NTai XE10.1b

AF · Post by AF » 15 Apr 2007, 16:41

mine fields are a dream that will take AI makers a very long time to do. Indeed minefields are highly innefficient in AIs and would the effort needed to do it doesnt justify the end result.

Guessmyname · Post by **Guessmyname** » 15 Apr 2007, 18:08

1. Use learning files and such to note areas from which the enemy attack
2. Find likely paths (ie through valleys etc)
3. Have the AI build a line or two of mines, perpendicular to the pre-predicted path

Identifying mines - immobile kamikase buildings (it would be good if we could simply add an fbi tag called 'aitype' with stuff like 'SCOUT', 'BUILDER' and such. If I were to add this tag in Epic Legions' fbi files, would Spring ignore it and would NTAI benefit from it?)

AF · Post by AF » 15 Apr 2007, 18:23

you can but thy'd be pointless as there's a config to discern scouts from atatckers, and there's data the engine gives thats good enough to tell apart builders.

As for mines, its a lot more complicted to do what you said than you think, it'd require at the least a pathfinder, and a pathfinder is not something I plan on integrating anytime soon.

Right now I want a solid NTai installer with a stable NTai coupled with a strong collection of configs. The NTai side has made leaps and bounds, its time to build configs.

At the moment what I'd like to see are XTA/BA/EE configs. All interested please announce their intentions before hand, itd be good if people could work together where possible. I've built nanoblobz and kernel panic configs on my own and they didnt take much time to build.

hmm Ivory King has sent me an XTA config already. So BA and EE are left. I'll do some work on attack behaviour.

1v0ry_k1ng · Post by **1v0ry_k1ng** » 15 Apr 2007, 19:00

one thing that would be v v useful is putting switches in;
that is, an option in the tasklist which changes a condition to off, to condition to on. Then, make it possible to give a unit a diffrent task list to when the switch is on and off.
for example, when the L2 v lab is finished it turns a switch on. all the con V gaurding the L1 lab receive a new tasklist in which they move to assist the L2 lab instead.
it would also be good if it was possible to place a timer on how long somthing gaurds a factory for.

AF · Post by AF » 16 Apr 2007, 00:39

b_guard is not the only type of guarding behaviour.

There's b_repair, and b_guardian. b_guardian makes the unit seek out things to repair and help build. When there is no longer anything to help the task will end and the next task will execute.

b_guard carries on untill the unit being guarded is destroyed.

Also, it is possible to use the options on the unit page to control teching up.

MinEnergy and MaxEnergy are liek sliders for controlling tech'ing up. Their values represent energy income, so if I have a kbot factory and an income of 20 energy, I can set a MinEnergy value of 60, and NTai cant build that factory untill its energy income rises above 60 energy. I could also give solar collectors a MaxEnergy of 2000, teling NTai not to build solars once its reached a 2k energy income.

1v0ry_k1ng · Post by **1v0ry_k1ng** » 16 Apr 2007, 02:22

zomg.
also, my config I sent you likes to make mines in its base which chainexplode, which possibly should be changed.

DJ · Post by DJ » 16 Apr 2007, 12:24

Have you had any joy looking at the attacking problems? I was having quite alot of success with a BA config apart from that problem...

AF · Post by AF » 16 Apr 2007, 17:28

I created a build with the old multiple attack group behaviour that was removed in XE8.5, and I fiddled the threat matrix a little, but nobody was online to test it so I went to sleep.

btw that kernel panic config only works with v0.7. KDR and zwzsgs' versions dont work because that mod doesnt have a necessary tag for sharing configs.

1v0ry_k1ng · Post by **1v0ry_k1ng** » 16 Apr 2007, 19:25

for this to work well with XTA units would have to receive any move order in lots of little jumps ensuring they never range of fixed defences.
also, defences are placed without intelligence atm.
certainly some kind of threat matrix would be a good idea, but units have to be microed to a degree; kept at their maximum range and targetting intelligently.

I just want to say the commanders AI is brilliant. D-gunning when it has E and reclaiming when it dosnt, and reclaiming enemy commanders. best commander AI I have seen, although it only retreats from other commanders, and dosnt retreat when on low health.

air units need to be sent in in large groups, not sent in as soon as they are made as per atm.
all the economy stuff is in place now, it looks v promising. now its just defence placement and unit movement and attacking that needs doing. I dont recall the old NTAI very well but im pretty sure its attacking was still pretty basic. if KAI is open source now, kloot has it, you should plunder it for code :)

edit: new version?

1v0ry_k1ng · Post by **1v0ry_k1ng** » 16 Apr 2007, 19:33

XE9.7b ignores b_factory on the tasklist atm

edit: infact it refuses to make any factories at all, it just skips them in the tasklist.

AF · Post by AF » 16 Apr 2007, 19:38

I have no testers, so I wont release untill someone has said hand on heart, that attacking has improved in XE9.7c. Nobody has asked for the build, nobody who I could ask has come on my msn.

Aircraft would be simple, taking the group system and splitting it in two. But first I need to know if the group system actually works.

DJ · Post by DJ » 16 Apr 2007, 19:38

dude check your email

AF · Post by AF » 16 Apr 2007, 20:06

IK has verified attack groups work, and I'll have a newer build to test with a few other changes after I've eaten

1v0ry_k1ng · Post by **1v0ry_k1ng** » 16 Apr 2007, 21:44

still have the same primary problem; a single NTAI does not work.
to use NTAI I must have two or more NTAI. the first NTAI team remains idle. any further teams will work normally. would logs or replays help solve this problem?

DJ · Post by DJ » 16 Apr 2007, 22:55

Just got really wierd issue, attacking (well multiple attack points at least) just worked with the 0.97a build i'm testing with.

The only difference was i was trying to get it to build geo's (to which it seemed to respond by building hovercraft labs)

AF · Post by AF » 16 Apr 2007, 23:03

IK, thats cus you have an old learning file from a buggy NTai interfering with the newer NTai.

DJ · Post by DJ » 16 Apr 2007, 23:47

Don't know whether this could be the case or not but it looks as though the attacking problem maybe not that it can't add other points (as I have seen this happen) but more that it adds the same point over and over again.

In the last game I saw the units rally at the attack point and then try to go into battle but NTAI kept adding the same attack point again and again forcing the units to all return to the attack point before once again trying rejoin the battle. That could be total b*ll as I haven't even looked at the code but might be worth looking at.

1v0ry_k1ng · Post by **1v0ry_k1ng** » 17 Apr 2007, 00:18

attacking problem is sorted now, it attacks well.
the problem is weirdly back to building placement.

1v0ry_k1ng · Post by **1v0ry_k1ng** » 17 Apr 2007, 14:12

ok, with the latest NTAI and my config NTA beats KAI, RAI, AAI TSAI, QAI in 1v1 on foothills, cooper jill, green comet.
I like the retreating of damaged units.

Triaxx2 · Post by **Triaxx2** » 18 Apr 2007, 14:12

I have XP now, with working spring, so I can help with testing if you need it.

Spring RTS Engine

NTai XE10.1b