The Curious Case of DSDHosts.

[scifi]

Actually the main complaints were essentially engine issues: pathing and a dated graphics system (we're talking relative to shiny new commercial offerings like DOW2 or Supcom2 here).

Of course you get what you pay for.

I think it's probably more helpful to push Spring into markets where those games can't or won't follow; specifically to the MacOSX/Linux platforms and as a free/shareware offering. At least then the Games/Engine can be reviewed with the proper perspective. The P.U.R.E reviewer was seeing a commercial game on steam, so expectations were naturally much higher.

Spring for an open source game is great, even better than some comercial games, but today a good game is based as the quality of the package not gameplay, no bugs e.t.c...... since a reviwer wont be spending that mutch time playing the game.

[Aether_0001]

Everyone just agree to tell new players that DSD has a virus, and crack down on it like it is a virus. Because it is, isn't it?

[123vtemp]

8v8 games are too large for new players to learn how to play

If you want player base skill in spring to increase they need to have an opportunity to learn.

A fucking massive game just fails to teach game-anything but how to fight with idiots.

An ideal max player number needs to be found. Games need to be small enough for players to learn what playing is.

5v5 would be nice but 6v6 is likely to be what would be accepted.

[REVENGE]

1v1

[SirArtturi]

Another DSD discussion
Lets participate:

I disagree with the idea that DSD is bad for noobs or 1v1 are ultimately best way to learn the game - No. DSD 8v8 is very good gateway drug to get hooked for the games because It gives you space and time to learn the basic and how the game is like.

But I agree that after reaching the certain point of knowing the game and the mechanics and still sticking with the 8v8 DSD is just comfortness and lazyness to seek new challenges OR moreover seek for new experiences in new maps, which we have tons and some of them are certainly better than DSD visually, and gameplay wise.

I also highly agree that 8v8 is overcrowded for the map and the map becomes disfunctioning. 5v5 should offer enough comfort and space while still being dynamic for the sake of the game...

So how much you would hate DSD games you cant deny them from people if they are having fun. Thats also one aspect of playing and games. Some people play only because of fun not only just challenging and competition.

You just would need to ask why Sennas techporcmods are so popular? Because they are porc, tech and dsd. People love it...

[Jazcash]

I disagree with the idea that DSD is bad for noobs or 1v1 are ultimately best way to learn the game - No. DSD 8v8 is very good gateway drug to get hooked for the games because It gives you space and time to learn the basic and how the game is like.

I grew up on Speedmetal, Steve Zissou grew up on SpeedBall, many other good players I know grew up on metal maps. The good thing about them was that they weren't played all the time. These days, players play 8v8DSD when they first start playing and a few years later, they're still playing it.

[Pxtl]

The problem is that a newb has 3 options
1) play 8v8 dsd where they will be supported by a team and get to experiement with the game and see what good players do.
2) Play 1v1 and get raped by jeffies a hundred times.
3) Spec.

(1) sounds like the only way to start that isn't horribly painful.

[hoijui]

4) play vs AI

[keijj0]

5) play 1v1 against another newb. like i did when i started

and specing IS FUCKING GOOD

[Jazcash]

inb4 6)

[Carpenter]

The problem is that a newb has 3 options
1) play 8v8 dsd where they will be supported by a team and get to experiement with the game and see what good players do.
2) Play 1v1 and get raped by jeffies a hundred times.
3) Spec.

(1) sounds like the only way to start that isn't horribly painful.

You don't get the problem do you? If they start with dsd, they stick with it as long as they play this game, so no, it's the most painful way to start this game.

Also it's just a game, they should try 1on1 games just for fun, not to make as many commands in a minute as possible. So just stop defending nubs and face the problem, it really exists. :)

[scifi]

2v2 to 6v6 mediates this problem.

1v1 can be good to actualy learn the inicial part of the game, expanding, defence, rush, raid but it can be to hard to grasp for some new people, though it can be great after they learn it.

2v2 is about sharing and working as a team, good way to learn first steps of team work.

3v3 envolves about specialization of each team, one tecs, one rushes that unit, e.t.c..

4v4 is great to envolve people in bigger games, to actualy make them a part of a group that figths another group, Suporting other team members, repairing e.t.c..

5v5 is good for forcing players to work together, if the map isnt 5 1v1s, this mode can be great.

6v6 to 8v8s, are great game types that alow up to 2 single players focusing on something else than frontline, but the fun thing is its the hardest of all modes to learn, its the most complicated as it envolves good 1v1 skills and team work all together.

[Pxtl]

@carpenter

Sitting and saying "why are the n00bs starting with the easy part instead of the hard part! They should be getting raped by jeffies in 1v1s or watching hours of speccing and replays before they start" isn't exactly going to make it better.

Ultimately, BA is n00b-hostile, and DSD8v8s help to mitigate that hostility. Either come up with a way to remove that hostility, or accept that they'll be playing large teamgames on porcy maps.

[Carpenter]

@carpenter

Sitting and saying "why are the n00bs starting with the easy part instead of the hard part! They should be getting raped by jeffies in 1v1s or watching hours of speccing and replays before they start" isn't exactly going to make it better.

Ultimately, BA is n00b-hostile, and DSD8v8s help to mitigate that hostility. Either come up with a way to remove that hostility, or accept that they'll be playing large teamgames on porcy maps.

Looks like you completely forgot that you dont necessarily need to play 1v1, you can as well play 2v2 - 5v5 games and that if something is going to teach the noobs, that you dont win games by sitting at back doing nothing. And as keijj0 said, you can search another newb and play against him for that matter. Also, how can they learn to expand when playing 8V8BADSD they can only have 3 mexes and they dont really even need to defend them?

You're sitting and saying things as well.

[JohannesH]

It would make sense that noobs play each other... But they go to 8v8 instead of hosting a game like that, since its what everybody else does.

[KaiserJ]

hmm i was testing a map last night; lots of people came to play!

so perhaps theres hope after all.

[keijj0]

ok pxtl. who the fuck are you? cos i havent seen you in any ba small games. still you seem to "know" everything about everything. small games are not as hostile as big ones. unless there is a clanmatch

[RogerN]

8v8 DSD is great. Not only do you get a wonderful meatshield to hide behind, you've also got 7 other teammates to blame for failures! In addition, there are no pesky raiders to district you from teching; the map is so congested that you needn't worry about lamers sneaking around your defensive wall.

All of these factors make it easier to concentrate on what's really important: being the first to build an advanced fusion plant. And then using it to build another advanced fusion plant, since having two will obviously give you an edge once you start producing units (some time next week).

[Pxtl]

ok pxtl. who the fuck are you? cos i havent seen you in any ba small games. still you seem to "know" everything about everything. small games are not as hostile as big ones. unless there is a clanmatch

I mostly play CA, but will play BA when there's nothing else. And when there's nothing else, the only BA game is 8v8dsd.

I've just been playing Spring long enough to hear the same arguments about Speed Metal and Altored Divide.

[keijj0]

but still there is a problem and it needs to be solved somehow