OMGZOR CHRIS TAYLORZ

[Neddie]

Jesus christ am i the only one here who actually likes dota?

I hope so. Horrid, horrid game.

[Zpock]

Jesus christ am i the only one here who actually likes dota?

I hope so. Horrid, horrid game.

Why do you think so?

[Muzic]

im surpirsed no other RTS other than WC has really capatalised on the 'abilities' part. Being able to use 'abilities' really turns tides of battles. Its a shame. Plus theres alot more fun things to mod with abilities n' such. Demigod looks very mediocre. I cant wait for SoSE.

[Otherside]

more gameplay less grafix plx

i know original dota will already pwn it cause of that fact :p

to much eye candy focus :/

[Argh]

thinking that it's impossible to pull off a full blown realtime 4x

Yeah, Pax Imperia got this (almost) right years and years ago. Not the sequel, mind ye, which is 'orrible. The original. Which had, among other never-really-repeated innovations, a tech-tree that was completely endless.

Really, the 4X genre bugs me, these days. Nobody ever came up with a game like Master of Orion II ever again- everybody's answer to that great classic has been either to make the turn-based combat utterly pointless, or turn the knob of the Gunz-n-Butter economic simulation up to 11, making me feel like a !@#! accountant, and not like the dictator of a proper empire. I just feel like the game designers in that genre don't get why it worked- it was just complicated enough for slobs like me to have to try and get an economy going, then focused on combat...

As for combining them with RTS gameplay... I have a game design I've been kicking around for years that does that, in a MMO way. Would be very fun, without the "I'm stuck in this chair for the next 8 hours" problems of a game design like SOSE would have in multi.

[KDR_11k]

I mean we can't have better players taking advantage by being faster, oh noes! Lets make all the gameplay so that it doesn't really matter what the player does!

Lol MOO3.

[Argh]

Yes. MOO3 was almost a classic on "how not to create a sequel"

[Zpock]

thinking that it's impossible to pull off a full blown realtime 4x

Yeah, Pax Imperia got this (almost) right years and years ago. Not the sequel, mind ye, which is 'orrible. The original. Which had, among other never-really-repeated innovations, a tech-tree that was completely endless.

Really, the 4X genre bugs me, these days. Nobody ever came up with a game like Master of Orion II ever again- everybody's answer to that great classic has been either to make the turn-based combat utterly pointless, or turn the knob of the Gunz-n-Butter economic simulation up to 11, making me feel like a !@#! accountant, and not like the dictator of a proper empire. I just feel like the game designers in that genre don't get why it worked- it was just complicated enough for slobs like me to have to try and get an economy going, then focused on combat...

As for combining them with RTS gameplay... I have a game design I've been kicking around for years that does that, in a MMO way. Would be very fun, without the "I'm stuck in this chair for the next 8 hours" problems of a game design like SOSE would have in multi.

Yeah I agree 100%. People thinking ai:s playing the game "compensating" for tons of unecessary accountant style gameplay is the way forward.

[Argh]

... but if the AIs are running the economy, because it's so bloody complex... hello, people, what's the point? Why not just have it be ridiculously complicated on the backend, then simple on the frontend- instead of playing with 500 widgets, give people, oh, I dunno... about 10:

1. Taxes.
2. Spending.
3. Planetary quality (can be improved w/ things)
4. What's already on your planets (bonuses, may be from buildings, etc.)
5. What are you building? (some things may drag or raise econ whilst being built)
6. Is an opponent stealing money from you (espionage, privateers, etc.)
7. Spending on Foreign Aid.
8. Random events (every turn, vary income by 5%, to reflect stuff)
9. Foreign Aid for your empire.
10. Plunder!

... and that's it. Make the actual amount of taxes raised a insanely-complex algorithm, reflecting the time of year, the position of the planet, how happy those people are (down to the last person), etc.... it should not be something players have to mess with, it should just happen.

Meh. I have no intentions of ever designing a 4X, so whatever. I just think it's dumb that a genre that started with cool, relatively-simple games turned into a mega-dorkfest that is zero fun for people who do not want to play a single game for weeks on end and do a bunch of spreadsheets on their own, just to handle the math

[erasmus]

rise of legends has highly unusual very pretty units and i thought it was a fun game

[Erom]

Pax Imperia 1 is the best game ever made. That is all.

[Felix the Cat]

im surpirsed no other RTS other than WC has really capatalised on the 'abilities' part. Being able to use 'abilities' really turns tides of battles. Its a shame. Plus theres alot more fun things to mod with abilities n' such. Demigod looks very mediocre. I cant wait for SoSE.

Perhaps it's because, when people pick up an RTS, they want to play an RTS and not an RPG.

...at least, that's why I absolutely hate WC3 and think they ruined the franchise with that title.

[nemppu]

im surpirsed no other RTS other than WC has really capatalised on the 'abilities' part. Being able to use 'abilities' really turns tides of battles. Its a shame. Plus theres alot more fun things to mod with abilities n' such. Demigod looks very mediocre. I cant wait for SoSE.

Perhaps it's because, when people pick up an RTS, they want to play an RTS and not an RPG.

...at least, that's why I absolutely hate WC3 and think they ruined the franchise with that title.

yea well ur a retard i think they more like revolutionized it the whole hero system was a good innovation and hero experience being the third resource with items creeping etc brought a lot of spice to the basic rts i realyl quite fancy the whole hero thing wc3 is a mega giga game

[Felix the Cat]

im surpirsed no other RTS other than WC has really capatalised on the 'abilities' part. Being able to use 'abilities' really turns tides of battles. Its a shame. Plus theres alot more fun things to mod with abilities n' such. Demigod looks very mediocre. I cant wait for SoSE.

Perhaps it's because, when people pick up an RTS, they want to play an RTS and not an RPG.

...at least, that's why I absolutely hate WC3 and think they ruined the franchise with that title.

yea well ur a retard i think they more like revolutionized it the whole hero system was a good innovation and hero experience being the third resource with items creeping etc brought a lot of spice to the basic rts i realyl quite fancy the whole hero thing wc3 is a mega giga game

</3

[Teutooni]

Hm, I'v never played Pax Imperia, but I loved MOO2.

What we need is a free, opensource, multiplatform engine which would support games (or "mods") like PI and MOO with improved graphics & UI.

[rattle]

PI as in Pax Imperia? The second PI game was pretty cool then.

[Zoombie]

Hey Argh, have you ever played the Galactic Civilizations Two?

It wasn't perfect, but then they added the expansion packs, which just made it even better. My friends and I have taken to calling it "the actual MOOIII," and you should really try it out right now!

[Argh]

Yeah, I have GalCiv II. It doesn't have turn-based combat, unless one of the expansions finally addressed that, and it makes me want to offer to make models for them It's not bad, and better than most, though.

[rattle]

Except for the combat. What the fuck do you waste your time on designing ships you can't even control yourself. Just like BotF.

[Dragon45]

Sins of a Solar Empire. I did a preview write-up about it on smuggoat.net when the site was still up.

Google it; looks interesting. I've been lurking their forums pretty extensively and it looks like the designers are going to botch the out-of-box gameplay horribly, but the modding potential is enormous. I'm going to try and get a Star Wars mod made for it as soon as possible.