Should non-moderators have rights to lock threads?

[Felix the Cat]

Non mods can not "lock threads" by posting stupid stuff. If they are independent or representing an agenda they will simply be removed.

This must be a new rule... since it's happened before.

Thread is not bad at first, thread is hijacked (usually by "CA SUX" "NO BA SUX" shit), thread is locked.

See also Trademark's thread. I don't remember him saying anything about CA's relative merits, simply pointing out its incredibly annoying advertising practices. The thread was hijacked to continue the eternal "ca sux" "ba sux" argument. The thread was locked.

[Vadi]

Oh, as if it wasn't begging for those type of posts. It's up to the OP to do some thinking on the point & future of a thread if he doesn't want it locked.

[LordMatt]

???

[Felix the Cat]

Oh, as if it wasn't begging for those type of posts. It's up to the OP to do some thinking on the point & future of a thread if he doesn't want it locked.

So, basically, if other people turn your thread into the typical *A shitfest, it's your fault?

[Vadi]

Yes, if you make a thread that concerns something which was the cause of flamewars in other threads, yes, it is your fault.

TradeMarks thread wasn't so innocent to begin with, so I don't share sympathy for him getting his thread locked at all.

[Felix the Cat]

Yes, if you make a thread that concerns something which was the cause of flamewars in other threads, yes, it is your fault.

TradeMarks thread wasn't so innocent to begin with, so I don't share sympathy for him getting his thread locked at all.

Perhaps that's because you are a CA fanboi?

[Otherside]

trademark never liked CA and has always seemed to have a personal vendetta against licho

yesterday in the lobby XTA and other mods were advertising using a similar technique to CA

get XTA morph ur commanders blah blah not just ur peewees (insert link here)

and it was fairly constant and SA also advertised

Trademark said that was ok ??? and no1 else had a problem

double standards much...

[KingRaptor]

Summary of previous thread:

Trademark makes some graphs and uses them to prove that CA spam in #main doesn't do anything. (Since this doesn't show what would happen if CA spam was not carried out, it's of limited use, but no-one is going to discuss SRZ BZNZ like that in such a thread)

Hobo Joe sneers at CA adlines rather than making any actual contribution

SiN baaawws about how advertising = forcing

bunch of stuff about what the graphs actually show

Non sequitur + strawman 2-for-1 by Machiosabre

more stuff

tombom points out one instance of poor (and arguably fraudulent) advertising by Licho

more stuff, more flamage

some lulz, though trademark quickly puts an end to it

Felix and manored (and later forb) talk about advertising technique

Licho makes funny post which indirectly showcases the deep intellectually stimulating conversation that goes on in #main in between CA spam

Trademark tries to counter, but falls flat due to use of false statements and invalid analogy

otherside post

thread locked

in the meantime no-one mentions how 70% of main is join/left messages (sure you can filter those but you can also ignore Licho)

[Neddie]

Join/Left messages are the point of #main.

[TradeMark]

Thread is not bad at first, thread is hijacked (usually by "CA SUX" "NO BA SUX" shit), thread is locked.

Thats exatcly what im saying here. Hijacking my thread.

I think posts should only be locked if they are in the wrong place, are offensive or if the poster goes off-topic as well... I think trademark was still on topic so I think it should be unlocked...

+1

Oh, as if it wasn't begging for those type of posts. It's up to the OP to do some thinking on the point & future of a thread if he doesn't want it locked.

What the hell? i dont want to make any flame wars against CA, or saying CA sucks, in the thread i was just saying CA spam sucks. I dont have anything against CA, its good some people makes mods, but its bad if they spams the ads too much, makes the mod feel much worser than it actually is.

Yes, if you make a thread that concerns something which was the cause of flamewars in other threads, yes, it is your fault.

TradeMarks thread wasn't so innocent to begin with, so I don't share sympathy for him getting his thread locked at all.

