NTai XE10.1b

[lale]

KAI has intelligent attacking, which means with half as many units it can easily beat NTAI. it also places buildings intelligently.

I'm not trying to troll you IK, but will you please educate me on some of the fine point of KAI configuration.

In my current KAI folder, all I have is two subfolders "Metal" and "Logs". But NO config file(s) ??

In this setup KAI only has a chance at beating NTAI within the first 10 minutes (Yes; NTAI can expand faster with a different config).
After NTAI builds its first fusion plant, ALL KAI units will do a lemming run for this plant, and continue to send wave after wave ONLY to this plant. (NTAI of course, has this plant adequate defended with several units).

Also RAI is capable of retracting ranged attillery (tremors), to there max range. again somthing I have not seen KAI (but neither NTAI) do (general KAI is using rolling annhilators as peewee food .

[1v0ry_k1ng]

lol.. you wernt around for the original KAI were you?
the orgininal KAI was in a completely diffrent class to the other AIs.
its broken now, its map hack dosnt work, hence its not very good atm.

[AF]

KAI had a pathfinder. Not a brilliant one but it was there. This allowed it to implement numerous systems that could improve the gameplay.

The other AIs dont have pathfinders, and the AI devs atm dont have much in the way of motivation when it comes to adding a new system that would require optimization like a pathfinder.

This is why none of the AIs have taken KAIs systems, because the really nifty things arent well defined internally and depend heavily on the pathfinder.

[1v0ry_k1ng]

one thing that might not is the way units micro to engage from maximum range

[AF]

Sometimes when you push too hard it has the opposite effect.

[AF]

NTai XE9.72

- adds in move to strike again, aka moving to attack targets at varying distances depending on weapons range.
- Adds a max range to geo searches and extends enemy checking radius
- test random moves, they may or may not work in this build
- Changes to add tags to allow control over how attack groups sizes get larger
- Efficiency rather than power is used in the threat amtrix now

[1v0ry_k1ng]

testing now

[1v0ry_k1ng]

1) there is still a problem with the threat matrix not resetting after a threat has been destroyed. all the units move to one location forever, even though more enemy units remain. spawning high threat units like krogs elsewhere does not reset the attack point, troops will just mass endlessly at a threatpoint.

2) new to this version, units that retreat to be repaired are never given new orders, they sit idle at the retreat position forever

[AF]

wipe your learning values, they're probably very very high.

[1v0ry_k1ng]

ok done, but i wiped them not 3 days ago already.
how do i make use of the new ability to define attack group size?

[Neddie]

AF, I have an idea for avoiding learning value overdevelopment. I need to check some things, but I think with a lot of work, you might be able to pull it off.

[zwzsg]

adds in move to strike again, aka moving to attack targets at varying distances depending on weapons range.

Does this mean NTai will now be able to use artillery?

Adds a max range to geo searches and extends enemy checking radius

Forget what I said in the other thread then. What are the measure units? What is the max value possible I can use for geo search? What does enemy checking radius affects and how?

test random moves, they may or may not work in this build

Glad to see you haven't fully dropped them, because even if ideally we should be able to do without, in practice random moves can be really helpful for many things.

[AF]

@zwzsg on arty: yes it should do.

max ranges are hardcoded atm. