New Spring RTS Wallpaper section ?

[hoijui]

i agree with MidKnight, and..
extra credit for using MS as good example and even being right with that.

It should be no different with the logo then with everything else in spring, or as such, in open-source in general:
make what you want, and if it is good (usually: people like it), it will be used. makes no sense to once vote something as the official logo, and then disallow others to be used in certain "official" places.

one thing though.. Satirik, why are you still not using png?

[AF]

Because if someone makes a better set of logos and artwork theres nothing stopping that becoming officially sanctioned.

But otherwise for official stuff we have to think of consistency. Wallpapers on the forums etc are irrelevant, afterall not everything has to be official.

Official wallpapers on the other hand have to be consistent, else we end up with a hodge podge similar to a noob set loose in powerpoint.

May I also point out that the microsoft example is moot because those aren't all logos of the same thing, and they have their own spec they follow to the letter.

The damage of having a parade of arbitrary images with conflicting and clashing styles in the promotional media isn't worth it when theres nothing stopping you putting wallpapers and logos such as satiriks on your own sites or in forum threads.

So make logos as you like, but if you want it to be officially sanctioned then either follow the guidelines, or make your logo design fit to replace the current one. That means installer artwork, replacement headers for the site, icons for the programs, and a design that scales from uber big RGBA to uber tiny monochrome.

[Jazcash]

replacement headers for the site

The logo at the top of this site is actually an image in its own element, not bitmapped to the changing header behind it. Just sayin'...

[Satirik]

Satirik, why are you still not using png?

png => lossless compression => 1.4MB, jpeg => quality 100% => 700kB

you can use png if you need transparency or if you make small pictures with a limited number of colors (png-8 is a kind of compression), for big pictures jpeg is always better unless you want a lossless compression

[Hobo Joe]

Satirik, why are you still not using png?

png => lossless compression => 1.4MB, jpeg => quality 100% => 700kB

you can use png if you need transparency or if you make small pictures with a limited number of colors (png-8 is a kind of compression), for big pictures jpeg is always better unless you want a lossless compression

Yes but every time you save a .jpg it get more crappy.


@AF there doesn't have to a single 'official' logo. We have the logo in essence - the half sun shape. That's the logo, I don't see any reason why we shouldn't be 'allowed' (not like anything is stopping us? I advertised Spring with Satiriks version of the logo, I think it's much better) to use something different, it's still horribly obvious by looking at this logo and the 'official' logo that they're the same thing. So the one we have now is used as the header for the official site, which is fine. But no reason to not use variations for anything else. See MidKnights post.

[Jazcash]

Yes but every time you save a .jpg it get more crappy.

That's what PSD files are for.

Although, in the case of wallpapers, I tend to be a PNG man, simply because whenever you open a JPG, it loses some quality. This includes the Windows desktop background function which means if I use a a JPG wallpaper, over time it will look worse, and worse and worse and I end up having to redownload the image and set it up again. Also, with desktop backgrounds, file size is irrelevant because it's already on your PC, you don't need to download it from the net every time.

Don't get me wrong, JPG files have their place as most the large images in Spring Network are JPG, simply for file size reasons, it speeds up the loading drastically. Also, with Spring screenies, photos and the like, JPG really shines as quality loss can be hard to pick up if you keep the quality above 80%.

[Satirik]

Yes but every time you save a .jpg it get more crappy.

everytime you recompress a jpeg ... if you just save it it won't loose any quality, do you always use flac to send music or audio to someone ? no you use mp3 or ogg, you just don't recompress them everytime because it makes no sense

Yes but every time you save a .jpg it get more crappy.

That's what PSD files are for.

not at all, psd is photoshop's format meant to save everything you can do in photoshop (layers, masks etc etc)

[AF]

@AF there doesn't have to a single 'official' logo. We have the logo in essence - the half sun shape. That's the logo, I don't see any reason why we shouldn't be 'allowed' (not like anything is stopping us? I advertised Spring with Satiriks version of the logo, I think it's much better) to use something different, it's still horribly obvious by looking at this logo and the 'official' logo that they're the same thing. So the one we have now is used as the header for the official site, which is fine. But no reason to not use variations for anything else. See MidKnights post.

