Well... you cant say fairer than that...
Someone suggest stuff :)
I say no bans on anything exept exessive spamming oO
A slight moderation critique.
Moderator: Moderators
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SwiftSpear
- Classic Community Lead
- Posts: 7287
- Joined: 12 Aug 2005, 09:29
Well, we most likely will enforce restriction of flaming, as well as extreamly lude acts (there was a guy on looking for cyber sex partners one night... he was told to take it elsewhere). And I personally think that stuff should be the bare minimum of restrictions we place on client. If people want stricter or laxer enforcement against swearing or enforcement against other things like advertizing games or really anything, then those are topic up for discussion.
The game is Spring, not 'Trolling and Assorted Asshattery.' The lobby isn't the message boards. It's not there to facilitate communication of ideas and feelings. It is there first and foremost to allow people to play Spring. The anarchist arguements are juvenile and irrelevant.
You misbehave and get a kick/mute...
You repeat this behavior to cause grief, then don't be shocked when you find yourself banned.
There is a vast difference between a decent person who slips up and someone who is acting with mal-intent. When you make it clear that you don't intend to cease causing trouble, who needs you? You're not seriously going to argue that you are helping people organize games are you?
The fact is some people like to cause as much grief/trouble as they can. This whole issue, as it turns out, was _self_admittedly_ caused for the amusement of one such troll.
Someone I wouldn't blame anyone from quickly tiring of dealing with... And I don't think it at all unreasonable to _ask_ someone to cease being provocative in order to not have to deal with same said person any more.
If the issue is consistency then fine: no swearing nor abusive nor threatening speach in #main. Problem solved. There is absolutely no reason anyone needs to behave like that in the default channel to facilitate playing games of Spring. Enforcing rules that are 'too strict' in the lobby is far safer and more pleasant then the opposite. We are talking about issues where compliance with a moderators request involves virtually no effort. The only time people are ending up banned (and all temporarily so far, afaik) is when they are causing trouble on purpose.
It's not like people are geting banned for accidentally swearing.
Ultimately all that matters is what makes the experience of organizing games as smooth as possible for as many people as possible, given the available resources. This isn't some big freedom of conciousness type issue.
PS Why does banning spammers make sense when perma-mute completely solves the problem? I think banning is for people that require repeated application of lessor moderation and/or are commiting non channel-message based trouble.
You misbehave and get a kick/mute...
You repeat this behavior to cause grief, then don't be shocked when you find yourself banned.
There is a vast difference between a decent person who slips up and someone who is acting with mal-intent. When you make it clear that you don't intend to cease causing trouble, who needs you? You're not seriously going to argue that you are helping people organize games are you?
The fact is some people like to cause as much grief/trouble as they can. This whole issue, as it turns out, was _self_admittedly_ caused for the amusement of one such troll.
Someone I wouldn't blame anyone from quickly tiring of dealing with... And I don't think it at all unreasonable to _ask_ someone to cease being provocative in order to not have to deal with same said person any more.
If the issue is consistency then fine: no swearing nor abusive nor threatening speach in #main. Problem solved. There is absolutely no reason anyone needs to behave like that in the default channel to facilitate playing games of Spring. Enforcing rules that are 'too strict' in the lobby is far safer and more pleasant then the opposite. We are talking about issues where compliance with a moderators request involves virtually no effort. The only time people are ending up banned (and all temporarily so far, afaik) is when they are causing trouble on purpose.
It's not like people are geting banned for accidentally swearing.
Ultimately all that matters is what makes the experience of organizing games as smooth as possible for as many people as possible, given the available resources. This isn't some big freedom of conciousness type issue.
PS Why does banning spammers make sense when perma-mute completely solves the problem? I think banning is for people that require repeated application of lessor moderation and/or are commiting non channel-message based trouble.
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Felix the Cat
- Posts: 2383
- Joined: 15 Jun 2005, 17:30
Yeah, but see, some of us like to chat in the main chat.
Unfortunately, I probably won't be chatting much more there, seeing as I've been bad and such and insulted a whole bunch of people. I'll wait a week, they'll forget it. The three rules of Internet is that the Internet has a short memory, the Internet is the home of asshattery, and the Internet has a short memory.
Unfortunately, I probably won't be chatting much more there, seeing as I've been bad and such and insulted a whole bunch of people. I'll wait a week, they'll forget it. The three rules of Internet is that the Internet has a short memory, the Internet is the home of asshattery, and the Internet has a short memory.
On that line of thought, mom, why allow for any conversation in the lobby at all save for the questions of new players or the technical resolutions that patches hopefully end with? Who could answer said questions, and in what manner? Is the term "asshattery" intended to lend you deductive credit?
