EE version 0.173 Final (no more stuffs)

imbaczek · Post by **imbaczek** » 30 Dec 2006, 01:09

The point is, it pushes me away from playing the mod if I can't tell which unit is which... so I never get to learn how to control the units so I don't have to tell them apart.

j5mello · Post by **j5mello** » 30 Dec 2006, 18:33

imbaczek wrote:The point is, it pushes me away from playing the mod if I can't tell which unit is which... so I never get to learn how to control the units so I don't have to tell them apart.

this just seems like some pointless circle your goin in...

you say that u can't differentiate between units and they should be changed, yet you say you don't play the mod because you can't tell the difference between units???

im really confused by that.

imbaczek · Post by **imbaczek** » 30 Dec 2006, 20:00

But that's exactly correct (smart name: a feedback loop ^^) I played the older version and it was loads of fun, but didn't really know what was shooting what, especially when it wasn't mine ;p

I suggest a simple coloring scheme - one color as a teamcolor and another as a "function" color. This way you'll be able to tell
1) who does a unit belong to,
2) what is its intended purpose on the battlefield
without learning where to look on the model.

LathanStanley · Post by **LathanStanley** » 31 Dec 2006, 20:58

I just realized I'm not on the list of credits....

LOrDo · Post by **LOrDo** » 31 Dec 2006, 23:23

Who reads credits anyways?

Radja · Post by **Radja** » 01 Jan 2007, 03:01

i have that same problem (cant tell units apart), i think that the features that make units different from each other arent so easy to see, specially when zoomed out. Maybe making weapons bigger and easier to see or changing colors a bit. I dont think that (for example) making flamethrower spidies darker (as if burnt) would hurt realism a lot

you can tell TA units apart when zoomed out, wether you know them or not, this does not happen in EE. TA palette is not SO wide

smoth · Post by **smoth** » 01 Jan 2007, 03:06

You can tell TA units apart because you are used to them. I actually have a hard time now because I have not played TA in some time and the TA units all look... for lack of a better term... ununified in their style and design, just a bunch of moving scrap.

It doesn't take long to learn the unit differentiation.

Forboding Angel · Post by **Forboding Angel** » 01 Jan 2007, 10:53

I actually do as well, however I remember the unit names and that is what I generally go by.

Can't tell you how many times I've flipped past the mex and metal makers, not to mention staring a buildpic trying to remember.

Considering I play spring less than 1 game per wee (even less now that I've found Vendetta Online-win-).

Look at it this way. Any new rts game you are going to have that trouble. You would take the time to figure out the units in a game you payed 50 dollars for, whereas EE is free, so unless you really want to seriously give it a try, then there is no motivation to learn, and honestly none of you are seriously trying. Most ppl pick it up inside of 3 games. I doubt that many of you that are having trouble with the units have even played a real game.

I did color code the buildpics btw. If you halfway pay attention the legend is not hard to learn. Also there are little icons in the corner to tell you what that unit is for.

If you truly want to know the unit differences, go learn. If not, then don't complain, because if that is the case you really didn't care all that much in the first place.

^^^IMO^^^

Also, consider this... Spring is an engine for many Free RTS games. It's not required that you like all of them. Most TA fans are very much intrenched in a TA mindset, and that's ok. But if you like to try new things and learn a new game, then check out EE and Gundam. Both are quite fun, but as with any new game, there is a learning period, and you'll probably kinda suck for a little while, but generally EE is a lot of fun regardless of whether you suck or are totally omgwtfpwn

Thus ends my deep and intellectual monologue.

PicassoCT · Post by **PicassoCT** » 01 Jan 2007, 11:01

There is a really Simple Test to Units & Such.. you take all of them on white Ground (in a TestMap), make a HighRes Screenshot from 85├é┬░ - put that into Photoshop - take out Saturation, then slowly start change Contrast..

The Last Pixelheap who still can identified after this has won...

Units are easier to identify by shape. Thats why Bulldogs don`t just have a bigger Flash Chasis.