Just as its obvious this is a microsoft logo:



You would never see microsoft using such a logo though in marketing. There's nothing wrong with it being distributed on websites, but if you were to push it onto microsofts marketing department they would tear into it and massacre any prospect of it being used to advertise microsoft products. Its fanart.

What's more, one could argue that the AVG logo is actually a microsoft windows logo flipped horizontally then vertically.

Really it is simple:

What AF says:

Do what you like, but official stuff uses official guidelines. If someone makes a better logo then yay, but we need to observe consistency so that we don't look amateur.

What HoboJoe is saying:

We can have 5000 official logos, and we can do as we please and there will not be any consequences

We're not the only open source project that has them either:

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Official

I don't see any bans on ubuntu wallpapers by users, they're not included in ubuntu unless they fit in ( aka follow the guidelines ), but they exist.

KDE too:

http://techbase.kde.org/Development/Gui ... G/KDE_Logo

Gnome:

http://live.gnome.org/BrandGuidelines


Furthermore using the same justification we can say that Neuralizes modified spring logos are not spring logos, because he modified the sun vector.

If we then want to be loose with our terms rather than strict, we can go as far as saying that this is a spring logo:


(solar water heating systems)



(Wasaya group Inc)



(Down 2 earth energy )

So clearly the vector logo is obvious to us because we are here, and have been here for such a long time. But to the world at large its not a spring logo. Its a setting/rising sun.


So why cant we make spring logo wallpapers that dont follow the spec?

YOU CAN!!

Just not as an official wallpaper. Plenty of people do it and its fine. Heck I did it too:



I didnt demand it be put up on the wallpapers page, or that we switch all our icons.

(notice my orange concept logos do not follow the basic spring symbol, theyve been modified in proportion, have twice as many spikes, and many other changes, but you'd still consider it a custom spring logo )

If you want to put it up as a new official logo artwork branding? Make a better one. That's how I did it. I made consistent well designed artwork that fitted and was convenient. If you can make better ones then great, go do it, that's what I did. Unsatisfied with my work I brought out version 2 and it was accepted, better quality, sharper edges, changes from feedback, and Ill be doing it again with further refinements soon.

So why is it so important we're consistent with our official branding?

Because to be inconsistent is unproffesional. It sends the message we dont car,e and if we dont care about how we look in our artwork, then we must not care about other stuff too! Like he artwork ingame, or our stability, or gameplay standards. New people dont know what our standards are. Its easy for you to say "but our standards are high! Theres nothing wrong!" but they dont know that.

"But we're all amateurs anyway" you say? But we aspire to be more! We've made vast improvements since spring came out in the quality and skill here, and we'll no doubt make similar leaps and bounds in the following 5 years, so why ruin it with a hodge podge of pseudo official artwork when we can have a well thought out consistent branding supported by fan art?

[Satirik]

Gnome:

http://live.gnome.org/BrandGuidelines

Color Variations

The GNOME logo may be produced using a variety of colors; please ensure the colors you choose contrast well with the background.

The logo should be clearly discernable. Avoid the use of patterns that obscure the logo's form.

[Satirik]

i don't want to replace the 'official' logo, i don't think it has to be replaced but i updated the psd with two (with and without glow) easy to use versions of this logo for people who like it and want to use it somewhere

I don't like it. It works on these shots but I feel it is largely inflexible as a design goes.

not bad ?, but ofc if you really want flexibility just use the spring logo's shape

[AF]

• Thats the gnome logo spec not ours
• Even then if it were on the spec, you still wouldnt be complying.

Here is an example of that particular guideline that would comply:



It doesnt follow the spec to the letter but Im happy with it, it isn't a major deviation and there can be leeway, the spec isnt ironclad, it should be, but that would be an unrealistic expectation and Im not that naive.

