BA Skirmish BETA2 (BA6.6)

[TheFatController]

Got a new mod concept for testing, this is very early work but just wanted to follow the old 'release early release often'.



Rules
- There are no bases, each player starts with a flag.
- You get free units at intervals (tanks).
- Use these units to gather points then return the units to your flag to collect the points.
- Your flag can use the points to instantly spawn in a selection of units (kbots).
- You can gather points by killing Clockworks (which spawn near metal spots) or by killing enemy units that carry them.
- Goal is to destroy the enemy teams flags

Note: Still in BETA, feedback required

Credit: Argh for the clockwork model ('springer' from Nanoblobs), KDR for the flag (lolimod)

Download: http://spring.jobjol.nl/show_file.php?id=1667

[Chojin]

Sounds nice!

[KaiserJ]

i get it... sounds like a lot of fun! any need for special maps to be made?

gonna try this out later tonight

[TheFatController]

Alpha3 seems much better paced, we had some ffa games fine but in a teamgame one team couldn't see their points for some reason - ill look into this tomorrow.

Ideally it'll work on any map, clockworks spawn on metal spots if applicable - we'll see how it progresses!

[KaiserJ]

i was imagining a FFA sort of map with protected coves around the outside for the flags to spawn in and be safe from being swarmed early... and metal spots in the middle in a sort of mazelike structure with reduced LOS, so that swarms from different players might accidentally clash while roaming for clockworks

[1v0ry_k1ng]

sweet concept

you should expand on it so more units are avaliable; the ability to morph 'upgrade' your flag at a cost so it builds diffrent units maybe? so in team games, one player could tech air or t2 etc

[TheFatController]

Fixed the invisible points issue and some other little things.

Flagged BETA 1, as much feedback as possible would be great

[BaNa]

Really really cool mod/thing

Few comments (all my opinions and all that):

- sumo is op (on small maps that somewhat favor kbots at least :D ), up cost pls

- marauder is up, it should cost 4-500 for what its doing on a non-water map and players wont readily play water maps because there is a very limited number of units that can traverse water. Put a different unit in its place maybe, because armlight has the mavvie that is good enough for that role.

- support seems a bit too much a secondary side, i can only see it working on big maps with many players on a team. They would totally be worth it if only they could rez, or if they had some power-rezzer unit. It would help if they could purchase atlases...

- with nothing to make e, rezzing should only cost time or players should have vastly more e income because this way it is easy to e stall

- different creeps would be cool, with more hp and perhaps more powerful weapons.

- it would be nice if there would be a modoption that allowed capture of flags, so that if you kill an enemy his flag becomes your own.

mod is really really cool, and i like the way rezzers behave unattended.

[TheFatController]

- sumo is op (on small maps that somewhat favor kbots at least :D ), up cost pls

One problem is when the Sumo is across the map it cant come back to rescue your flag like say a Razorback could - however 900 IS pretty cheap, I think maybe 1150ish would be better.

- marauder is up, it should cost 4-500 for what its doing on a non-water map and players wont readily play water maps because there is a very limited number of units that can traverse water. Put a different unit in its place maybe, because armlight has the mavvie that is good enough for that role.

I think I didn't realise just how shit the Marauder's guns are, one problem is that I don't want 'arm-light' to have everything cause players already prefer arm and like flash spam so 8/10 players would end up choosing it. I think it would work if they got the all terrain spider cheap (cause core light gets the karg) and cheaper marauders then one of the other new sides can have the mav.

support seems a bit too much a secondary side, i can only see it working on big maps with many players on a team. They would totally be worth it if only they could rez, or if they had some power-rezzer unit. It would help if they could purchase atlases...

Support does need a boost, i think everyone should beable to res, will look into that

- with nothing to make e, rezzing should only cost time or players should have vastly more e income because this way it is easy to e stall

This probably needs more balancing - the flags make energy (support makes and stores more) but if it's not enough this can be readjusted or the res energy can be removed.

- different creeps would be cool, with more hp and perhaps more powerful weapons.

Rare creeps are in the pipeline!

- it would be nice if there would be a modoption that allowed capture of flags, so that if you kill an enemy his flag becomes your own.

I was thinking something like an instant 1000 points for killing a flag, to relieve the cost of taking it. I think more mod options for variations on gameplay will come when the mode is balanced :)

[Wisse]

Points are taking way too long to transfer from unit to flag. Make it exponential or something, couse I had to stand next to flag for 5min to drop 1K points.

[Gota]

yep.
A few suggestions.
killing enemy units should give you points as well wouldnt you agree?
Also IMO removes tanks.
Why?
Harder to maneuver and micro than kbots plus if its all kbots it feels more squad like and like your using troops or something.
Id suggest capping unit amounts(and don't leave that to the lobby options since nobody will do it by themselves).
Bring in some interesting units with interesting abilities.
flash and stumpy are boring units for example.
Make all units have more HP and die slower to allow more time for individual unit microing.

