Nice guys do not get girls... [contains immature language]

[Jazcash]

As much as I love Smoth, gotta agree with Trade on this one. Hence the reason why anon appears so immoral, it's because some people aren't as afraid of showing their true colours over the internet, especially when they have no identity at all and as it happens, /b/tards have no colours at all

If your trying to say that people lie less over the internet and you agree with Trademark's point than you need to reread his post.

Yeh my bad, read it wrong. In that case, I guess I'm on Smoth's side <3

[dizekat]

I suppose you could use something like Chat Roulette as a simple example. There, people are quite happy to flop their dick around without any sense of embarrassment. However, flopping your cock around in reality, isn't exactly the most welcomed of greetings.

The question is not weather people flop their genitals around IRL or not... it is a question about honesty... if you are the kind of person who flops their genitals about on chat roulette and you don't do so IRL it would follow that your behaviour IRL is less honest then your behaviour online.

Precisely. Also in this case it would follow that you'd have some trouble getting sex because you won't be able to get it by simply being yourself.

Anyways, unless you state whether the girl is more of a prostitute or more of a nun, it's pointless to make any generalizations at all.

How's that Madonna-whore complex working out for you? Does it make it as difficult to respect women as I've been lead to believe?

In all seriousness, dating / getting laid really is about being comfortable in your own skin, pleasant, considerate, and respecting your potential partner's wishes.

Dizekat also hit on a really good point with the importance of being polite and honest about your intentions and desires. Fumbling around blindly trying to intuit other's interests almost universally ends horribly. It's important to add the follow-up to guy #2 in the above example with the idea that, if he is turned down, or if the woman involved is only interested in doing some of the things guy #2 wants, he respects her decision and doesn't try to push his date into doing things she doesn't want to do.

Ya, well, that's what I meant by him asking politely. Actually the extra stuff #2 is talking about is something that is at least somewhat more universally enjoyable than biological act of sex itself (plus it makes for better sex), but I didn't want to explain that, I was curious to see reactions. It's kind of funny really. #2 is not only asking but also promising. Heck, if #2 is good at describing his service in appealing way, he can have sex with good looking tourists *and get paid for it*. Gigolos exist, and their clients are just random looking, not more or less attractive.
Also, that whore-madonna complex, yes for sure it shows great disrespect for women. Say, a good looking woman *pays* a gigolo for sex, is she a nun? is she a whore? No, she's a person like you and me, wanting some good time, for fuck's sake, the good time that most guys don't provide because of their utter disrespect for women, of how they can't even see women as people, only as objects, and her good looks only make it harder for her to get a good time. Sure sometimes someone wants sex with her because he likes *her* and wants to give something, but most guys hit on her only because she looks hot, and those are far more common.
So called "nice" guys of the #1 type are just inept predators, trying to camouflage their intentions to get close to target. They respect women the least.

Ahh, also, the caveman bang on a head drag to cave bullshit is, well, total bullshit (at least for north European cavemen). Do this to my daughter, what do you think I'm going to do? I'll rage and kill you. Even nowadays i think i'd have real trouble abiding the law if someone hurt my relative. Revenge is instinctive. A good caveguy can be sweet to her and make her happy and we'd be hunting mammoth together. It's only recently that big enough societies appeared where bad guys could be bad and hide it or move away.

[fc14159]

...Sure sometimes someone wants sex with her because he likes *her* and wants to give something, but most guys hit on her only because she looks hot, and those are far more common.
So called "nice" guys of the #1 type are just inept predators, trying to camouflage their intentions to get close to target. They respect women the least.

#2 type guys are just apt predators. Being charming and not having to hide your intentions doesn't make your intentions any purer. It's not fair to say that because a guy is assertive, he has more respect or real love for a woman than a guy who is too insecure about themselves. In reality, no man does something just for a girl to be happy, but at least nice guys make it seem more like that.

[smoth]

So called "nice" guys of the #1 type are just inept predators, trying to camouflage their intentions to get close to target. They respect women the least.

Indeed

[Cheesecan]

As a self-professed nice guy, I think the biggest problem is initiating contact. In other words to have the self-confidence to walk up to a woman you never met before and know nothing about, make a good first impression and engage her in some kind of witty, flirty conversation. A lot of this is experience, if you have a routine you've refined over the years that you can pull off confidently.

Being a nice guy doesn't mean you're any less physically attractive or lesser a catch than the outgoing guy. But since you never put yourself out there, out of your current comfort zone, you are losing out on all those opportunities to bang hot chicks. The nice guy goes through his whole life continuously thinking about that last hot girl he saw on the way to lunch 10 minutes ago, how he wished he would have chatted her up, but never did, etc. That becomes a recurring feeling for him, each time it's like a small defeat. The outgoing guy just goes for it, even if the girl turns out to not be interested, he at least gave it a shot.

