Basic Springfo

Basic Springfo

Various things about Spring that do not fit in any of the other forums listed below, including forum rules.

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Badger
Posts: 2
Joined: 23 Jun 2007, 22:47

Basic Springfo

Post by Badger »

Hmm....

1. Since when has TA been 3D? Since Spring, or was there something else in between?

2. Can skirmish games be saved, and if not is it possible for some time in the future?

3. Does it feature everything from BT and CC such as the Krogoth and the like?

4. What would stop the battleroom from accessing every master, including localhost?

5. This project is amazing...

Thanks for reads/answers :-)
Last edited by Badger on 23 Jun 2007, 23:15, edited 1 time in total.
Tobi
Spring Developer
Posts: 4598
Joined: 01 Jun 2005, 11:36

Re: Basic Springfo

Post by Tobi »

1. Spring is a totally different engine then TA, even though it is relatively easy to run content for the TA engine in the Spring engine.

2. No, not yet, but it will be possible later, probably in the next version already (though not all (3rd party) AIs may support it).

3. You can run many different "mods" on the engine, each actually being different games, not just modifications. Some do have Krogoth, other's don't.

4. You can already connect to whichever masterserver you want, I'm not sure I understand you correctly though.
Badger
Posts: 2
Joined: 23 Jun 2007, 22:47

Post by Badger »

For 4 there, i meant that the TASClient fails to connect to every server, including localhost... which is highly unusual, seeing as it's allowed by my firewall and still can't connect to itself... lol.

Thanks Tobi :D
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smoth
Posts: 22309
Joined: 13 Jan 2005, 00:46

Post by smoth »

local host is for when you are running the spring private server. Useful when playing on a lan behind a firewall..
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zwzsg
Kernel Panic Co-Developer
Posts: 7052
Joined: 16 Nov 2004, 13:08

Post by zwzsg »

1) TA was already 3D since it's 1997 release, only, the camera was fixed, and the map rendered like a huge bitmap, since with a fixed camera there was no need to use textured polygons for the terrain that would always be seen at same angle. But already in 1997, TA units were little 3d mapped models, shots trajectory were 3d, each units and shots had an altitude, etc... The game inner mechanic was in 3d, just only half of the rendering was 3d.

In 1999, the Swedish Yankspankers released the 3d replayer, which was an addition to their previous work, the TA demo recorder, and that 3d replayer made it possible to view a TA game in full 3d with a free camera. Totala.exe would still be running and "playing the game", but that TA3D.exe was... I don't know what it technically was exactly, but it felt like a alternate rendering application that just made it more glaringly apparent TA was in 3d, since instead of a fixed view, we had a camera we could move and turn freely. You can still find the 3D demo replayer at http://www.clan-sy.com

In 2005, the Swedish Yankspankers released Spring, which was not just a 3D camera mode for TA, but instead a whole new engine, that just happen to be compatible with TA data format. That means this time they coded everything, the collision, the pathfinding, the interface, the whole underlying mechanic, and not just a 3d render.

Technically, Spring is a new RTS engine that has nothing to do with TA. However, because developping the content (hundreds and hundreds of unit models, of unit animations, of weapons, of textures, etc..). is such a huge work, and because Spring can read the same data as TA, most modders went the lazy way and simply reused TA data instead of making their own. Also, for historical reason, many people are used to TA units and aren't willing to try novelty, or keep thinking (just as you do) that Spring is merely TA in 3D, or any other reasons, but TA based mods remains the most popular.

2) Saving a skirmish is not possible currently. In some early version, there was a save key. Also, recently a mysterious contributor has submitted a patch that allows saving and loading even with AI, and hopefully it will be included in the next version of Spring.

Also, since you mention skirmish, keep in mind Spring is mostly multiplayer oriented. Single player is possible, but it wasn't the developper priority, so it's not as easy to get it working as clicking a "single player" button like in any other RTS. If you look hard on http://www.unknown-files.net you can find AIs, single player battleroom, and even single player missions, but installing them and getting them to work can be a pretty rough ride for a newbie.

3) The question is irrelevant once you start to realise Spring isn't just 3D TA. But everybody who made a Spring mod with TA units started with the Cavedog official unit set, including Core Contingency, 3.1c patch, and the 6 last units. Then proceeded onto removing units, adding units, or tweaking units. But no one ever even talked about doing a TA 1.0 mod without the add-ons units. So uh the answer is yes, Krogoth and the like are in. Though in reality it's all at the whim of the modder. The people who work on the engine, aka the developpers, are a separate bunch from the people who works on the content, aka the modders. Most modders reuse Cavedog's unit. But some, such as Smoth with Gundam, Fang with Expand & Exterminate, Argh with Nanoblobs, SpikedHelmet and his minions with 1994, KDR_11k with Kernel Panic and his other dozen mini mods, instead developped their own content, without reusing any TA units. So no Krogoth in Kernel Panic for instance. Did I tell you to try Kernel Panic and Gundam? If not I tell you now: Try Kernel Panic and Gundam!

4) I don't understand the question.

5) Yes it is.
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Tim Blokdijk
Posts: 1242
Joined: 29 May 2005, 11:18

Post by Tim Blokdijk »

You know zwzsg.. You should write some stuff for the new Spring site. :wink:
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Neddie
Community Lead
Posts: 9406
Joined: 10 Apr 2006, 05:05

Post by Neddie »

Tim Blokdijk wrote:You know zwzsg.. You should write some stuff for the new Spring site. :wink:
He should. I have a list of people, if you want it, who should write stuff for the new site. I also have a list of editors.
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zwzsg
Kernel Panic Co-Developer
Posts: 7052
Joined: 16 Nov 2004, 13:08

Post by zwzsg »

But if I agreed to write for you, then I'll keep getting distracted by shiny new things and never get around to write, and then I would feel bad for promising and not delivering!

I had to delegate the maintenance of my old TA FAQ at TAU, so it wouldn't be realist to volunteer for a new Spring site.

But thanks anyway! <3
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Tim Blokdijk
Posts: 1242
Joined: 29 May 2005, 11:18

Post by Tim Blokdijk »

It's fine :-)
The new site will still take some time to finish and along the way people will get more interested and involved, I don't expect this to become a problem.

[EDIT]
@neddiedrow
If you can find people that can translate the site it would be nice but don't expect the new site to be ready for translation real soon. There are still a lot of bugs and sharp edges that need to be resolved.
[/EDIT]
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