On the topic, why do Tech 2 fighters evade MT's missiles so extensively? Earlier I had about 8 adv fighters attack my comm on altored, game ends, with at least 10 MT's all around him just incase that happened, and the fighters stayed alive for so long that they almost killed my boy, I had to hide behind structures just to keep him alive.
At the same time, noticed that one of the fighters had a dead animation like the bombers - slow spinning crash after being killed - and at least half of my MT's were firing off at the dead fighter crashing for 5-10 seconds, missing every time OFC but not engaging the fighters that were still alive.
Made me uneasy, to say the least, that 8 odd fighters had survived for so long despite flying directly overhead a load of clustered MT's. Might do some tests later to see exactly how bad the situation is with MT vs T2 Fighter, but it seemed pretty fucked up earlier.
Balanced Annihilation v4.7 !!
Moderator: Moderators
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1v0ry_k1ng
- Posts: 4656
- Joined: 10 Mar 2006, 10:24
Yep
Since T2 fighters got flares it means you need flakkers or anti-swarmers to bring them down effectively. Personally, I love them with flares - as posted above, air would be really boring if it was just "brawlers/bombers crush anti-air defenses, fighters take down other planes". T2 fighters let you mix it up a little better, while T1 fighters provide the simpler concept of "fast, mobile AA".
Honestly, Ivory, if you're not continuing to the next logical step you probably shouldn't comment.
First, flares don't functionally double hit points, they change the odds of being hit by missiles, as dependent upon reloadtime. Secondly, you wouldn't make that change in a vacuum - you would reduce the hit points of the Banshee, possibly weaken it to earlier AA stats. Thirdly, nothing is 'basically' doing anything. Each change has specific results, which is why we have a chance of approaching approximate balance.
Finally, I wasn't actually suggesting it. Not every post I make has to be serious.
First, flares don't functionally double hit points, they change the odds of being hit by missiles, as dependent upon reloadtime. Secondly, you wouldn't make that change in a vacuum - you would reduce the hit points of the Banshee, possibly weaken it to earlier AA stats. Thirdly, nothing is 'basically' doing anything. Each change has specific results, which is why we have a chance of approaching approximate balance.
Finally, I wasn't actually suggesting it. Not every post I make has to be serious.
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Foxomaniac
- Posts: 691
- Joined: 18 Jan 2006, 16:59
I've been playing around with amphib / hover units lately.
I'd like to know what you all think of the following :
1. Reduce the cost of anti-air hover : 300 metal for a hover that's worse at shooting planes then a jethro is quite ridiculous - the only thing that keeps it in "row" is that it's health is around 1.2k or so - good as a meatshield since all attackers aim for them first.
2. Pelicans pelicans pelicans.... what is the ROLE of pelicans?
Their ground attack sucks - badly, big time - they take 2x more time to build then a hover scout/hover tank, aren't as fast as either of the former AND their only redeeming factor is their anti-air missile - which is neigh-useless.
Balance the pelicans!
*Angry pelicans with signs image goes here*
3. Why not utilize some of smoth's script trick thingies (or whatever) to allow amphib underwater units such as the triton / gimp and so on to move FASTER in the water?
This would help these units a LOT, right now to attack using amphib units is equalivent to sharing <insert metal amount here> to the enemy or if you build an amphib fac right next to their shore - which at that point you've already won and you are better off using hovers.
I'd like to know what you all think of the following :
1. Reduce the cost of anti-air hover : 300 metal for a hover that's worse at shooting planes then a jethro is quite ridiculous - the only thing that keeps it in "row" is that it's health is around 1.2k or so - good as a meatshield since all attackers aim for them first.
2. Pelicans pelicans pelicans.... what is the ROLE of pelicans?
Their ground attack sucks - badly, big time - they take 2x more time to build then a hover scout/hover tank, aren't as fast as either of the former AND their only redeeming factor is their anti-air missile - which is neigh-useless.
Balance the pelicans!
*Angry pelicans with signs image goes here*
3. Why not utilize some of smoth's script trick thingies (or whatever) to allow amphib underwater units such as the triton / gimp and so on to move FASTER in the water?
This would help these units a LOT, right now to attack using amphib units is equalivent to sharing <insert metal amount here> to the enemy or if you build an amphib fac right next to their shore - which at that point you've already won and you are better off using hovers.
