Units OUT of the map! :O

[Gigamez]

its being a dick and deserves an ip ban. he used the peeper trick.

to clarify: this is in no way a "smart and okay" way to use the system, it is writing a widget that exploits bugs to make your units invulnerable. It is on par with specmonkeying or rewriting your spring so you see everything. I am surprised the host was tolerant of it, most hosts I know ban on sight for this kind of bullshit. Maybe a friend of his was doing it.

i'm totally agreed with you.
Me and my clan-mates were very angry with the admin [LoEt]Lampe for his support and his continuous mocks against us. In the next game we combombed him immediatly, and he bkick all [iTA] from all TERA servers.
Personally i never ever play anymore in this way and in these servers administered in a so-discriminating way.
i hope that this is only an episode and the community's thought is not the same of [LoEt]Lampe..

I'm sorry for what it's happened later, but this thing for me is madness, impossible to accept! :D

[Johannes]

its being a dick and deserves an ip ban. he used the peeper trick.

to clarify: this is in no way a "smart and okay" way to use the system, it is writing a widget that exploits bugs to make your units invulnerable. It is on par with specmonkeying or rewriting your spring so you see everything. I am surprised the host was tolerant of it, most hosts I know ban on sight for this kind of bullshit. Maybe a friend of his was doing it.

And how are people supposed to know what kind of commands you are permitted to give to your units? And where would you draw a line about what kind of widget one is allowed to write/use either.
Sure a host can ban people for any reason he likes, but that doesn't make playing an unmodified game in a way you don't agree with, comparable to maphack or ghosting.

[Wombat]

how do u do this anyway ? if u need widget for that its pretty obvious for me its 'cheat'. other players cant do that becouse they dont have proper code/widget/anything for that

[Johannes]

how do u do this anyway ? if u need widget for that its pretty obvious for me its 'cheat'. other players cant do that becouse they dont have proper code/widget/anything for that

I can do it without widget.

And if players are allowed to make widgets how would you define rules on what is ok and what is not? Yes stuff like this sucks, but rules shouldnt depend on someones gut feeling if it's right or not.

[very_bad_soldier]

And how are people supposed to know what kind of commands you are permitted to give to your units?

Errrrm, just a little bit of common sense? Its pretty clear that this behavior is an engine/game bug. You cant justify exploiting it by saying "I was just giving orders to my units, I didnt know thats illegal".

Really surprising how many people approve shit like this, even the game host did... oh man... Thats pretty much fucked up...

[Gigamez]

Really surprising how many people approve shit like this, even the game host did... oh man... Thats pretty much fucked up...

unbeliveable, but expected: if it wasn't against us but against some other clan (and nationality) i can bet that everyone was shocked.

Incredible also that someone (like Lampe said) support the idea that we're angry 'cause we haven't the skills to do that! :O

..So if i have the skill to crash ALL tera servers is ok for all?

[Wombat]

u speak truth i think.

also i bet it would be huge baw baw if it wasnt ba

[BaNa]

And how are people supposed to know what kind of commands you are permitted to give to your units? And where would you draw a line about what kind of widget one is allowed to write/use either.
Sure a host can ban people for any reason he likes, but that doesn't make playing an unmodified game in a way you don't agree with, comparable to maphack or ghosting.

according to your logic, there is nothing wrong with a maphack either, spring is open source, so why couldn't i rewrite the non synced code, its not like other people couldn't do it. I could do the same (maphack) without rewriting the code, even.

In court, intent is judged and a lot depends on your intent when you did a particular act. I feel the same way about this, this exploit can in no way be viewed as good intentioned use.

[CarRepairer]

It's an exploit of a bug and it's stupid, but if the host allows it then who cares? Just don't play on that host. Tell people who are in that host that the host allows this behavior and they should join a different host with you. SpringLobby and ZKLobby let anyone host their own game using relay without any issues. Dedicated autohosts have been completely obsolete for ages.

[Johannes]

And how are people supposed to know what kind of commands you are permitted to give to your units? And where would you draw a line about what kind of widget one is allowed to write/use either.
Sure a host can ban people for any reason he likes, but that doesn't make playing an unmodified game in a way you don't agree with, comparable to maphack or ghosting.

according to your logic, there is nothing wrong with a maphack either, spring is open source, so why couldn't i rewrite the non synced code, its not like other people couldn't do it. I could do the same (maphack) without rewriting the code, even.