Your conclusion being apparent, or the logical end to your musings, how do you define the word "community?" If it consists solely of those who program/mod Spring, then what purpose do you serve?
A final note on age: how is this considered a legitimate attack upon a person (to the degree that attacking the person can ever be legitimate ~~)? Kixxie's a fair bit younger than you yourself are, yet he (subjectively) seems to be better adjusted (attacking the person with an underlying point).
Your conclusion being apparent, or the logical end to your musings, how do you define the word "community?" If it consists solely of those who program/mod Spring, then what purpose do you serve?
A final note on age: how is this considered a legitimate attack upon a person (to the degree that attacking the person can ever be legitimate ~~)? Kixxie's a fair bit younger than you yourself are, yet he (subjectively) seems to be better adjusted (attacking the person with an underlying point).
So far ive been kicked more than 3 times for typing the way i typed the following post. I dislike typing in complete sentences in chat rooms. and it is far from spam.
Fecal Fiesta is lewd.
pimped version of xta is lewd.
i think we should all rethink names that dont bring our imagination to life.
how about we call it the "cool version of xta"
and the fiesta mod.
those are my critiques, because after discussing this with smoth, lewd behavior is causing the downfall of civilization as we know it.
i request perma ban.
/sarcasm off.
Fecal Fiesta is lewd.
pimped version of xta is lewd.
i think we should all rethink names that dont bring our imagination to life.
how about we call it the "cool version of xta"
and the fiesta mod.
those are my critiques, because after discussing this with smoth, lewd behavior is causing the downfall of civilization as we know it.
i request perma ban.
/sarcasm off.
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SwiftSpear
- Classic Community Lead
- Posts: 7287
- Joined: 12 Aug 2005, 09:29
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PauloMorfeo
- Posts: 2004
- Joined: 15 Dec 2004, 20:53
If there was no extra provocation i would say that that was too zealous. After all, fecal (it was about that word, no?) is even an official word and not slang(?) or something like that.
Kind of reminds me of Penis or Vagina, which, if said in a game, are a tremendous insult to many people while it is acceptable all kind of visual and psicological violence. Like GTA where we go around beating all sorts of people with bats and sticks, shooting them, watching they're blood spill, but we can't even see a nipple without it getting censured with a blur.
Anyway, beeing a moderator is a bitch, as Decimator can confirm.
Kind of reminds me of Penis or Vagina, which, if said in a game, are a tremendous insult to many people while it is acceptable all kind of visual and psicological violence. Like GTA where we go around beating all sorts of people with bats and sticks, shooting them, watching they're blood spill, but we can't even see a nipple without it getting censured with a blur.
Anyway, beeing a moderator is a bitch, as Decimator can confirm.
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Felix the Cat
- Posts: 2383
- Joined: 15 Jun 2005, 17:30
Well, if it's a bitch, why do it? I'm sure that Decimator could message Betalord and be de-moderatored within a couple of days. It would please us because we wouldn't have to deal with overly zealous moderation, and it would please him because he wouldn't have to deal with watching all of our potty language for us.
Sounds like a win-win situation!
Sounds like a win-win situation!
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Forboding Angel
- Evolution RTS Developer
- Posts: 14673
- Joined: 17 Nov 2005, 02:43
because you 3 have started a personal crusade against him? I think not.Felix the Cat wrote:Well, if it's a bitch, why do it? I'm sure that Decimator could message Betalord and be de-moderatored within a couple of days. It would please us because we wouldn't have to deal with overly zealous moderation, and it would please him because he wouldn't have to deal with watching all of our potty language for us.
Sounds like a win-win situation!
This is part of the reason why I was not for moderators.... people who exist and thrive on being contrarian.
who made this personal? i know i havent, maybe its still stuck in your mind smoth that people actually care about what happens on the internet when in fact most dont.
If i was to try to start something personal with anyone online it would be Smoth, since i know more about him than anyone, since he decided to tell me his life story in his PM's he annoyed me with the other night.
its not real life, and im still confused how this all of a sudden became personal attacks on deci. Deci is a great mod let him keep doing what he loves/hates, no biggy, mods are great to stop spamming.
but heres the thing.
I dont care if whoever is a mod or not, could care less who is mods, I could care less who has what power, Its the internet, if you mute 1 of my names, ill make another, all i do is chat, if i get muted for doing the 1 thing i use your "chat room" for who really cares?
this is the same mindset most people on the internet have, and the entire reason why the IGNORE FEATURE should/ would be the best option to have in the chat room.
that way I dont have to listen to Forboding /Smoth trying to PM me threatening to have me perma banned / have me perma muted / trying to explain the ethics of chatting online/ why they are still in highschool and taking calculus (wow) and how they know how to act correctly on the internet, because they are Mature.
I dont want to hear your life story, you got an opinion? keep it to yourself.