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Machiosabre
- Posts: 1474
- Joined: 25 Dec 2005, 22:56
Amphibs arent really worth the effort. They are suited to surprise attacks but are far too slow. They are toast against torpedoes and depth charges, unable to defend themselves. Hovers on the other hand cant be hit by torpedoes or depth charges at all, and can defend themselves against navies. At least the pelican has this in common with hovers, but in tech level 2 its outlived its usefulness by the time you get it.
Amphibs are too niche, and that niche is already filled with hovers anyway. Perhaps if they had stealth to increase the surprise factor, or their speed boosted (or both).
Amphibs are too niche, and that niche is already filled with hovers anyway. Perhaps if they had stealth to increase the surprise factor, or their speed boosted (or both).
Ive seen it happen on other maps too. Im really certain its those special flighty dynamics. Removing them should fix it.I've seen this happen once or twice, but only on speedmetal.
My best guess is its an engine problem with how aircraft behave under some circumstance of how the map is layed out.
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CautionToTheWind
- Posts: 272
- Joined: 30 May 2006, 17:06
I tried setting up an automated airbridge with a few air transports. I gave area load and area unload orders with repeat, and then moved a few kbots into the load area. Only one of the air transports follows the orders and picks and drops units. All the others just sit there no matter how many units are waiting in the area load area.
Caydr had worked on air tranports on one of the last AA versions. Did BA get those improvements?
Caydr had worked on air tranports on one of the last AA versions. Did BA get those improvements?
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1v0ry_k1ng
- Posts: 4656
- Joined: 10 Mar 2006, 10:24
Amphibs
I've played some amphib maps and I have to say they're just fine in the limited skillset they have - they have kbot terrain tolerance, so they work as mid-terrain vehicles. The problem is that there are very few maps that require amphibs. I find that, while the L2 amphibs are only minimally useful, the L3 amphibs are excellent as an assault force once you've broken a defensive line, and the L1 amphibs are excellent as a first-strike force, since the commander is frequently working underwater away from the resource-sources on GOW-style maps.
Done a bit of damage by building a few amphi tanks in Tangerine and sending them through the middle lake to attack. But they cost a bunch early on which sets me back in econ and defence. And are slow enough to be easily hunted by flashes and commanders before they do significant damage. I've also seen allies do big damage with the heavier amphibian units on this map.
Also on a map with islands that are close together you can start vehicles and use ampibious tanks to hop from island to island covering the amphibious cons.
I think a speed boost would be nice for the light amphis as they can only be used as a raider unit, which means speed is important.
And with the pelican, maybe that could be made a level 1 kbot, with stats adjusted to balance it into the t1 level. It could then fill an early pre hover raiding unit role.
Also on a map with islands that are close together you can start vehicles and use ampibious tanks to hop from island to island covering the amphibious cons.
I think a speed boost would be nice for the light amphis as they can only be used as a raider unit, which means speed is important.
And with the pelican, maybe that could be made a level 1 kbot, with stats adjusted to balance it into the t1 level. It could then fill an early pre hover raiding unit role.
Is it just me or do lvl2 kbots feel a bit weak? Arm side has no kbot mix that can match lvl2 vehicle army. Mavericks are pretty much useless now and snipers can be easilly killed by a skilled player.
I also find it strange, that bantha has 2 HP/cost and krog has over 5 HP/cost = it's nearly 3x more efficient in terms of hp/cost. Shouldn't bantha at least have weapon damage similar to krog to justify it?
I also find it strange, that bantha has 2 HP/cost and krog has over 5 HP/cost = it's nearly 3x more efficient in terms of hp/cost. Shouldn't bantha at least have weapon damage similar to krog to justify it?
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Machiosabre
- Posts: 1474
- Joined: 25 Dec 2005, 22:56
So NOiZErs tells me that I'm the only one that's noticed that Vamps and Hawks have returned to their OTA glorydays of devoiring all things ground metal for metal, even units designed to kill air. This is obviously untrue, as I know that not ~all~ of you are suckers, so I'm putting it out here in the open for the 5 people who aren't the developers who actually bother to read this thread before posting to see.
Go go Comm Ends FFAs.
Go go Comm Ends FFAs.
yeah krogoth got a huge boost to health and also a crushing weapon, it's pretty unbalanced. But then I never build gantries anyways.Licho wrote:
I also find it strange, that bantha has 2 HP/cost and krog has over 5 HP/cost = it's nearly 3x more efficient in terms of hp/cost. Shouldn't bantha at least have weapon damage similar to krog to justify it?