Mavricks are good caue they heal fast but also artillery,all terrain units,emp bots,clocked units.
If its squad based you need interesting units with different abilities.
cap unit amounts based on amount of say map metal?or creep numbers?
maybe add clocked units that can cloak to a limited time to scout?

About the creeps.
make their respawn times much longer.
they aught to be oppertunity targets not the focus of the game,wouldnt you agree?
maybe Make them be able to shoot back and make different level creeps with stronger ones appearing further from the starting positions.

allow morphing and special abilities.
allowunits to morph after they gain some exp to stronger forms.
You can take the mavrick model form ba as a first mavrick form than take xta mav make ita big bigger and make it the second mav form than take the krogtar model make it a bit smaller and make it the level 3 mav.
Same with all set units...
Or you can make each unit has only one morph but 1-2 have like 4-6 with morphs that also add abilities.
Say a com unit that can make a blast(using a special key like the dgun key)around itself only hurting enemy units or a blast that emps all enemies around for a short time.

What i eman are comamnders that can morph a few times and besides gainingmore hp and dps also gain ne wabilitis that need to be microed to operate.

[Pxtl]

Killing gives you goodies is a positive feedback loop, making a close game turn into a one-sided stomping. I imagine even you could understand how this is a bad thing.

[Gota]

yes sorry i forgot to mention another feature that is a punishment of points after youv reached a certain percentage of the unit cap.Like say a after 40% of cap are reached you start getting only 75 % of points.after its 80% u get only 50..
I imagine even you can see how this will solve your problem.

[KDR_11k]

yes sorry i forgot to mention another feature that is a punishment of points after youv reached a certain percentage of the unit cap.Like say a after 40% of cap are reached you start getting only 75 % of points.after its 80% u get only 50..
I imagine even you can see how this will solve your problem.

No, that would do nothing. You killed an enemy unit, you gained a res advantage of however much that was worth. Giving you even a small amount of res increases that advantage. Obviously once the advantage is big enough you'll have an easier time killing more.

[TheFatController]

Changelog BETA2
- Shuffled some of the units and costs around, improved support, made light lighter etc.
- Lowered resurrection e cost.
- Added the first 2 power-ups.
- Critters spawn faster when there's few of them on the map.
- Fixed spectators only seeing one team's points.
- You now get an instant 1000 points for killing an enemy flag.

[TheFatController]

Issues following playtest
- Lua errors for a dead player: Got the solution to this will fix next version.
- Too spammy: Needs unit limits imo
- Too many critters on small maps: Obvious solution there

If anyone else has thoughts on the unit rearrangements or ideas for new sides (have a few not finalised yet..)

[Gota]

yes sorry i forgot to mention another feature that is a punishment of points after youv reached a certain percentage of the unit cap.Like say a after 40% of cap are reached you start getting only 75 % of points.after its 80% u get only 50..
I imagine even you can see how this will solve your problem.

No, that would do nothing. You killed an enemy unit, you gained a res advantage of however much that was worth. Giving you even a small amount of res increases that advantage. Obviously once the advantage is big enough you'll have an easier time killing more.

See Warcraft 3.When you lose a unit to the enemy and he gains xp perhaps unlocking another ability he has more advatage and your suppose to play on.Hey,it works.
No point arguing about it though since obviously fat controller is doing something different and has some better gameplay in mind..

[Wisse]

Arm Light sux in B2. Those spiders are completely useless. They're fragile plus they can't hit Clockwork in hundred years. I would prefer to see Zippers in their place.

[TheFatController]

No point arguing about it though since obviously fat controller is doing something different and has some better gameplay in mind..

How about getting out of this thread?

Arm Light sux in B2. Those spiders are completely useless. They're fragile plus they can't hit Clockwork in hundred years. I would prefer to see Zippers in their place.

Zipper would be way OP at flag killing, problem is core light has the equally terrible Pyro hmm... I think they could get the Warrior and arm heavy gets the hammer back cause at the moment arm heavy is the best side imo

[Wisse]

Spider can't hit Clockwork, that's the biggest problem. Spiders are also completely defenseless against any spawn vechs because they don't do any real damage, suck at close range plus they can't run away.

Zipper is quite fragile, it would get raped fast, but it would be amazing farmer which suits "light" side. Light arm has marauder and with zipper it would become ultimate hit'n'run which would be alot of fun. You could always bring back Maverick tho <3

Plus I think you can't balance this mod to work random vs random side in 1v1. When we started larger team games on different maps each side got more specific use which helped incredibly with balance.