Spring: 1944 v0.01 Alpha

SpikedHelmet · Post by **SpikedHelmet** » 16 Oct 2006, 04:03

That's basically how it is. Germany didn't have many planes that could compete with top Spitfire and Mustang versions... German fighters were usually better armed with 20mm guns but lacked the same speed and range as planes like the Mustang and Spitfires. Fw 190D-9 and Me 262 were Germany's only real answers to Allied air superiority but there's no hope enough of them would ever be made.

BTW I'm so looking forward to seeing dogfights and shit. It's gonna be ace seeing Me 262's duking it out with Mustangs.

Snipawolf · Post by **Snipawolf** » 16 Oct 2006, 04:04

Actually they dominated... Those over confident german bastards said "Our airplanes are fine, lets focus our spending on other stuff" and look what happened, they got aerial raped cuz allies kept spending money on airplanes..

SpikedHelmet · Post by **SpikedHelmet** » 16 Oct 2006, 04:36

Not just that, but Germany was short on pilots and fuel by 1944. They built tens of thousands of planes, just didn't have the fuel or the pilots to fly them.. they also made the strategic error of not developing a good four-engine heavy bomber, nor did they have the economic capacity to launch 5000-bomber waves like the Allies did...

Snipawolf · Post by **Snipawolf** » 16 Oct 2006, 04:42

Not just that, but Germany was short on pilots and fuel by 1944. They built tens of thousands of planes, just didn't have the fuel or the pilots to fly them.

Because they didn't have money to pay for them when recruiting..

They also made the strategic error of not developing a good four-engine heavy bomber, nor did they have the economic capacity to launch 5000-bomber waves like the Allies did...

Both still faults of not putting enough money into it..

I wonder, what if Germany had put money into their aerial development? Would the war have changed? Most likely..

Buuuut, I was getting off-topic, my bad. I think this mod is going to fare extremely well. Keep straight and don't give up, I want some competition when I release my mod

Warlord Zsinj · Post by **Warlord Zsinj** » 16 Oct 2006, 04:43

I still think it is important that the Germans aren't fighting a 'losing battle' - because historically by 1944, things were very much on the downward slide. I'd rather a 'what-if?' scenario was adopted, so that either side is perfectly competitive with the other. I think it is excellent that the different sides have different strengths, but I think it is quite important that one side (Axis)isn't badly hamstrung by historical accuracy.

Felix the Cat · Post by **Felix the Cat** » 16 Oct 2006, 04:43

Whoa, 1944 isn't dead! Last I checked there had been no significant activity, so I thought it died...

1944 Models

Included in download are my models for the following:
Soviet 37mm 61K-M1939 Towed AA Gun
Soviet 57mm ZiS-2 Towed AT Gun
Soviet 76mm M1943 Towed Infantry Gun/Lt Howitzer
Soviet 76mm ZiS-3 Towed Gun
Soviet BA-10 Heavy Armored Car
Soviet BA-64 Light Armored Car
Soviet GAZ-67 Jeep
Soviet Maxim M1910 Standalone Machine Gun
Soviet Pe-2 Light Bomber
Soviet T-60 Light Tank
German SdKfz 10 Heavy Artillery Prime Mover
British AEC Armored Car

...each of which I have prepared a simple 4-view image of from Wings3D. Of course, none of those are textured yet, as I suck at texturing. I can post the images if people are interested.

Anyways, since 1944 is still going strong, I'll work on more models.

Snipawolf · Post by **Snipawolf** » 16 Oct 2006, 04:46

I completely agree.. I think that it should be balanced as much as possible.

SpikedHelmet · Post by **SpikedHelmet** » 16 Oct 2006, 05:16

Britain and Germany had the weakest economies irreguardless of Allied bombing. Also it is very difficult to estimate the true potential of the German industrial machine as by the time it was "fully mobilized" in 1942-1943 there was already heavy bombing going on...

The weaker economy of the two will probably be established by generally longer buildtimes for structures.

SpikedHelmet · Post by **SpikedHelmet** » 16 Oct 2006, 06:45

Started adding German leIG 18 75mm Infantry Gun, essentially the lightest artillery piece available. As the designation says it is mainly an infantry support gun to give infantry some heavy firepower, but it lacks the power of anti-tank guns and the range of artillery.

Obviously it needs scripting and UV'ing which will come in a bit, but for now, the hardest part is over.

Oh yeah, got the models Felix, thanks! I'll go over them tomorrow.

