Decline in the number of players

[knorke]

The moddb page is also quite nice

just click http://www.moddb.com/engines/spring/games and see how its fail.
Absolute Annihilation at top, need i say more?
If i was a potential game maker, which link would I follow from this site to start my project?


http://www.moddb.com/engines/spring/news
why not use that automatic news feed thing?

Springinfo is also quite nice and runs itself.

A websites does not "run itself."
Just some obvious things you could notice very easy: :/

videos do not work since ages
http://www.springinfo.info/category/news/other/videos/

"mods" instead of "games" in lots of places

outdated/broken widgets in database (ie blob shadows misses a file)

"Important Links:"
http://www.caspring.org/ old, link zerok
http://spring.clan-sy.com/ old, usef springrts.com
http://xta.darkstars.co.uk/forums/ dead
http://spring1944.com/s44/ its http://spring1944.net

The new springfiles is beautiful.

if you find the spring section, that is.

The EvoRTS site is likewise very nice.

cant see what is nice about this badly autoformated collection of text with facebook and rss feed frames next to it.
The last post is about some Desura thing but does not even tell what it is or link to its page. I guess it is something like steam but I cant tell that from the text, neither can i tell if i need an account/client/need to pay.
Scrolling lags my browser. Guess I need more giga ram.

Also who cares about design if the content sucks:
What is the use if some people ie try to clean up the "read me first" page but moderators refuse to remove or update old stickies? Why make screenshots if nobody will update the gallery?
Both would be most important for a good first impression to new players.

[Wombat]

actually i see 6 'games' to be removed from modb (7 if u add EE that is not working)

[faceleg]

...snip...

I'm new and I've found it tough to find a definitive source of information on Spring & the mods/games.

Some of the stuff on the Spring site seems very outdated - it took my workmate to convince me to download it and try it out, as I couldn't tell from the screenshots / videos available how good the engine was. Before I tried it tbh I thought the graphics etc were terrible.

Now I know, but if it wasn't for my workmate convincing me to try it I wouldn't have bothered.

[Wombat]

I'm new...

... but speaking truth.

(on side note, i checked Contact gallery, and im sorry i dont play it )

[Forboding Angel]

modb could still use some resources tho. springfiles, evorts and zk - ppl find them AFTER finding springrts.com, which still contains fugly gallery and these terrible vids. i know its about engine, but since its probably first website ppl see, i think there is too much spring in spring.

Not true, evorts garners a lot of it's own traffic, to the tune of about 500 unique hits per day, and is linked to from many websites that have nothing to do with spring. Very little traffic goes to evorts site from here.

Like this for example: http://www.pro-linux.de/news/1/16729/fu ... d-gtc.html

Evo gets a lot of traffic from linux gaming sites, and a lot of german sites for some reason.

This is the above translated via google:

Software:: Games
Food for Player: Evolution RTS and GCT

Both the developers of free real-time strategy title "Evolution RTS" as the makers of the free "Greedy Car Thieves" have released the new trailer available for Linux games.
Mirko Lindner

Greedy Car Thieves

gct-game.net

Greedy Car Thieves
"Evolution RTS" represents a free real-time strategy game that was originally presented by Ben Woods and driven largely independently of the developer. Meanwhile, Woods is connected, other developers, so that the production progresses relatively rapid progress.

The game is based on any known model, but will, as the team writes on his site that combines the advantages of many titles in a game. Genere├╝blich the player must therefore take care in "Evolution RTS" at the micro and macro management, build units and combat enemies. One of the strengths of the title should be his beginner-friendly.

The game is already in development for some time and can be downloaded in the form of the first test versions from the server of the project. In addition, the developers also offer various tools for subscription that will allow creating your own cards.

Evolution RTS

YouTube

Evolution RTS
A mid-last week published video trailer shows how far the game is now well advanced, and that the engine used Spring certainly can compete with commercial titles. On display is a struggle between two factions, and detailed models, which are used in the game.

Also last week also released the developers of the free track "Greedy Car Thieves" (GCT), a video trailer. The game, which is distributed as freeware, a sandbox game is in the vein of Grand Theft Auto 2 (GTA2); whereas the gameplay and the presentation of the model correspond. The game will contain a story that puts players in the role of a gangster or a legal guardian. In addition, the developer of the game has a multiplayer mode have donated to measure the forces opposing factions in different game species. Using a standalone editor can create new scenarios.