+1 for ignore feature.
That way Forboding etc can just ignore whoever they want and these problems never arise. Since i think we all know its the whiners that always make problems arise.
If i knew how to code id help do it :/ trying to learn c++ now :/
If i was to try to start something personal with anyone online it would be Smoth, since i know more about him than anyone, since he decided to tell me his life story in his PM's he annoyed me with the other night.
its not real life, and im still confused how this all of a sudden became personal attacks on deci. Deci is a great mod let him keep doing what he loves/hates, no biggy, mods are great to stop spamming.
but heres the thing.
I dont care if whoever is a mod or not, could care less who is mods, I could care less who has what power, Its the internet, if you mute 1 of my names, ill make another, all i do is chat, if i get muted for doing the 1 thing i use your "chat room" for who really cares?
this is the same mindset most people on the internet have, and the entire reason why the IGNORE FEATURE should/ would be the best option to have in the chat room.
that way I dont have to listen to Forboding /Smoth trying to PM me threatening to have me perma banned / have me perma muted / trying to explain the ethics of chatting online/ why they are still in highschool and taking calculus (wow) and how they know how to act correctly on the internet, because they are Mature.
I dont want to hear your life story, you got an opinion? keep it to yourself.
+1 for ignore feature.
That way Forboding etc can just ignore whoever they want and these problems never arise. Since i think we all know its the whiners that always make problems arise.
If i knew how to code id help do it :/ trying to learn c++ now :/
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Forboding Angel
- Evolution RTS Developer
- Posts: 14673
- Joined: 17 Nov 2005, 02:43
deci bored you with pm's?
You're an idiot. He posted those pm's in teamspeak for all of us to see.
I don't think I've ever pmed you on the forums, and it's always you pming me on tasclient. Would you like me to pull up the logs?
BTW, all of us are in our mid 20's and smoth is near 30 iirc. You're full of shit dude. You 3 go around with the express purpose of irritating and causing grief to any who cross your path, then you come into places like this and attempt to act self righteous and that you're the victims. Please, not everyone is that stupid.
You're an idiot. He posted those pm's in teamspeak for all of us to see.
I don't think I've ever pmed you on the forums, and it's always you pming me on tasclient. Would you like me to pull up the logs?
BTW, all of us are in our mid 20's and smoth is near 30 iirc. You're full of shit dude. You 3 go around with the express purpose of irritating and causing grief to any who cross your path, then you come into places like this and attempt to act self righteous and that you're the victims. Please, not everyone is that stupid.
never said anything about deci boring me.
I said Smoth. please proof read.
WOW, Now you are calling me names? thanks, you just made your whole argument pointless.
And yes I am shivering in my boots over all the chat logs you probably have of me, since you seem to collect all the information i ever type.
and what happened to the perma mute discussion forboding, where a mod said the fault is 50% the whiners "you" and then it dissapeared? im just wondering :/
oh and you are correct i do PM you because i dont hold grudges. I look for games to play, i dont sit around like you ignoring people because they said something that i disliked the other night.
I only meant PM's in tasclient, i never meant anything other.
edit.
btw go ahead post all the chat logs you ever wanted too :) we know you like to try to prove your points. however Pointless they are.
edit#2
I said Smoth. please proof read.
WOW, Now you are calling me names? thanks, you just made your whole argument pointless.
And yes I am shivering in my boots over all the chat logs you probably have of me, since you seem to collect all the information i ever type.
and what happened to the perma mute discussion forboding, where a mod said the fault is 50% the whiners "you" and then it dissapeared? im just wondering :/
oh and you are correct i do PM you because i dont hold grudges. I look for games to play, i dont sit around like you ignoring people because they said something that i disliked the other night.
I only meant PM's in tasclient, i never meant anything other.
edit.
btw go ahead post all the chat logs you ever wanted too :) we know you like to try to prove your points. however Pointless they are.
edit#2
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smokeynseinor
- Posts: 44
- Joined: 21 Oct 2004, 12:19
Cripes, Im very thankful that we have mods in the client a lot of the time now. Keep up the good work guys I really appreciate it.
The ignore feature would be great I agree on that Journ. People may not be malicious but often 12 yr olds (I'm only 17) can annoy the hell out of me with their immuturity/lack of intelligence/Pitaful attemps at satire.
On another note what about having another place on the client to chat about less spring orientated subjects? Often I talk to people about global matters etc but not to the degree that I would want to talk to them on msn. Suggestions?
Please, Give the Mods and other players a break, The Mods and Devs dont get paid and we all come here to play a game and have fun not winge 24/7.
The ignore feature would be great I agree on that Journ. People may not be malicious but often 12 yr olds (I'm only 17) can annoy the hell out of me with their immuturity/lack of intelligence/Pitaful attemps at satire.
