I fail to see how this solution is more realistic madrat..
In real life (most realistic place there is) fighters/interceptors are not kept grounded at a base until enemy units are detected, this would be folly. Instead rotating patrols of aircraft are looped out around the base or defensive area, and are ususally coordinating with an AWACS or other radar center. Said center then usually vectors said figthers/interceptors torwards any enemy targets penetrating its detection range. Now why does this not work specifically exactly well in Spring.. 1 Reason, of which NOTA has done a superior job of addressing than any other mod ( I like NOTA alot btw) 1. Range, in spring even a big map pales in comparison with the size of aerial battles in real life, modern radar can go out to 200+ miles, and detect incoming enemy fighters, most modern missiles have ranges out to 10+ miles some up to 80. In spring I think on a Large map were looking at 10 miles square max, if even, usually with ranges about 1/10th of real life counterparts. In order to make interception work like this you would need to reduce the scale significantly and the speed of units in order to make the battlespace seem larger and accomidate actualy range feels. NOTA does this, now its not perfect, but its the closest there is at the moment. For most mods there is no real reason to intercept targets, why well bluntly it cant be done, and if it were set up to be possible by increasing radar range, and fighter weapons range, it would quickly make those units very OP within the constrains of the mod. Essentially the only way to deal with this is to go the route that NOTA has taken, scale down stuff, increase ranges, and RADAR, and then differentiate aircraft based on function using not only weapons and counters but also flight altitude.
The Only game I can think of that had something that functioned in a manner to alleviate fighter patroling, was the strike VTOL tower from warzone 2100. IF any such concept is to be copied this is the one to do so, This tower functioned by essentially binding aircraft to the tower, making them no longer under direct control, however the tower had a range, any enemy aircraft entering that detection range would have aircraft vectored to combat them, this was done from the bound aircraft. In spring I dont know how this would be set up, but Ideally it would be a building that could be assigned aircraft, who could then be left on patrol, and if any enemy units penetrated its airspace, it would vector any and all aircraft to intercept, and then return them to their patrol route.. However given the hotkey setups we have now, unless this also plotted out the patrol route as well, it would only alleviate the need to do several clicks..
Create way to scramble air units as interceptors
Moderator: Moderators
KDR_11k wrote:Well, his fault. He always demands such super-specific features no other mod would ever use so they're sure as hell not going to be included in the engine.
qft, make feature requests that everyone has a use for... like bombs falling faster or an actual number control for how many bombs are dropped... soo many other requests are needed.
Its better than being unfucked oneself.
KDR_11k-
I don't demand anything, this is a request. I didn't ask for thread crapping about how to do this or that with kludges or script kiddie crap. I simply put out an idea that would be functional. The framework would translate over to other ideas. But I prefer to move in steps towards a grand plan.
KDR_11k-
I don't demand anything, this is a request. I didn't ask for thread crapping about how to do this or that with kludges or script kiddie crap. I simply put out an idea that would be functional. The framework would translate over to other ideas. But I prefer to move in steps towards a grand plan.
The problem is that your grand plan is highly specific and oriented towards a single gameplay idea. A lot of the current modding problems stem from Spring being originally built with a single gameplay in mind - TA's gameplay - and so we've learned that building game-specific changes into the engine is a mistake, because it narrows the kinds of mods that are possible.
The reason why your threads invariably turn into 'crapping about how to do this or that with kludges or script kiddy crap' is because your feature requests are almost always doable WITHOUT any major engine changes.
Why should anyone try to code your request into the engine where it could cause problems or prove limiting in the future when you could do it yourself?
And, funny thing, SupCom - that massive, new, high-tech, big-budget game - uses 'crude LUA scripting shit' for all of its unit scripting.
If you don't know anything about how COB and LUA function, its best to keep quiet rather than marginalize them into 'script kiddy crap.' I'd like to see you accomplish half of what some of the scriptors in this community have under their belts.
The reason why your threads invariably turn into 'crapping about how to do this or that with kludges or script kiddy crap' is because your feature requests are almost always doable WITHOUT any major engine changes.
Why should anyone try to code your request into the engine where it could cause problems or prove limiting in the future when you could do it yourself?
