noobs played fine with advanced players before the cap was 16...sure there was a bit more pressure on them but it was good and overall just encouraged people to get better.
There will always be people screaming at noobs and getting mad in any community

[YHCIR]

Cooperation rises with decreasing player amounts.
And you just made a very good point...if you play a 4v4
and a noob is failing there will be more pressure on him to improve and more pressure on good players to teach others and help them.

No, people will just not allow newbies in their 4v4 games, and newbies will not want to play 4v4 games because losing sucks.

You get good at spring by watching others and by playing lots of games. You can't teach someone how to play well in the middle of a game, it takes ages to learn. It just makes people frustrated.

If that was true we would see a huge rise of player numbers never before seen in spring after the cap was raised but we didn't.

You're saying that potential players would be magically drawn to spring just because one setting was changed? How do these potential players find out that spring exists?

Also, who cares about "improving players", yeh it would be good to have people that understand the game better, but it's not something that should be forced. As long as there are other autohosts playing different maps/mods, some people will migrate to different style games (different maps/fewer players) when they are bored of DSD.

[Spawn_Retard]

No, people will just not allow newbies in their 4v4 games, and newbies will not want to play 4v4 games because losing sucks.

You get good at spring by watching others and by playing lots of games. You can't teach someone how to play well in the middle of a game, it takes ages to learn. It just makes people frustrated.

This is also true, 4v4s are usualy off limits to anyone below star rank.

And to address GOTAs comments on putting more pressure on a noob to play better is not in anyway a good thing. I dislike playing 4v4s for this reason alone, if games were less competetive as the amount of players decreased id certainlyn play them a whole lot more. I'm sure a lot of people have the same opinion and arn't that confident when defending their pride and skill level on spring. Psychological intimadation can and will effect a games outcome, if your deemed a noob and cant play, you will be less likely to come back and play the game again. I'm glad there are noobs, because it's more people i can teach to play spring, and makes the game fun to play, and not stressfull.

Also,m GJ GOTA, you failed again.

Losing =/= increasing your skill level.

Watching replays and actually learning strats from oldern players is how you increase your skill level.

Thatn is why i am creating commentated games with the help of others in the community.

If you'd like to join in on it, please do, i've always wanted to hear you speak for real GOTA, and maybe have a proper conversation about things.

[Gota]

Magically drown to spring?how do you understand that from what I'm writing?
I was saying that a 10 player cap is fine and is a good number and that smaller games will make players play better not have more players...the amount of players has got nothing to do with player cap as long as its on a normal number..
No noob will expect more than 8 or 10.

[YHCIR]

If that was true we would see a huge rise of player numbers never before seen in spring after the cap was raised but we didn't.

[Gota]

No, people will just not allow newbies in their 4v4 games, and newbies will not want to play 4v4 games because losing sucks.

You get good at spring by watching others and by playing lots of games. You can't teach someone how to play well in the middle of a game, it takes ages to learn. It just makes people frustrated.

This is also true, 4v4s are usualy off limits to anyone below star rank.

And to address GOTAs comments on putting more pressure on a noob to play better is not in anyway a good thing. I dislike playing 4v4s for this reason alone, if games were less competetive as the amount of players decreased id certainlyn play them a whole lot more. I'm sure a lot of people have the same opinion and arn't that confident when defending their pride and skill level on spring. Psychological intimadation can and will effect a games outcome, if your deemed a noob and cant play, you will be less likely to come back and play the game again. I'm glad there are noobs, because it's more people i can teach to play spring, and makes the game fun to play, and not stressfull.

Also,m GJ GOTA, you failed again.

Losing =/= increasing your skill level.

Watching replays and actually learning strats from oldern players is how you increase your skill level.

Thatn is why i am creating commentated games with the help of others in the community.

If you'd like to join in on it, please do, i've always wanted to hear you speak for real GOTA, and maybe have a proper conversation about things.

I hope your replays help though i doubt they will(unfortunately)unless they are directed intentionally to create a tutorial and than integrated into a mod or a tutorial mod etc..
AS i have written before the cap was lower and noobs played fine with advanced players..
There is little incentive to learn if you can jsut go play a 8v8 where nobody cares how you play..

[Gota]

If that was true we would see a huge rise of player numbers never before seen in spring after the cap was raised but we didn't.

?
We didn't.

[Hoi]

Did you read what i posted?

Yes but we don't care, this idea is so stupid, let people play 8v8 dsd if they want to.

[Gota]

Did you read what i posted?

Yes but we don't care, this idea is so stupid, let people play 8v8 dsd if they want to.

What do you think is stupid about it?

[Peet]

Tada!

Adding major game constraints to the engine to suit your personal tastes as a player is ridiculous...particularly when the functionality is already implemented!

[Hoi]

Tada!

Adding major game constraints to the engine to suit your personal tastes as a player is ridiculous...particularly when the functionality is already implemented!

This.

[Gota]

Tada!

Adding major game constraints to the engine to suit your personal tastes as a player is ridiculous...particularly when the functionality is already implemented!

Sigh...Read posts?
I didn't say change the engine and i explained why just allowing to cap player numbers for a room is not enough.

[Peet]

In any case, you're attempting to push your personal preference for a configurable option on everybody. I like dynamic water...does that mean it should be forced on by the settings app?

[Gota]

I just want players to be encouraged to play better and not worse like it is now,by reducing the maximum player number per game.