Forboding Angel · Post by **Forboding Angel** » 01 Jan 2007, 11:06

you completely missed my point.

try again

Relative · Post by **Relative** » 01 Jan 2007, 13:11

Due to the supreme awesomeness of this mod I demand that all TA based mods are banned and EE becomes mandatory.

Ling_Lover · Post by **Ling_Lover** » 01 Jan 2007, 14:06

Relative wrote:Due to the supreme awesomeness of this mod I demand that all TA based mods are banned and EE becomes mandatory.

seconded... once someone makes a good NTAI config and gives it to me

imbaczek · Post by **imbaczek** » 01 Jan 2007, 15:18

Forboding Angel wrote:If you truly want to know the unit differences, go learn. If not, then don't complain, because if that is the case you really didn't care all that much in the first place.

That's a very elitist attitude. I could care more if the first impression was better - as in easier to tell what's what.

Keep in mind that I don't want to _learn_ a game - I want to have fun. You're wasting your time if you don't make stuff easy to learn, because less people will be willing to try it out for this exact reason. However, that reason is easy to remedy, by differentiating the units more. People like me would have an easier start, and after that learning to play the mod would be going by itself.

...my head...

smoth · Post by **smoth** » 01 Jan 2007, 15:43

there are colorcoded buildpics and I still say that they are easily differentiated but perhaps some suggestions? Fang cannot read you mind.

imbaczek · Post by **imbaczek** » 01 Jan 2007, 16:12

I already suggested giving different color themes to different unit roles, for example:
assume close combat units are 100% team colored, artillery green, antiair blue
assume that I play with a blue team color
then units for close combat/assault would be blue with blue markings/stripes/dots/whatever
artillery would be green with blue
etc.

smoth · Post by **smoth** » 01 Jan 2007, 16:31

so maybe something like... for example..

The flamer bots could have bright red tanks on them... plasmabots bright blue guns, missile bots with white missilepods?

Radja · Post by **Radja** » 01 Jan 2007, 17:13

smoth wrote:You can tell TA units apart because you are used to them. I actually have a hard time now because I have not played TA in some time and the TA units all look... for lack of a better term... ununified in their style and design, just a bunch of moving scrap.

It doesn't take long to learn the unit differentiation.

never played TA untill i found this game/engine like a month ago. what i mean is that TA units different features are fast and easy to see

imbaczek · Post by **imbaczek** » 01 Jan 2007, 19:01

smoth wrote:so maybe something like... for example..

The flamer bots could have bright red tanks on them... plasmabots bright blue guns, missile bots with white missilepods?

Something like that could work, I guess. Significantly better than nothing :) As a bonus, I'd enlarge all weapons so they can be spotted without confusion on bigger view distances.

Zoombie · Post by **Zoombie** » 01 Jan 2007, 20:44

Radja wrote:never played TA untill i found this game/engine like a month ago. what i mean is that TA units different features are fast and easy to see

Spring comes with XTA, which has the units from TA and then some. You don't actually need to have played the original to be used to the originals units.

Forboding Angel · Post by **Forboding Angel** » 01 Jan 2007, 21:38

imbaczek wrote: That's a very elitist attitude. I could care more if the first impression was better - as in easier to tell what's what.

It's not elitist at all. It is the truth, for most people that is, not all (if you read, I made that distinction earlier), there are exceptions of which you seem to be one.

My original point still stands though. If you had paid $50 dollars for EE in a store, you would have given more effort towards trying to figure it out. Most people that have actually spent a decent amount of time playing EE have absolutely no trouble differentiating the units.

Which brings me back to my other point. Most of the people that complain are the ones that have spent very little time playing the mod (of course that are always exceptions).

I'm not harping on you or anything. It really doesn't matter to me whether you play EE or not. I'm happy that you seem to want to, we need more good people playing the mod, but understand that I am not getting on your case. You seem to be taking my comments a little too personally. Step back and look at them in the generalized sense.

Spring RTS Engine

EE version 0.173 Final (no more stuffs)