In court, intent is judged and a lot depends on your intent when you did a particular act. I feel the same way about this, this exploit can in no way be viewed as good intentioned use.

No, that's not my logic. Don't try to put words in my mouth.

Modifying source is not something you're allowed to do in order to gain an in-game advantage, that's pretty . Issuing orders to units, and writing widgets on the other hand are allowed, unless some kind of action is exclipitly prohibited by the host, and preferably these hosts' rules would be visible somewhere. Of course after an engine change or mod change, there is not such written rule needed.

And what would the malevolent intent be here? Trying to win the game? Nothing wrong with that, it's the method that is under consideration.
It's not really any gamebreaking method in the end either, unless you fly your comm away and make it impossible to finish you. Other than that it's just a strong move you might consider bad for the game, in the same way you might consider some single unit game-breakingly strong. But then it's in the modders juridiction not yours, or the hosts' (he can disallow a unit or kick an off-mapper).

I do think it should be changed, but saying it's somehow instinctively wrong is bullshit.

[BaNa]

And what would the malevolent intent be here? Trying to win the game? Nothing wrong with that, it's the method that is under consideration.
It's not really any gamebreaking method in the end either, unless you fly your comm away and make it impossible to finish you. Other than that it's just a strong move you might consider bad for the game, in the same way you might consider some single unit game-breakingly strong. But then it's in the modders juridiction not yours, or the hosts' (he can disallow a unit or kick an off-mapper).

I do think it should be changed, but saying it's somehow instinctively wrong is bullshit.

If you look at the bug report on mantis, you see that flying com away is done with this exploit.

I guess we disagree on what is gamebreaking, what is fair and what is moral/amoral behavior, I do not really wish to go into an argument that has no point.

Yes, it should be the server mods / autohost owners discretion to ban for this kind of shit, based on a community consensus, but honestly, I am hard put to see why you are defending this piece of shit technique unless you use it yourself to win games. In that case, I am happy that you can compensate your lack of skill by cheating, I hope it works out for you.

Using an exploit to mount an undefendable attack is not similar to a unit being OP.

edit: I see no written rules on autohosts or upon joining the lobby that i should not use my own version of spring???

[Johannes]

If you look at the bug report on mantis, you see that flying com away is done with this exploit.

Of course it's the same method. But that is the only instance of using it that is obviously game-breaking (ie. forced draw). Beyond that it's up to discussion if it hurts the game.

I am hard put to see why you are defending this piece of shit technique unless you use it yourself to win games. In that case, I am happy that you can compensate your lack of skill by cheating, I hope it works out for you.

I'm not defending the trick itself, it should be changed in BA atleast, who knows maybe it works in some game? I'm just saying there should be clear rules instead of relying on unquantifiable morals, and that every in-game action is allowed by default.
It makes total sense to say "it's stupid, should be disallowed because this and that" but going on about how it's somehow obviously intuitively morally wrong to use your units to the fullest is crazy.

Using an exploit to mount an undefendable attack is not similar to a unit being OP.

It's not undefendable, nothing stops people from building aa next to map edge when they know of this.

edit: I see no written rules on autohosts or upon joining the lobby that i should not use my own version of spring???

To my understanding maphacking is worth a ban from lobby, but yes, it probably should be stated on the "terms of use" you get when registering.

[BaNa]

Using an exploit to mount an undefendable attack is not similar to a unit being OP.

It's not undefendable, nothing stops people from building aa next to map edge when they know of this.

Really? So you can plant your useless static AA all along the map edge, then? How helpful! I'm sure you have seen this work tons of times against this exploit, right? Could you maybe up a replay? I'm sure people will refrain from building eco anywhere near the map edge after this and mass AA all along it.

>_>
<_<

Seriously man, you're killing me. Either you are arguing for the sake of arguing or you are a simpleton.

[Johannes]

Yeah, if you're playing on a host that allows offmapping, it has some sense to avoid building next to map edge, and maybe build aa there if you suspect an attack. That should be pretty obvious, why'd you need a replay to prove such simple thing?