So we shall not talk about certain things which might make some people crazy and start flamewar? Wouldnt it be just easier to ban those people? much more fair for us all.

trademark never liked CA and has always seemed to have a personal vendetta against licho

I dont have personal vendetta against licho. Licho is alright. just dont like the spam.

yesterday in the lobby XTA and other mods were advertising using a similar technique to CA

Yeah, they do it a lot less. and the ads doesnt feel like forcing.
"Why morph a Metal Extractor or a Peewee if you can morph The Commander! Get the New XTA v9.44 here >>> http://spring.jobjol.nl/show_file.php?id=922"
Feels much more friendly, and doesnt feel like im forced all the time to download it.

and it was fairly constant and SA also advertised

Trademark said that was ok ??? and no1 else had a problem

double standards much...

"http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7 <SA modlink. download and join my game"
Thats just an advertising, not some story about how much more better the mod is and which why i should download it immediately, or have same repetitive "Join SA." at the start of message and some random lame message after it = annoying advertising.
If they keeped repeating those ads every 5mins for 4 months, then it might get a bit annoying.

[Licho]

Seriously have you seen what SA spam was saying when it was new? Or what XTA spam says in #newbies??

How is that better than large variety of lines used by CA, many of them actually funny.

http://trac.caspring.org/wiki/AdLines

[Licho]

What are so many of you still playing BA for? http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7 Supreme Annihilation is out!

http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7 SUPREME ANNIHILATION MOD, ITS BETTER THAN BA

In the meantime, update your mods already! http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7

Come see the mod that got it right on the first try. http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7 Update your BAs, slow kids!

[Licho]

___SEX___ Supreme Annihilation is out! Join the Spring revolution! Modlink: http://www.tasdownloads.com/uploads/mods/SA.sd7 ___SEX___

Supreme Annihilation is out! Join the Spring revolution! Modlink: http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7

ba is done http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7

a _HOT_ BIG BREASTED brunnete is taking a shower,her dark hair is WET from the water.She lifts her arms streching her curved body and bends down to soap her LEGS as her _BREASTS_ move from side to side. download Supreme Annihilation ! http://www.tasdownloads.com/uploads/mods/SA.sd7

come, DSD Sooper soopream annielater http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7

[Licho]

In just about 3 days, SA generated at least 703 spam (tracked only when I was in lobby).

I generated 1200 during last 2 years!

Here is SA toplist:

Code: Select all

1. 051 -  What are so many of you still playing BA for?  http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7  Supreme Annihilation is out!  BA evolved.
2. 025 -  http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7
3. 015 -  http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7  download Supreme Annihilation.Perfectly balanced mod with new units new effects new gameplay.
4. 012 -  http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7  Less cults.  More gameplay.  Update your mods already to Supreme Annihilation!
5. 009 -  join ma game http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7
6. 009 -  http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7  sa modlink
7. 008 -  ___SEX___ Supreme Annihilation is out! Join the Spring revolution! Modlink: http://www.tasdownloads.com/uploads/mods/SA.sd7 ___SEX___
8. 008 -  Hosted SA for u guys --  http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7
9. 007 -  http://www.tasdownloads.com/uploads/mods/SA.sd7
10. 007 -  Come see the mod that got it right on the first try.  http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7 Update your BAs, slow kids!
11. 004 -   http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7  SA modlink
12. 003 -  http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7 SUPREME ANNIHILATION MOD, ITS BETTER THAN BA
13. 003 -  JION TEH AWESUM BATLES OF TEH MILLENIUMNUM  Modlink:  http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7
14. 003 -  Replacement for BA:   http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7
15. 003 -  http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7 join SupremeNeddie
16. 003 -  join SA game
17. 002 -  Come see why.  http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7
18. 002 -  Supreme Annihilation is out! Join the Spring revolution! Modlink: http://www.tasdownloads.com/download.php?m=SA.sd7
19. 002 -  http://spring.clan-sy.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=14194 - about SA just read what the creator has to say,what ba's devs have to say and what some of the best players in the community have to say
20. 002 -  a _HOT_ BIG BREASTED brunnete is taking a shower,her dark hair is WET from the water.She lifts her arms streching her curved body and bends down to soap her LEGS as her _BREASTS_ move from side to side. download Supreme Annihilation ! http://www.tasdownloads.com/uploads/mods/SA.sd7

[Licho]

So please, no double standards..

As long as there is development this WONT STOP.
10+ active developers work on CA. Many of their achievement make it to other mods (like BA) or are generally usefull (widgets, downloader).

