lua aimbot

[chlue]

Where is the problem to create a release-cycle for LUA-widgets, so people can get their fresh copy of all-time standard widgets?
Why should spring be doomed to be an unmanaged, uncoltrollable piece of software? NO good software handles things like that, because the disadvantages are higher than the advantages.

http://wow-en.curse-gaming.com/files/addons/

I am pretty sure the fact that World of Warcraft is in your definition a "unmanaged, uncoltrollable piece of software" is one of the reasons, that there are over 8? million accounts, who pay money for that game every month. But you are right, Spring is afaik the first RTS, that allow this ammount of controll. A big advantage in my opinion.

I have allready changed some widgets by myself, because i liked, what they could do, but wasn't completely happy how they worked with some mods / the way they looked. While a command like ".nohelp" will help to make sure, that helper-ai's and widget cannot get to powerfull in certain situations, the fact, that anyone can change them fo fullfill their needs is one of the biggest advantages I see in LUA.

Ps: In my opinion ".nohelp" should be more flexible. Something like:
- unrestricted: the current off-state
- restricted: no build/move/attack-orders
- prohibited: restricted, plus everything else, what effect units (on/off, guard, stockpile, firestate,...)

So setting LUA to 'restricted' should ensure that widgets and global-ais should not be too powerfull, but it would still allow widgets to help you in boring routine tasks.

[AF]

Trepan, the lua and groupAI thing isnt the big deal. Although there are a lot of lua features that would have taken say an extra 0.0001% of effort to implement via AI, indeed a lot of lua functions would be identical tot eh AI versions, except "write AI function, copy paste, add the bits that bind it to lua, marvel at the 2 to 3 lines of code you've just written". I have nothing against Lua UI itself, and many groupAIs are bound to have been better off as lua widgets anyway, but as it is the only groupAI update is fixing that typo in the economy AI which isnt worth using anyway, ETA AI looks ugly next to lua UI anyway, and map exporter AI is broken by changes you made to spring for lua APIs.

As it is I can well see the following happen, just as similair happenings have happened in the past with other thigns

1: Its a minor thing, we dont need to fix it right now, I'll just do it later
2: I'm busy cant you see that?
3: What? That isnt broken at all!
4: Oh so it is broken, why dont you fix it?
5: Oh you cant fix it yourself, well I'm not fixing it
6: This isnt a flaw its a feature!
7: Tough I'm putting my foot down, Its not being changed

Expect 3 days/weeks/months between each stage

The most recent and prominent example being the time everybody blamed betalord for breaking map packs and tobi put his foot down and forced everyone to split their map packs because of they blamed betalord.

And indeed there are examples of this process that continue today that've still been going on since when SJ was in charge and we were all wondering when spring would be released, which usually manifested in perpetual complaining in #sy by certain individuals.

Now for quashing the blatant lies:

You could post patches to improve the AI interface,
but it would appear that you prefer to whine.

Lies!!! You know full well I cant test spring because of my 8800 vista drivers, I could start a patch but I wouldnt have a clue if it worked, or if it caused BSOD' because I cant test it, even then AIs built in VS 2005 dont work with spring built in VS2005 anyway, and I have no mingw32 debugger working either.

is that I don't see a lot a multiplayer games using GlobalAIs

This is a big assumption, assuming that your particular games are indicative of the whole (I myself dont remember ever seeing you in a battle at all and I'm on the lobby quite a lot). This is just an excuse to be sloppy.

[LordMatt]

Phail.

Less arguing with trepan, more useful stuff please.

[trepan]

AF:

"and map exporter AI is broken by changes you made to spring for lua APIs"

Which changes?

I've also noticed that you didn't mention the AI GetElevation() situation in that last
post of yours. If you are going to accuse someone of having broken something,
please make sure that they did indeed break it (and reference a SVN revision
if possible, or provide some indication as to what you think broke the code.)

As for there not being a lot of multiplayer games using GlobalAIs, I think a poll
would be better then trying to argue the obvious with you

[tombom]

AF, I'm not entirely sure what you're complaining about. That GroupAIs aren't getting much attention because they were never popular and LuaUI is better isn't really a big deal to me. Maybe you can explain your problem better.

The most recent and prominent example being the time everybody blamed betalord for breaking map packs and tobi put his foot down and forced everyone to split their map packs because of they blamed betalord.

This did seem pretty petty to me, but it's only really been the once as far as I can see.

[Tobi]

AF, please stop whining / telling lies, bullshit and other FUD and start doing constructive things...

You really should start to realize by now that Spring devs generally don't have infinite time to fix all kinds of minor stuff only you whine about.

The most recent and prominent example being the time everybody blamed betalord for breaking map packs and tobi put his foot down and forced everyone to split their map packs because of they blamed betalord.

Lies, you know it had technical reasons (ever heard of map grading?).

[tombom]

Lies, you know it had technical reasons (ever heard of map grading?).

http://spring.clan-sy.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=7296

I think he's referring to this. I realise there were good technical reasons but that post made it seem like "I have a fix that can easily be made but I'm not doing it because I don't like what a couple of people were saying offsite"

[AF]

The most recent and prominent example being the time everybody blamed betalord for breaking map packs and tobi put his foot down and forced everyone to split their map packs because of they blamed betalord.

I was going to fix it over the weekend, but looking at how certain people here and on smoths forum attack Betalord personally over a technical issue I won't fix it anymore.

finished searching the document

If somethings left till later, it never gets done. This pattern repeats itself throughout spring developments entire history. Devs also have a habit of saying one thing and missing out bits, which they really should have mentioned to begin with. Such as the map grades and tobi, of which the very first mention ever on the forums of this issue was mentioned in this very thread.

And I do do constuctive things. I do not tell lies, rather I see something and you assume because I do not know something I was never told that it was a lie. I see lack of communication, you see lies, so next time I say something and you know it isnt true because you know something I dont, dont assume I do know it and say I'm lieing.

Now please, stop making such a bigger and bigger deal out of things. I'd said my piece in my first post and now I'm purely defending myself, and I'm tired of people treating me like crap then wondering why I bite back.

[trepan]

Lies

"submarines chasing after you in the code fixing your mistakes to fix AAI"

"and map exporter AI is broken by changes you made to spring for lua APIs"

[rattle]

Hahaha

Someone who worked on a combat flight sim (especially the HUD) should have an easy time to get an aimbot done.
This isn't cheating, this is thinking. Would you fire your maingun, assuming you are the gunner of a tank, straight at a moving target or would you aim in advance?

[AF]

[Tobi]

selective quoting FTL

[AF]

*_* tobi, enough for ruining the mood again, that was your entire post in that quote, and whatsmore it was your only post in the entire thread. All the threads before it are *wtf betalord ftl!* and all the threads after it are *caydr flames you, whose flamed by fang, whos locked by Noize*

anyway where were we:

[LordMatt]

This clearly isn't going anywhere productive.