I like your logo satirik, I just dont agree with putting it up on the main site as official media. I can understand why some people would prefer the golden ray logo over mine, afterall people have said mine is too glossy and they arent keen on the blue

[Satirik]

• Thats the gnome logo spec not ours
• Even then if it were on the spec, you still wouldnt be complying.

Here is an example of that particular guideline that would comply:



It doesnt follow the spec to the letter but Im happy with it, it isn't a major deviation and there can be leeway, the spec isnt ironclad, it should be, but that would be an unrealistic expectation and Im not that naive.

I like your logo satirik, I just dont agree with putting it up on the main site as official media

I can understand why some people would prefer the golden ray logo over mine, afterall people have said mine is too glossy and they arent keen on the blue

im sorry but this picture isn't the spring logo, your blue and red version will be replaced by something else one day, but this



will stay, it was and will always be the spring logo

[Jazcash]

your blue and red version will be replaced by something else one day

I hope not but I doubt it will anyway. It can easily take different forms, like the avatar I made which AF posted above. With yours, it's pretty but harder to bend it around to make it suit different projects and purposes. As Smoth said, it's less "flexible". The image you posted with the multicoloured background looked horrible, but then again, I'm sure anything with that background would

[AF]

That was neither my point nor relevant.

If you want to be a pedant about the logos original form then why is it black and not red? Where are the bevels? Where's the funky red bevelled text?

[FireStorm_]

Because to be inconsistent is unproffesional. It sends the message we dont car,e and if we dont care about how we look in our artwork,

This comment really spoke to me, and I want to say I too think it is important to consider this while making brand-artwork or identity-artwork; in other words Logo's.

But then I read it again, and something struck me.

then we must not care about other stuff too! Like he artwork ingame, or our stability, or gameplay standards.

And it made me wonder:
Which artwork is considered inherent in Spring and cannot be considers game-specific, (even if it is shared between multiple games)?

While writing this I'm afraid I'll offend you because i do think you make the clumsy mistake seeing Spring and its games to much as one fenomena that should succeed by gaining popularity as one. Ofcouse it is my personal opinion, but i think it better to see them as separate when thinking about, and discussing marketing and brand issues.

Actually I think you are very talented but sometimes i think you shift the focus of issues to the wrong point, and perhaps the where you apply your talent too.

[Satirik]

your blue and red version will be replaced by something else one day

I hope not but I doubt it will anyway. It can easily take different forms, like the avatar I made which AF posted above. With yours, it's pretty but harder to bend it around to make it suit different projects and purposes. As Smoth said, it's less "flexible". The image you posted with the multicoloured background looked horrible, but then again, I'm sure anything with that background would

ok im done talking with you guys, can someone clean this thread to remove everything related to "changing the official logo" and anything not related to spring wallpapers ? (or split it)

[AF]

You should start a blog with this stuff in and latest tasclient changes, would be popular methinks.

As for logos of games, I don't need to say anything about them, they're not using anything I produced, and they appear to have it all sorted in many cases. Zwzsg etc are pretty serious about sorting a Kernel Panic logo and Im not sure but they have have one, S44 has had a logo and a website for a long time, Smoths got some pretty snazzy gundam artwork, and the starwars guys have a top notch logo too.

Whatever we advertise spring as, and whatever we focus it on, we need to be consistent about what we consider official in our artwork, and if what we have isn't suitable we need to think of how we can fix it or replace it.

Its a shame the original logo competition thread by SJ was lost

[MasterZH]

It needs to not dump lossy .JPG - if we need .JPG we can edit and resave it ourselves

The somewhat ugly aliasing

New and improved Stamper

which mod is it?

[smoth]

evolution rts. <-clicky
or warevo SNICKER

[knorke]

if gimp would correctly load .psd without fucking up transparency on layers maybe it would have looked more official.