On another note what about having another place on the client to chat about less spring orientated subjects? Often I talk to people about global matters etc but not to the degree that I would want to talk to them on msn. Suggestions?
Please, Give the Mods and other players a break, The Mods and Devs dont get paid and we all come here to play a game and have fun not winge 24/7.
Seriously, Forboding - suck up your muppet like smoth and I have. On a related note, I'm older than smoth. =P
To answer your Felix question, I'll first assure you that Felix is in no way on "my side" in anything, and that we happen to agree in the instance of moderation to a degree is the purest happenstance. Then again, I seem to have offended every sodomite in Spring with a few light hearted jabs at their shenanigans - folks who by their very nom de plumes are supposed to be light hearted! oO
To hazard a guess, I would say that Felix switched to the moderation lite camp after Decimator kicked him one night when he was emotionally distraught and said a potty word; kinda like you are, now. ~~ If you're upset about all of this because you feel left out of the fun, I'm by no means excluding you - muppet up!
Finally, I would ~once again~ like to note that the only person that seems to be taking any sort of action against Decimator seriously (with the possible exception of Felix, but we can all get a little rowdy now and then) is ~you~ Forboding. If you were actually countering an argument that anyone present had made, you'd have a point, but you aren't - way to slam that straw man to the mat.
"Come on, guys. This is a serious situation. I'm a puppet..."
To answer your Felix question, I'll first assure you that Felix is in no way on "my side" in anything, and that we happen to agree in the instance of moderation to a degree is the purest happenstance. Then again, I seem to have offended every sodomite in Spring with a few light hearted jabs at their shenanigans - folks who by their very nom de plumes are supposed to be light hearted! oO
To hazard a guess, I would say that Felix switched to the moderation lite camp after Decimator kicked him one night when he was emotionally distraught and said a potty word; kinda like you are, now. ~~ If you're upset about all of this because you feel left out of the fun, I'm by no means excluding you - muppet up!
Finally, I would ~once again~ like to note that the only person that seems to be taking any sort of action against Decimator seriously (with the possible exception of Felix, but we can all get a little rowdy now and then) is ~you~ Forboding. If you were actually countering an argument that anyone present had made, you'd have a point, but you aren't - way to slam that straw man to the mat.
"Come on, guys. This is a serious situation. I'm a puppet..."
Last edited by Tired on 02 Mar 2006, 10:38, edited 1 time in total.
I did nothing of the sortJournier wrote:that way I dont have to listen to Forboding /Smoth trying to PM me threatening to have me perma banned
I did not do that.Journier wrote:/ have me perma muted /
Dude, I am in my mid 20s... where did you get your information. Also, I am almost done with my degree in computer science.Journier wrote: trying to explain the ethics of chatting online/ why they are still in highschool and taking calculus (wow)
I am more mature then most. However, that does not really say alot because it is relative. And yeah, I did say that ADULTS have the sense to know when to and when not to use profane/vulgar language.Journier wrote: and how they know how to act correctly on the internet, because they are Mature.
I did not offer it... but since you asked.... I was born in... I stoped caring.Journier wrote:/ I dont want to hear your life story, you got an opinion? keep it to yourself.
.if only more people had backed me earlier on it.+1 for ignore feature.
Yeah, because I have created nothing but problems.That way Forboding etc can just ignore whoever they want and these problems never arise. Since i think we all know its the whiners that always make problems arise.
I do not want to sound negative but there is a difference between writing good code and your first program. You may want to find someone that you can pass bits of code to so they can help teach you to program right.If i knew how to code id help do it :/ trying to learn c++ now :/
Moving on...
OH GAWD NO! he he you old fartTired wrote:Seriously, Forboding - suck up your muppet like smoth and I have. On a related note, I'm older than smoth. =P
You may want to stop mentioning that, I have a feeling that if you drop it the others will eventually drop it as well.Then again, I seem to have offended every sodomite in Spring with a few light hearted jabs at their shenanigans - folks who by their very nom de plumes are supposed to be light hearted
[/quote]oh man... where does get those wonderful toys
an ignore fuction would be great.
Then mods only hav to pay attention to spam... which should lead to auto kick/mute/ban/whateverand then we wouldn't need mods anymore which would be even better.
Also i would like that if we could make our own channels, where we can set the topic and perhaps kick unwanted ppl, or perhaps we could have keyed channels... Now only if Betalord would have time, then we could continue without mods
Then mods only hav to pay attention to spam... which should lead to auto kick/mute/ban/whateverand then we wouldn't need mods anymore which would be even better.
Also i would like that if we could make our own channels, where we can set the topic and perhaps kick unwanted ppl, or perhaps we could have keyed channels... Now only if Betalord would have time, then we could continue without mods