However, GCT is still far from completing. The game is available to interested players but as a trial version available for subscription. As the distribution channel will look like, is not fixed yet. The developers wrote that it is quite possible that the multiplayer component as a freeware and the singleplayer campaign will be published as a paid game.

Update: Originally, abbreviated "Greedy Car Thieves" in the article as "GTC", what was wrong. The abbreviation of the game is GCT.

[Forboding Angel]

actually i see 6 'games' to be removed from modb (7 if u add EE that is not working)

We have no control over these. I sent a notice to moddb about the AA page.

The engine page cannot control what links to it on moddb/indiedb.

You could make a new page featuring an FPS called "Barney's Rampage" and link it to the spring engine, and we would be able to do nothing about it.

[Petah]

...snip...

I'm new and I've found it tough to find a definitive source of information on Spring & the mods/games.

Some of the stuff on the Spring site seems very outdated - it took my workmate to convince me to download it and try it out, as I couldn't tell from the screenshots / videos available how good the engine was. Before I tried it tbh I thought the graphics etc were terrible.

Now I know, but if it wasn't for my workmate convincing me to try it I wouldn't have bothered.

Who is this work mate you speak of?

[knorke]

Evo gets a lot of traffic from linux gaming sites, and a lot of german sites for some reason.

I read that from ie smoth about gundam too.
Epenis competetion begins: The evolution RTS trailer currently has 2.839 views. That is basically nothing if you keep in mind on how many sites the video is linked or embedded. With "500 unique hits per day" on the site it should much, much higher.
Even "Herp'n'Derp in springRTS" got ~900 from just springrts.com alone.

I think "a lot of traffic" is meaingless if the visitors do not make it ingame to play the game.
Which appearently does not work at the moment. So the question is: Why not?
---
If the moddb admins are so uncooperative, I would just say "fuck it."
Bad sites like that are pulling everything down and how is that fair towards everybody who is working on anything spring related...
Can't you rename the Spring page on moddb or copy everything over to a new account so that those links point to something dead?

[Wombat]

I think "a lot of traffic" is meaingless if the visitors do not make it ingame to play the game.

sadly this :/

So the question is: Why not?

dont get me wrong, but spring games dont offer anything new/interesting compared to other rts. its just bunch of units that do pew-pew.

DONT GET ME WRONG, but the only games that actually attracts players are *Ayes im talking about ba (pretty original gameplay AND its TA, enough to say how many new players come here and say 'hey i played TA a lot')

sadly, its hard to create anything new and interesting nowadays

[knorke]

dont get me wrong, but spring games dont offer anything new/interesting compared to other rts.

true.
You must see it through the eyes of a player who just played quake in his browser, has just installed surpreme commander using steam with 3 clicks, can play "competive" in starcraft 2 any time he wants etc.
All those "innovative" spring games are original in the "spring world" only.
That would be no problem if they would be easier to get running.

[luckywaldo7]

You guys are in the completely wrong direction. If the hot things these days are Farmville and Angry Birds, then spring games are way to sophisticated for the average internet-er.

Not that I couldn't list 500 ways to improve spring or its games, but I am not going to bother because there are way too many whiners and not nearly enough developers and content creators on this forum anyway.

[Wombat]

not nearly enough developers and content creators on this forum anyway.

fact that there is many games being ignored makes u totally wrong.

[knorke]

Now I can not/did not do anything about all those problems either but I wish at least the "todays gamers are too casual for spring" arguement would not come up all the time.
It is closing the eyes in view of real problems. First step is accepting etc.

[luckywaldo7]

not nearly enough developers and content creators on this forum anyway.

fact that there is many games being ignored makes u totally wrong.

They aren't ignored for no reason fool. Not a single one of them is finished.

Now I can not/did not do anything about all those problems either but I wish at least the "todays gamers are too casual for spring" arguement would not come up all the time.
It is closing the eyes in view of real problems. First step is accepting etc.