Felix the Cat · Post by **Felix the Cat** » 16 Oct 2006, 07:03

If you want me to lower poly counts on anything make a note of it in this thread, I have a tendency to want to make wheels prettier than they need to be and stuff like that.

Then again, I note that the leIG 18 has the tire-wheel-axle thing going on... so I'm not sure what level of detail we're shooting for here.

Felix the Cat · Post by **Felix the Cat** » 16 Oct 2006, 07:04

Oh yeah, I hear we have a new dev website or something, PM me the password.

yuritch · Post by **yuritch** » 16 Oct 2006, 07:51

Sorry, I'm a bit late to this discussion.

SpikedHelmet wrote:...Of course the T-34 trumps 'em all with its 60 KPH road speed, coupled with its almost unparalleled off-road capability, outstanding reliability, heavy armament (in 85 series) and mass numbers.

Max speed alone doesn't tell the whole story. In real life situations T-34s were often outrun on the march by both the T-70 light tanks (and vehicles based on them such as SU-76) and IS-2 heavy tanks (and ISU-122, ISU-152 based on that tank), all of which had lower max speeds. That was because T-34 transmission was quite primitive (but very simple and cheap) and the tank had to slow down to 5 kph to make a turn (else it risked to break down). It could not turn in place (like most other tracked vehicles can), either, because it could not reverse one track relative to the other (but it could halt one track and so turn around it).

SpikedHelmet · Post by **SpikedHelmet** » 16 Oct 2006, 09:13

Not saying it was outstanding, but high road speed does make for very good mobility. If the Sherman could travel 60 KPH the war might have ended a lot quicker... Anyway, I still say the T-34 beats the Sherman hands-down.

SpikedHelmet · Post by **SpikedHelmet** » 16 Oct 2006, 09:18

You'll have to ask Nemo for that.. I don't even know what it is! Well, I know what mine is (we all have our own accounts or something).

scottdog · Post by **scottdog** » 16 Oct 2006, 11:01

Dam can't wait for the next realease, hopefully that cannon will be in there too.

And i changed my view on upgradable weapons. I think only veterans should get grenades( theres just too many nades in game otherwise) but i don't think they should get a new weap.

Warlord Zsinj · Post by **Warlord Zsinj** » 16 Oct 2006, 12:27

Is it possible to run a firing animation so that those infantry load the guns, block their ears, or atleast move around a little bit while the guns fire, rather then standing next to it? Might be worth spending a little while getting those to look good, that way you can just copy it onto all the other artillery you have.

Also, if that is the lightest artillery weapon, and is very much intended as support for infantry, perhaps you should consider building it from the barracks? Or allowing the engineer to build it along with the truck? Could make the early game more interesting, while the gun would be too expensive and long to build too early for it to ruin the current balance...

1v0ry_k1ng · Post by **1v0ry_k1ng** » 16 Oct 2006, 13:20

the sherman was a peice of junk compared to the other tanks of the time, it was just very mass producable. the t-34 had effective, sloped armour and was more than a match for most the german tanks. the sherman had a high profile, weak, unsloped armour and terrible optics. and weaker main weapons. they also burnt easily killing the crew in the case of a direct hit.

the main reason the germans suffered is that so much of their airforce was expended doing stupid things like bombing britan. the british had 4 engine bombers and 1 tonne bombs that pretty much reduced most the german industry to dust by the end of the war. hitler wasted time and resources making "SUper WEPONZZ" like the v2 cannon and buzzbomb sights, and fighting a potential ally (russia) to win the war.

so in this, the german have heavy tanks and defences, and the allies have artillery and aircraft?

Warlord Zsinj · Post by **Warlord Zsinj** » 16 Oct 2006, 14:48

*facepalm*

So much for the balancing thread. Such is the pitfall of aWWII mod...

Deathblane · Post by **Deathblane** » 16 Oct 2006, 15:17

Yeah, historical accuracy should definately be used to influence the ballence, but should not dictate it to the detriment of gameplay.

Oh and Lordo, the reasons for Germany's defeat are complex and were mostly to do with the failure of the eastern front (which was the 'true' war for Germany all along).

To be honest, D day and the liberation of europe can be equated to the last 10 minutes of a large game of AA, when your allies are dead, your front line is slowly collapsing, and then some cheeky b*stard attacks you in the rear.

SpikedHelmet · Post by **SpikedHelmet** » 16 Oct 2006, 18:16

Yes Zsinj, that's what I did with the mortar troops. You'll see.

Spring RTS Engine

Spring: 1944 v0.01 Alpha

A bit of info