Maximum Annihilation V1.0

[Forboding Angel]

/facepalm


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[[Krogoth86]]

/facepalm


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Well even repeating this doesn't really make me understand what exactly you want to say with that...

[Saktoth]

I dont want people to fork EE, because that would be even more of a waste than a fork of TA, irregardless of what this mod offers, I highly doubt it will get more than few games in during a week if even and thusly I again dont see the point..

To get a version of EE that is more popular and/or plays better? Im not saying 'EE sucks', but everything could be 'better'- perhaps there is someone out there who has what it takes to come up with some really good ideas regarding its gameplay and balance that even you would admit make it play a lot better. Who knows. In the same way that AA started to suck so someone forked it and made a better/more popular version (BA), you might as well co-opt the masses into doing your work for you and creating something they will enjoy out of your beautiful, beautiful, severely under-appreciated content. It might even lead to a the playable, played, Atari-IP free flagship mod Spring so desperately needs.

Or maybe all you'll get is a 100 monkeys bashing it up and making bastard versions- even then, it lets people learn how to make a good mod and might lead to a few interesting new concepts (In MA, im interested to see how the fac-based econ thing pans out, its not been done much in spring other than TFM).

And, in the end, thats why you get all these AA variants. Its people learning how to mod. MA isnt just vapourware, and when Krogoth realises there isnt really a market his mod, perhaps he will go on to some more experimental, original works (rather than trying to do the populist thing of 'this is a better BA thing, play this instead', which wont work), or contribute to an established project.

All valuable things, i say. But im a die-hard open sourcer so i would say that.

[[Krogoth86]]

(In MA, im interested to see how the fac-based econ thing pans out, its not been done much in spring other than TFM).

AFAIK NOTA has this too although I'm not sure about it...

And, in the end, thats why you get all these AA variants. Its people learning how to mod. MA isnt just vapourware, and when Krogothe realises there isnt really a market his mod, perhaps he will go on to some more experimental, original works (rather than trying to do the populist thing of 'this is a better BA thing, play this instead', which wont work), or contribute to an established project.

You may be right - I'm really thinking of doing something unique after MA...

[overkill]

@Sak: Imo EE already plays VERY well, it is my second favorite game for spring (nota in 1st). The only thing keeping it from being the flagship game you described is player arogance. most players play ba, ba has metal makers and strong defenses, ee has no metal makers and somewhat weak defenses which sadly repel the ba players away. What EE needs is advertising outside of spring to draw in new, open-minded players.

@krog: Yes NOTA has something similar to that, and i look foward to seing what your unique (mod or game?) will be.

[Desinity]

That's a standard command if one of your selected units already gets guarded by the one you select. So go ahead an select the unit you want to guard too and give a stop command to apply the guard command afterwards (because even if you have only one unit with this guarding each other situation will prevent the guard order being applied for all the units you have selected)...

the problem is,that the combat units didn't guard anything before (I looked at that and tried stop too) I tried to let them guard another combat unit (as example let zipper guard sharpshooter) but that didn't work,gives me everytime the line "Command canceled..."

btw:Com and Decoy Com (his explosion has really not much damage like you said) have that "NoWeapon: Aiming" too

but I have some performance probs with that mod,I played versus an AI on Smalldivide had everything on low settings (and LUP off) had only 30% behind my name and ping ofc was 0 but I got only 1-3 fps in the middle and endgame...
(maybe its a prob with my pc who knows xD )

[[Krogoth86]]

the problem is,that the combat units didn't guard anything before (I looked at that and tried stop too) I tried to let them guard another combat unit (as example let zipper guard sharpshooter) but that didn't work,gives me everytime the line "Command canceled..."

Hmmm yeah - there really seems to be a problem with non-builders. I'll see if I can find the reason for this...

btw:Com and Decoy Com (his explosion has really not much damage like you said)

If just had another look at it and now also removed the explosion's impulse which could smash not so heavy units away...

but I have some performance probs with that mod,I played versus an AI on Smalldivide had everything on low settings (and LUP off) had only 30% behind my name and ping ofc was 0 but I got only 1-3 fps in the middle and endgame...

Well I never had any outstanding performance problems and as I don't know your PC I cannot say if that's normal or if there has to be something wrong. In general the CPU is the first limitator in Spring but in your case it seems to be your graphics card. I don't know which settings you chose but in the Spring settings put the Ground Decals Slider to "1" (don't mind if you can put it to way higher values in your version - there has been a "mistake" which leads to way too much decals as "1" is a pretty good options where decals stay for a quite a while), also turn off shadows just as things like dynamic clouds and reflective units and set the water rendering to the lowest setting possible. You should get good framerates with that when not playing on an old Intel Onboard Graphics Chip...

Or do you have this performance issue just with my mod but everything else (i.e. other mods) runs fine?

[rattle]

Go Make Yourself Useful And Create Something Original├óÔÇ×┬ó

[Scikar]

It says a lot about the current state of the Spring community that half of the replies to any new mod are bashing it for being what it is. If it's not TA half the community bitches that it won't be as good as BA or AA regardless of what it is trying to achieve, and if it is based on TA the other half bitches that it isn't something new and original.

I think a BA fork with balanced teamplay in mind is a perfectly reasonable goal to aim for, I hope this turns out well.