And, funny thing, SupCom - that massive, new, high-tech, big-budget game - uses 'crude LUA scripting shit' for all of its unit scripting.
If you don't know anything about how COB and LUA function, its best to keep quiet rather than marginalize them into 'script kiddy crap.' I'd like to see you accomplish half of what some of the scriptors in this community have under their belts.
You are missing the point madrat. As I have told you in the past, you have not worked with spring enough to know what you are talking about. What is cost effective and what is negligible are really not something you are prepared to judge.
You have to have fooled with it enough to know what is and is not going to work out. Lua at a compiled level... lol. Dude, seriously, when several of the moders/scripters/programmers in the community are telling you this not because we like to. We are trying to make it obvious that you have no idea and should frankly do your research before talking. COB has 10 years of history, and is still being used. it is more powerful then you think with the spring augmentations taken into account.
Cobs can be a big deal, we have a lot of power in them, more so then many other unit scripts that I have worked with in the past. As a point of interest lua does not replace cob. It is like a piggyback helper that rides on the shoulders of cob with very long arms. Lua is meant to AUGMENT COB. Why do you even make requests like this when you have no project to use them? I would rather the devs not even bother reading a request like this as it is not something that a project needs
You have to have fooled with it enough to know what is and is not going to work out. Lua at a compiled level... lol. Dude, seriously, when several of the moders/scripters/programmers in the community are telling you this not because we like to. We are trying to make it obvious that you have no idea and should frankly do your research before talking. COB has 10 years of history, and is still being used. it is more powerful then you think with the spring augmentations taken into account.
Cobs can be a big deal, we have a lot of power in them, more so then many other unit scripts that I have worked with in the past. As a point of interest lua does not replace cob. It is like a piggyback helper that rides on the shoulders of cob with very long arms. Lua is meant to AUGMENT COB. Why do you even make requests like this when you have no project to use them? I would rather the devs not even bother reading a request like this as it is not something that a project needs
Damn. Guess I should call it quits on 1944's suppressing fire then. Clearly since the engine doesn't support suppressing fire, its got no chance of ever working.MadRat wrote:If the engine doesn't support it at a compiled level then I consider it out of the question at this point.
Heck, I guess its the same deal for nanoblob's faux dynamic lighting, gundam's speed changing mechs, everything trepan has done over the past few months (up to and including unit morphing), all of KDR's recent work with upgrades, any of zwzsg's units ever (particularly the spring stargate)....
Or actually, every TC for every game ever...well crap. None of them were what the engine was designed to support at a compiled level. Like CounterStrike and its shop system - total failure! Man. Who knew that one of the most successful modding efforts ever was a complete waste, because its parent engine wasn't designed to handle it.
I'm so depressed now
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Rat, you ask for a very specific feature noone but you wants or cares about. What kind of priority do you think the devs give it?
There is nothing hacky or "script kiddie" about Lua, a BOS solution would be really ugly but in Lua you make e.g. the guard order assign a plane to the tower, check if enemies are in interception range and if so order all assigned planes to attack those enemies, possibly with some kind of scattering algorithm so you don't have all of them attacking the same target.
What do you expect? A madratinterceptorbuilding tag? Five minutes later another modder will try to use the tag for his version of the interception system and run into an issue (e.g. his planes need to do overkill damage rather than spread out) and scream for new changes and so a whole new can of worms opens for the devs. Implement it yourself, save the devs some time and be able to modify it to your liking should the need arise.
There is nothing hacky or "script kiddie" about Lua, a BOS solution would be really ugly but in Lua you make e.g. the guard order assign a plane to the tower, check if enemies are in interception range and if so order all assigned planes to attack those enemies, possibly with some kind of scattering algorithm so you don't have all of them attacking the same target.
What do you expect? A madratinterceptorbuilding tag? Five minutes later another modder will try to use the tag for his version of the interception system and run into an issue (e.g. his planes need to do overkill damage rather than spread out) and scream for new changes and so a whole new can of worms opens for the devs. Implement it yourself, save the devs some time and be able to modify it to your liking should the need arise.