How do you stop LUA that cheats?

[Decimator]

Want to prevent LUA from giving someone an advantage that their opponents don't have? Make it autodownload into their opponents' games so they can use it too.

Simple and effective.

[Ishach]

I made a lua that makes all player drop from the game

[hunterw]

I made a lua that makes all player drop from the game

isaac has been ragecrashing every game he loses (wich is like all of them) he deserves a ban imo

[TradeMark]

lol, i havent seen ragecrashing for a long time, since RA2.

[hunterw]

someone figured out how to ragecrash UO shards back in the day

man that would be sweet, if ur house gets looted or something just crash that bitch and revert everyone's characters

[Dragon45]

Ultimately you're argument still basically comes down to "This is an RTS game, and therefore the players shouldn't have to micromanage their units, so it's fine that they have lua/AI to do it for them."

Now whos making a strawman? My argument is not "shouldnt have to micro units". It is "nothing we can make at this point in human history is going to give one player an appreciable advantage of micro, strategy, etc, over another."

But the thing is, we're not dealing with "an RTS game" here. We're dealing with a gaming engine. The individual games the modders make should be able to choose their own standards of play. If a modder decides that aimbot dgunning is cheating, they should have the power to block it, and FORCE it to be done manually.

Now you're mincing words. Spring is an RTS gaming engine. For RTS. Argue differently. Go on, I dare you.

You're committing a major logical fallacy in assuming that the modders who make units, tanks, planes, etc are the only types of modders. That is majorly wrong. There are AI modders, interface modders, effects modders, map modders, etc. We may call them different things but they're still modders, just in a different domain. Not giving their works equal precedence over plane-tank-robot modders is just gheeeeeeeeeeeeeey.

[KDR_11k]

Also let's not forget that most trivial micro is just necessary because the default behaviour of a Spring unit does not necessarily match the desirable behaviour of a specific unit in a mod and until 75b1 there's no way for the modder to change that. Kernel Panic came with some lua widgets once Zwzsg took over because there was trivial micro in the game that was created by the engine.

While it may be desirable for some mods to prevent a player from improving the behaviour of a unit in trivial ways automatically it doesn't seem like a good idea. I'd prefer if there were rules in the mod that enforce things rather than just faith that a player can't feasibly do certain things.

[NightfallGemini]

hey guys let's make an open source engine where you can make any script you like as long as it doesn't crash


oh but only along these guidelines where the scripts can't "cheat" (read: take away stupid shit that gets away from actually playing the game) and blah blah blaaaaaaaa--


the game is fine as it is. everyone should stop whining.

p.s.

Want to prevent LUA from giving someone an advantage that their opponents don't have? Make it autodownload into their opponents' games so they can use it too.

Simple and effective.

this post is pretty good

[SecurE]

Want to prevent LUA from giving someone an advantage that their opponents don't have? Make it autodownload into their opponents' games so they can use it too.

Simple and effective.

this post is pretty good

Although it isn't necessarily true. The user has to know what the script does, how to use it and even that it exist. There are people who don't even know all the standard commands in Spring, you'd basically have to run a tutorial for every script to have the same playing field as your opponent.

Not giving their works equal precedence over plane-tank-robot modders is just gheeeeeeeeeeeeeey.

If you are actually arguing that they should be on the same "level", then they already are. They could simply release a mod of their own, call it "Mod blahblah with LUA Script 'Automatic-Radar Warning', LUA Script 'Text buildlayouts', interface modification 'Red self-destruct button'". They'd obviously should ask permission from the creators of "Mod blahblah" first however, at least if they want to be polite. At the same time the plane-tank-robot modders could keep their own version as "Mod blahblah".
Joking aside, what I said is quite valid I feel, the "plane-tank-robot" modders are usually the ones that do most work, has planned the gameplay in a certain way and most important of all, provides the core to work upon.

[Dragon45]

Joking aside, what I said is quite valid I feel, the "plane-tank-robot" modders are usually the ones that do most work, has planned the gameplay in a certain way and most important of all, provides the core to work upon.

just like in a family, husband is most important b/c he gives the family a core to work around

[SwiftSpear]

When I was using the term "modder" I was referring to someone, or some team that packages mod releases for spring. I wasn't referring to someone with specific modding abilities. A "modder" who is deciding what lua rules should be in their game could have any job within that specific mod release, but basically I'm arguing that the mod designer must have the controls available to them to enforce the micromanagement difficulties of techniques they choose to.

I have no problem whatsoever with modders including widgets in their releases. IMO that's the way the system SHOULD work.

[SecurE]

Indeed SwiftSpear, I was going to add that the ones making the units and all that might very well do their own interface, LUA scripts and even custom maps.

When talking about the "plane-tank-robot" modders I assumed it meant the ones who made the initial mod package. So smoth would be an example of the "plane-tank-robot" modder, even though he made his own effects.