There woudlnt be any people working on mod if it was not played.
Advertising in #main is the only tool we have atm to get more people to play with and help test our game.
It wont magically happen by itself, it never does.

And btw I actually measured effectivity of advertisement .. I stopped it completely for 2 weeks, there was 50% drop in player minutes.

[[Krogoth86]]

Well I think it's mostly about the tone of advertising. Have a look at those four ad-lines for example:
1.) Want to see the best of what Spring engine offers? Try CA.
2.) We're better than all the other mods because we have something none of them do. Robots that shoot things.
3.) Stop living in the past, play CA. Have fun with new units and features.
4.) CA - because some of us just deserve better.

Imo those all are bad examples. The first claims that CA is the one and only ultra-mod that actually uses all what Spring offers. Unfortunately this isn't true as long as you don't want to make strange restrictions as what is meant with "what the engine offers". So with that said it's not just a wrong statement but also filled to the top with self-glorification and as immediate result also a contemning of other mods...

The 2nd one also has shows this self-glorification and bad-mouthing of other mods very clearly. The last sentence tries to make this "funny" but imo in this case it's total fail as it's just lame. You might consider things like "CA, now with even more super-advanced features like... windmills and solar panels!" funny (although they also only have low ratings on the funny chart imo) but here the difference is that it inherits kind of a insult / overestimation which cannot get soft-pedalled by adding a lame comment afterwards. It just doesn't pull CA's leg like that other example...

Not much to say about the third example. The message clearly is that CA is new and shiny, all other mods are old and outdated and you too are if you still play them. Not very nice...

Same for the fourth example - a plain insult towards other mods and those who play them. You also cannot argue for this being meant in the humorous way. Maybe this is your sense of humour but well I don't know you and 99,9% of those who'll read it also don't so they just take it as it's written. If this really is meant the humorous way you can't use it for general advertising...

So you really should remove ads like that as there are several more examples...

@initial topic:
Well I think if a thread gets derailed and the author asks for a mod to purge it from the spam it shouldn't just get closed...

[Otherside]

how can u take most of those adlines seriously :p

most of them are funny jokes even the ones that sound like the CA team has a big ego :]

[KingRaptor]

lol

[9:42:12 PM] <[LCC]det[CA]> lol sak, krogoth is quoting your joke adlines as if they were pretentious

stuff

Come to think of it, I wonder how a straw poll among the other mod developers to ask if they feel these lines insult them would go...

[9:44:19 PM] <KDR_11k> Only #2 strikes me as obviously joking
[9:45:24 PM] <[LCC]KingRaptor[CA]> #3 obviously refers to BA
[9:45:43 PM] <[LCC]KingRaptor[CA]> 4 is perfectly valid, RL ads use things like it all the time
[9:46:05 PM] <[LCC]KingRaptor[CA]> 1 is kinda true too, CA was one of the pioneers of lua
[9:46:25 PM] <KDR_11k> Pioneering Lua isn't "the best Spring has to offer" though
[9:46:37 PM] <KDR_11k> You could say "We did lua first"
[9:47:01 PM] <[LCC]KingRaptor[CA]> anyway it is meant to be taken no more literally than 4

[Licho]

Most of what you point at is just self irony :) Cant you see it?

Advertising only needs to get attention. Its not factual. Factual advertising never works. No advertising works by presenting facts! Advertising is all about emotions.
We are actually shooting own legs by making many ad lines factual.

I recommend excellent 4h BBC documentary Century of self dealing with this topic.

Just look what SA did, all their advertising was emotional .. and yeah it was extremely effective they had 20% player base during days of intense spam. Current CA advertising is quite modest by contrast.

Imagine if they were instead saying "new SA mod by Tired - TiA with faster units and removed T4".

I agree we should tone it down a bit more (someone with good english skill should do it, I didnt write most of these adlines), but I believe it will reduce effectivness while only marginally reducing "hate" generation, since imo people like TradeMark wont ever stop complaining.

[Teutooni]

See? Humor is very risky in advertising. Some jerks always misinterpret it - on purpose for personal gains or unintended by being plain idiots.

I found those blatantly provocative SA ads hilarious. CA ads are somewhat more... restrained... but most of them are funny.