[Desinity]

I use already the lowest settings (ground decal at 0,no shadows,Basic Water,and so on) and normally my fps-rate goes only down if to many units involved in the game.

my System:
2400+ AMD Athlon
only 768 mb Ram
GF 6600

Map: Smalldivide
AI: AAI (own config)

if I play by myself (or let another AI play) versus an AI,all goes ok until the endgame then the fps-rate goes down to 1-2 at 1.0 Gamespeed,the crazy thing is,that I have then like 5-7 fps if I speed up the game to 3.0 o_O (shouldn't it be the other way...)

(it seems that in beginning and middle game a lower gamespeed means higher fps but in the end its like the other way or at least has 3.0 not worse fps-rate than 1.0 Gamespeed...)

(Randbemerkung: auf deutsch die Umstände zuerläutern wäre echt einfacher,aber ja,dass is ja ein engl. sprachiges Forum und ich pass mich mal an xD )

[[Krogoth86]]

Hmmm, well I think it really is your PC which slows everything down - especially as the AIs tend to spam lots of T1 stuff even in late game (especially KAIK does this a lot). You might want to try if it's not so bad when playing against real players online (although 3v3 and bigger probably won't make your PC happy )...

[smoth]

It says a lot about the current state of the Spring community that half of the replies to any new mod are bashing it for being what it is. If it's not TA half the community bitches that it won't be as good as BA or AA regardless of what it is trying to achieve, and if it is based on TA the other half bitches that it isn't something new and original.

I didn't bitch and I do not see any gundam players bitching. Fact of the matter is that most people are tired of seeing TA forks. When over 70% of this community plays TA it should be more shocking that it doesn't get played.

My bigger question is why is this a whole mod and not a mutator.

[Fanger]

indeed.. we need to stop having forks of BA.. put those balance changes into BA, not have everyone with half a brain going hey I think BA ought to balanced this way, and make a whole mod for it, and then release that and go whee.

What does this mod change, how is it different from BA, if it is different from BA, why doesnt BA adopt these changes if they are good, if they arent good, why were they made..

[SpikedHelmet]

I think for the most part, most people who do this (make TA forks and spoons) do it thinking "hey, maybe this'll become the next AA, and then I'll be famous!"

Really, though, any half-baked moron could make a *A mod (and many half-baked morons have) by tweaking some stats. But in the end its a waste of your time and a waste of ours.

[KDR_11k]

indeed.. we need to stop having forks of BA.. put those balance changes into BA, not have everyone with half a brain going hey I think BA ought to balanced this way, and make a whole mod for it, and then release that and go whee.

What does this mod change, how is it different from BA, if it is different from BA, why doesnt BA adopt these changes if they are good, if they arent good, why were they made..

You're forgetting that BA won't do things that change the gameplay much, even if it's for the better. With CA you might have a point though.

[smoth]

even so, if BA is supposed to be solid, when are they going to do a development freeze so people can go and make mutators?

[Saktoth]

Stop trolling thread kthx. This isnt constructive in the slightest. BA's design objectives arent set by other developers- its deliberately insular, but its a good basis for a game (as most players understand its dynamics, and understanding how to play the game helps when modding it).

Forking is a perfectly acceptable practice. 100 OTA variants hurts nobody, if noone seriously plays them (and realistically, i dont expect them to be doing so) it doesnt even steal your market share.

New modders have to start somewhere, and modifying other peoples content is one of the best ways. Finishing a complete project and releasing it is a great way to get feedback. There arent many people who can make a 400+ unit mod with a good game dynamic all on their own. Hell, there arent that many people who can program, script, model and texture a whole mod- and the few who do are obviously being dicks about it >_> (Not that anyone here has created a popular mod all on their own- so stop hatin').

And hell, its not like you guys made the engine, so honestly, go away and make your own game from scratch and then we can be impressed. Until then, you are just modifying someone elses work.

With CA you might have a point though.

CA has a totally different set of design objectives. CA is based around a flat tech tree, and a scaling buildpower economy, vastly varying factions, and units that are, each and every one of them, distinct and unique in use and ability. MA is based around a strictly tiered power-scaling tech tree (even moreso than BA), fac-based unit production, with almost identical factions and much redundancy in unit roles between tiers, labs etc. Id be delighted if Krogoth contributed to CA, he obviously has the skills and talents to contribute in some way to the project. But he is free to follow his own design objectives (Game design is also a skill you have to practice).

I, for my part, am glad to see another modder trying his hand at this and welcome Krogoth into this community of content developers- as dysfunctional and hostile as it may be.

[Argh]

[Fanger]

dont go all self righteous here and start belittling other peoples work. Im merely questioning why we have all these gameplay alterations to a core game. Why are so many people dissatisfied by it, surely there has to be another mod available here that caters more towards that balance. Id rather much see a cutback in the amount of redundent mods.

[Argh]

These guys are just like any other modding nubs anywhere, trying to figure out what they like, and what works, and why. It's not harmful, and ultimately they don't really get anywhere, in terms of traction, but it gives them a start, and gives players something new to try for a minute.

Saktoth went a little overboard with the rhetoric, to be sure- most of the new mods, including E&E, aren't just "modifying somebody else's work", they're new game designs. You don't have to write an engine to build a new game design- those are separate issues, imo. But meh, I'm tired of seeing all of this negativity whenever somebody writes one of these things... we've seen them come and go, probably 50 at least since I got here, and the only one that's stuck around is CA. Just how it is.