If you are a nice guy and manage to hook up with a (hopefully) nice girl, and tell her you're really just a nice guy, she would never believe you, it's not something that's stamped over your forehead, it's just the behavior you showed at a single crucial moment. Lots of huge dorks have made the transformation from nice guys to guys who get women. The biggest barrier is your own social inhibitions. Those things are programmed into us during childhood. In 9 cases out of 10 you will notice that you as a nice guy and your nice guy friends have had some similar experiences during your formative years which made you into nice guys. You all know the type, and everybody could tell a nice guy from a cool guy from first impression.

[Big Take]

#2 type guys are just apt predators. Being charming and not having to hide your intentions doesn't make your intentions any purer. It's not fair to say that because a guy is assertive, he has more respect or real love for a woman than a guy who is too insecure about themselves. In reality, no man does something just for a girl to be happy, but at least nice guys make it seem more like that.

How is being assertive and straightforward about your desires predatory? You don't have to be some altruistic saint to not be a predator. You DO have to respect other people's interests and desires to not be one, though.

Also, there's nothing wrong with wanting to sleep with someone solely because you find them physically attractive. There's a problem with keeping your intentions obfuscated in order to "trick" them into thinking you want something else entirely, and there's a huge problem with judging someone's value as a human being solely on how attractive you find them, or being interested in all people of any given gender solely as sex objects. Basically, don't be Cheesecan up there talking about human interaction as if the only goal of speaking with women is to get to bed with ones you're attracted to.

[dizekat]

#2 type guys are just apt predators. Being charming and not having to hide your intentions doesn't make your intentions any purer.

Purer of what?
If I go bicycling with a friend, so that we both have fun, is that predatory too or what? How exactly is having casual sex with a girl any different, provided that nobody has been tricked into anything and both parties enjoy it?
(and what's about gay/lesbian casual sex?)

I say, if someone wants to feed me a sammich, that's not predation that's symbiosis.

In reality, no man does something just for a girl to be happy, but at least nice guys make it seem more like that.

hey, I do something just for my gf to be happy, and she does something just for me to be happy.

[Cheesecan]

Basically, don't be Cheesecan up there talking about human interaction as if the only goal of speaking with women is to get to bed with ones you're attracted to.

Not at all, I believe you should show a woman a good time, be a gentleman. While at the same time giving her some small hints that you would be open to making your relationship more intimate. Of course all of this hinges on the fact that you can initiate a conversation to begin with. This is where I think nice guys fail. All nice guys have it in their head that they are gonna screw up and embarrass themselves. Then when they start talking, they get nervous and you have awkward silences, nervous looks, and all of those other social cues which tell women to make for the exit, fast.

[fc14159]

#2 type guys are just apt predators. Being charming and not having to hide your intentions doesn't make your intentions any purer. It's not fair to say that because a guy is assertive, he has more respect or real love for a woman than a guy who is too insecure about themselves. In reality, no man does something just for a girl to be happy, but at least nice guys make it seem more like that.

How is being assertive and straightforward about your desires predatory? You don't have to be some altruistic saint to not be a predator. You DO have to respect other people's interests and desires to not be one, though.

Also, there's nothing wrong with wanting to sleep with someone solely because you find them physically attractive. There's a problem with keeping your intentions obfuscated in order to "trick" them into thinking you want something else entirely, and there's a huge problem with judging someone's value as a human being solely on how attractive you find them, or being interested in all people of any given gender solely as sex objects. Basically, don't be Cheesecan up there talking about human interaction as if the only goal of speaking with women is to get to bed with ones you're attracted to.

I'm only using the "predatory" analogy because dizekat referred to nice guys as predators. But is it a nice guy's intention to "trick" girls? Hell no; every "nice guy" would love to have the confidence to not be one, and have girls know exactly how they feel. Also, don't nice guys tend to respect people's interest and desires? Isn't that what gives them the "nice" in the first place?

I say, if someone wants to feed me a sammich, that's not predation that's symbiosis.

Well put.

[bobthedinosaur]

This is seriously one of the largest Wah stories in these forums. Good job boys!

[dizekat]

Well, guys who respect women and are actually being nice but cannot get the nerve to talk about sex and are embarrassed to show their interest in sex won't be bitching how women are idiots for not having sex with 'em. I mean, if you see a woman as someone like you, then you understand that if you never show interest and/or raise the topic, and if she never does, it won't go anywhere. If they're genuinely nice they'll have enough girl friends with whom they'll talk and get over the shyness. I was this way (kind of).