The real problems are that nobody gets paid to do any of these, everyone has jobs and real life and this is their hobby. Everything is unpolished and un-complete, and that is completely expected and normal of open-source games projects. The sophistication and tight design of many of the spring games is actually one of the few things they have going for them.

So while yes, it's not good to get caught up in things you have no control over, namely that the average person on the internet these days is really stupid and has the attention span of an ant, but to say that spring games aren't innovative enough for people is actually just completely wrong.

[knorke]

Everything is unpolished and un-complete, and that is completely expected and normal of open-source games projects.

You expect it, I expect it. Average person does not know what it means:
"Open Office, World of Goo, Open Transport Tycoon & Minecraft were all made as hobby project too, right?"
Even here, in this forum, there seems to be the idea that spring would be super popular if it just got slashdotted or somebody uploaded an awesome video to youtube.

[Wombat]

which one is not finished ? cursed, evo, gundam, s44, kernel look finished and fully playable for me (i hope its obvious that constant developlent != unfinished). strange argument coming from zk fan.

also i simply love the argument that everyone who dont play 'my' game are complete idiots.

fool

[knorke]

wombat, the problem is not the gameplay of the games.
Once you are ingame, it is easy.

At the moment, Evolution RTS is not officially released,[...]
If you are using windows, you need to install the Spring Engine (barebones) by visiting this page: http://springrts.com/wiki/Download

Then download this tool: http://evolutionrts.googlecode.com/files/rapid.zip , Unzip to where you installed spring, run ÔÇ£Install Evolution RTS.batÔÇØ (this will download and patch the game), start up Springlobby to play! To update your Evolution RTS version, simply run ÔÇ£Update Evolution RTS.batÔÇØ.

wat wat wat a .bat?
Isn't that, like from DOS?

And do you mean the S44 that you download here: http://spring1944.net/downloads.php ?
which links to http://springfiles.com/spring/games/spring-1944

For playing, you need the Spring Engine! For more Info please look here:

http://springrts.com/wiki/Read_Me_First

Fail, user is now on a page with still no download to the engine, does not know where to put this funny s44v153_marketgarden.sdz he downloaded.

[luckywaldo7]

which one is not finished ? cursed, evo, gundam, s44, kernel look finished and fully playable for me (i hope its obvious that constant developlent != unfinished). strange argument coming from zk fan.

also i simply love the argument that everyone who dont play 'my' game are complete idiots.

fool

How is the strange and what are you talking about? Most of those games you mentioned don't even have completed UI, much less a lot of other major features that their developers are planning (can't really speak for cursed and KP). As long as a game starts and runs does that count as 'finished' for you?

And what's that about ZK? Given the size of the 'todo' list it is hardly more finished then anything else.

And I'm not saying people are stupid because they don't play spring, I am saying they are stupid because they play farmville and angry birds.

[Wombat]

As long as a game starts and runs does that count as 'finished' for you?

it counts as 'finished' for me when it starts, i can actually PLAY it, and it provides fun.

And what's that about ZK? Given the size of the 'todo' list it is hardly more finished then anything else.

it needs more polishing than any other game, not to mention 'art' site of it which is complete mess. basicly every single thing about zk is playable but 'unfinished' (maybe becouse of this big to-do list?)i mean, thats the reason why i was suprised with such comment

I am saying they are stupid because they play farmville and angry birds

everyone who dont play 'my' game are complete idiots.

----

EDIT - i dont understand whats wrong with UI tbh.

also, to continue zk thing. its fully playable but nothing is done as good as it could be, for example animations (compare it to gundam robots, or even fighter movement), or effects (evo). like i said, i dont see any reason why zk could be possibly considerated as 'more finished' game, and for example gundam or evo not.

[luckywaldo7]

And what's that about ZK? Given the size of the 'todo' list it is hardly more finished then anything else.

it needs more polishing than any other game, not to mention 'art' site of it which is complete mess. basicly every single thing about zk is playable but 'unfinished' (maybe becouse of this big to-do list?)i mean, thats the reason why i was suprised with such comment

You are surprised I want more developers and content creators? If something is messy and unfinished -> more content creators and developers could help speed it on its way to completion. Thats why I said spring in general could use more. What part of that logic are you having trouble with?

About the farmville...wait. Intentional...logical...fallacies...

...are you trolling me?