[BaNa]

Yeah, if you're playing on a host that allows offmapping, it has some sense to avoid building next to map edge, and maybe build aa there if you suspect an attack. That should be pretty obvious, why'd you need a replay to prove such simple thing?

BECAUSE STATIC AA ISNT WORTH SHIT IN BA YOU TWAT

[luckywaldo7]

I'm just saying there should be clear rules instead of relying on unquantifiable morals, and that every in-game action is allowed by default.
It makes total sense to say "it's stupid, should be disallowed because this and that" but going on about how it's somehow obviously intuitively morally wrong to use your units to the fullest is crazy.

I think this is a good point.

However, I think it is pretty much universally excepted that gameplay is supposed to be confined to the extents of the map. Outside of the map is not "playable area if you are skilled enough", it is unplayable area. This should go without saying.

So it is not a problem because it is unintended behavior. Unintended behavior is things like com wreck blocking rocko shots. Exploiting these is a natural part of the game and is not a problem. This is behavior that is intentionally not supposed to be possible.

My 2 cents.

[Johannes]

Yeah, if you're playing on a host that allows offmapping, it has some sense to avoid building next to map edge, and maybe build aa there if you suspect an attack. That should be pretty obvious, why'd you need a replay to prove such simple thing?

BECAUSE STATIC AA ISNT WORTH SHIT IN BA YOU TWAT

SRY BRO I DDINT REALIZE TIS WAS BA BAALNCE DISCUSSION

[Lampe]

damn, that fella must've been really angry about me

* [TERA]DSDHost2 * Hi lampe_chickenfucker (Newbie), welcome to [TERA]DSDHost2
* [TERA]DSDHost2 * Hi [LAMPE]TrollerLoller (Newbie), welcome to [TERA]DSDHost2
* [TERA]DSDHost2 * Hi [HUGE]LampaTroll (Newbie), welcome to [TERA]DSDHost2

basically... nuff said, but wait, there's one more:

Personally i never ever play anymore in this way and in these servers administered in a so-discriminating way.

and the next day:

[17:41:16] ** [iTA]Papelle joined the battle.
[17:41:16] ** [iTA]Papelle left the battle( ).

damn you nasty ip bans! :O

[MrCucumber]

I remember someone doing this in a FFA on knockout, and near the end, someone spotted the trans with the com and told his fighters to attack it. I am sure that you can still get your fighters to attack units out of the map like you could only a few engine changes ago.

If it is easily blocked with fighters, then it should not be that much of a problem, sure it is a bug exploit and should be fixed, but if the autohost owner had no problems with it, then it is allowed on that host. Also when someone tried a !kick Lampe voted yes, but he clearly was letting the players decide if he should get kicked, and he did not.

All of you whining about this should really just relax, realize that life is not fair, and go play on another host or something.

[Gigamez]

damn, that fella must've been really angry about me

* [TERA]DSDHost2 * Hi lampe_chickenfucker (Newbie), welcome to [TERA]DSDHost2
* [TERA]DSDHost2 * Hi [LAMPE]TrollerLoller (Newbie), welcome to [TERA]DSDHost2
* [TERA]DSDHost2 * Hi [HUGE]LampaTroll (Newbie), welcome to [TERA]DSDHost2

:D yes, it was very funny , but i had already apologized for that. (and i wasn't the only who jocked for you behavior - the nicks that i used are not offensive.. something like "[CHEAT]Lampatron" not something like "momLampe" or similar..)
..But you have to admit: some nicks are soo hilarious!

basically... nuff said, but wait, there's one more:

Personally i never ever play anymore in this way and in these servers administered in a so-discriminating way.

and the next day:

[17:41:16] ** [iTA]Papelle joined the battle.
[17:41:16] ** [iTA]Papelle left the battle( ).

damn you nasty ip bans! :O

Lampe, read right and don't be ridicolous: i'm [iTA]Gigamez, NOT [iTA]Papelle

This is not the right place to troll: we are fun enough :) and the replay is evident for all.

When i sent to you this link i expected something of constructive, but i was wrong another time with you.
Anyway.. gg with your servers and your discriminating administration! :)

Greetings from Italy!