Speaking of predatory approach, there are assholes who get girls e.g. by lying how they are madly in love when they don't love, etc. Those are more apt predators.

[PicassoCT]

I was in a class with 25 girls and 3 gay guys for two years, and i didnt date a single one of them. Asexual is the term, i believe, although i could, if i would want.

[Sucky_Lord]

I was in a class with 25 girls and 3 gay guys for two years, and i didnt date a single one of them. Asexual is the term, i believe, although i could, if i would want.

hahaha this made my day xD

lets be honest, it must've been a biology class ;P

[PicassoCT]

No Arts & Psychology/Sociology.. and stuff. Were really nice people, socialised the nerd out of me, but drove the picasso part way beyond its limits.

[dizekat]

My advice is, just meet more girls. Some girls just want to get a man for one night stand or the like to have a good time (you just should not look like the time with you is gonna be bad). Some girl somewhere is perfect for you and you'd be perfect for her and who knows you two might fall in love. But if you don't meet any girls...

Ahh, and girl don't need your supposedly "gentleman" behaviour (flowers n shit) in exchange for sex. No, she either wants sex with you (preferably good, with foreplay and everything), or she doesn't want sex with you. If you think a girl will be interested in sex with you because you paid for dinner and got her flowers, or because you fixed her computer 'for free', you are thinking of that girl as a very cheap whore. That's probably enough to put her off even if she's interested to start with.

Ahh, and if you can't form independent opinions on usefulness or uselessness of advice regardless of the source (internet vs locker room), then just meh.

[Gota]

My advice is, just meet more girls. Some girls just want to get a man for one night stand or the like to have a good time (you just should not look like the time with you is gonna be bad). Some girl somewhere is perfect for you and you'd be perfect for her and who knows you two might fall in love. But if you don't meet any girls...

Ahh, and girl don't need your supposedly "gentleman" behaviour in exchange for sex. No, she either wants sex with you (preferably good, with foreplay and everything), or she doesn't want sex with you. If you think a girl will be interested in sex with you because you paid for dinner and got her flowers, or because you fixed her computer 'for free', you are thinking of that girl as a very cheap whore. That's probably enough to put her off even if she's interested to start with.

Ahh, and if you can't form independent opinions on usefulness or uselessness of advice regardless of the source (internet vs locker room), then just meh.

Hmm when your girlfriend will support you financially and not you her than ill believe you :) for now ill go with the cheap whore theory.
Though if you not living together and your not buying crap for her cause "you love each other" than i guess its true love :)

[dizekat]

My advice is, just meet more girls. Some girls just want to get a man for one night stand or the like to have a good time (you just should not look like the time with you is gonna be bad). Some girl somewhere is perfect for you and you'd be perfect for her and who knows you two might fall in love. But if you don't meet any girls...

Ahh, and girl don't need your supposedly "gentleman" behaviour in exchange for sex. No, she either wants sex with you (preferably good, with foreplay and everything), or she doesn't want sex with you. If you think a girl will be interested in sex with you because you paid for dinner and got her flowers, or because you fixed her computer 'for free', you are thinking of that girl as a very cheap whore. That's probably enough to put her off even if she's interested to start with.

Ahh, and if you can't form independent opinions on usefulness or uselessness of advice regardless of the source (internet vs locker room), then just meh.

Hmm when your girlfriend will support you financially and not you her than ill believe you :) for now ill go with the cheap whore theory.
Though if you not living together and your not buying crap for her cause "you love each other" than i guess its true love :)

No I'm not buying crap for her (in fact she explicitly doesn't want me to buy crap for her) and we split the costs. However, the love would of been the same if we didn't happen to both have enough money.

Seriously man, if you have to pay for sex then either
a: you're being exploited,
b: you want it this way,
c: you really suck.

edit: also ever heard of whores whom are whoring solely to support their boyfriend? who's altogether bad to them etc. not fiction, albeit it is quite sad. Either side can exploit love of other for money.

[smoth]

yan is butthurt because he is forever alone man.

[Gota]

yan is butthurt because he is forever alone man.

If you and Panda ever break up i'll pm you the day after, than we'll talk.

[Gota]

stuff

You didnt get me.
You were saying a girl that gives sex for flowers or dinner is cheap whore i was saying that most gals still rely on guy to support them to some extent thus are still whores just maybe not as cheap.
So either accept that that's how it is(mostly about interests and much less about touchy fluffy feelings when push comes to shove) or live a financially individual life.