How to add races
Moderator: Moderators
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Tim Blokdijk
- Posts: 1242
- Joined: 29 May 2005, 11:18
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PauloMorfeo
- Posts: 2004
- Joined: 15 Dec 2004, 20:53
Let me give you an example. Let's assume that in XTA we generally receive 2M per metal patch and we receive 20E per solar panel, making (assuming) the metal 10 time more important than energy.
Now, we have an Insect mod that we want to balance out to XTA but the mod has all cost assuming Metal and Energy all value the same because in the maps they used to use, metal patches usually give as much metal as a Solar Panel gives Energy.
This would have a somewhat easy fix mathematically instead of trying to manually test every single unit with trial and error from the bottom up until things are good.
Now, we have an Insect mod that we want to balance out to XTA but the mod has all cost assuming Metal and Energy all value the same because in the maps they used to use, metal patches usually give as much metal as a Solar Panel gives Energy.
This would have a somewhat easy fix mathematically instead of trying to manually test every single unit with trial and error from the bottom up until things are good.
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PauloMorfeo
- Posts: 2004
- Joined: 15 Dec 2004, 20:53
I would really like to.Tim Blokdijk wrote:Well, prove him wrong PauloMorfeo.
I'm somewhat interested to see if you can actually come up with some algorithm.
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Not to prove him wrong but to actually produce a formula.
The problem is that there are many other things that are, on my personal list, ahead of that. One of them, for example, is making a good database and editing tools for unit sets which would help greatly in modifying the units. And even that (which should be made before any balancing exercise) is before other stuff on my personal list.
While I would encourage you to devise a formula (a better threat matrix formula could easily be derived from it, aswell as more accurate endgame statistics graphs (st:armada 1+2 etc)), I must point out that there are factors you arent taking in that cannot be quantified into a formula.
For example, the spring subAI's, a hawk may have a better sub AI than another unit and thus would have an advantage even though statistically it may be a much weaker unit.
And, sometimes games can be balanced while having gross misbalances, an example of this was the core krogoth, though not a perfect example. Games where your units are powerful not because they've been balanced to be powerful but because of the nature of the untis themselves. An example of that would be zeus vs pyro.
For these I would also think that the perfect map would need creating. A plain map with equal amounts of flat land sloping rough mountainous passage, impassable, and water land, all distributed correctly as to not provide bias to any one type.
For example, the spring subAI's, a hawk may have a better sub AI than another unit and thus would have an advantage even though statistically it may be a much weaker unit.
And, sometimes games can be balanced while having gross misbalances, an example of this was the core krogoth, though not a perfect example. Games where your units are powerful not because they've been balanced to be powerful but because of the nature of the untis themselves. An example of that would be zeus vs pyro.
For these I would also think that the perfect map would need creating. A plain map with equal amounts of flat land sloping rough mountainous passage, impassable, and water land, all distributed correctly as to not provide bias to any one type.
I just posted about this in the AI forums. http://taspring.clan-sy.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=2841
I need to make a tool that reads that information anyway, including armor vs weaponid matchups. I am pretty sure a spreadsheet, table or database would be very easy to implement on the side.
A basic Mod eval tool :) Part of the benefit to human players is identifying weaponid matches to units to assist in play. Like lasers vs mavericks in OTA. I covered the next few steps in actual play testing, and a few extrapolations we could make. Once about half of the AI is done, then we should have a rapid balance testing tool, including looking for things like the old hawk bug of fire+retreat every 3 seconds.
But yeah, I volunteer to make a spreadsheet and probably a series of equations as well.
I need to make a tool that reads that information anyway, including armor vs weaponid matchups. I am pretty sure a spreadsheet, table or database would be very easy to implement on the side.
A basic Mod eval tool :) Part of the benefit to human players is identifying weaponid matches to units to assist in play. Like lasers vs mavericks in OTA. I covered the next few steps in actual play testing, and a few extrapolations we could make. Once about half of the AI is done, then we should have a rapid balance testing tool, including looking for things like the old hawk bug of fire+retreat every 3 seconds.
But yeah, I volunteer to make a spreadsheet and probably a series of equations as well.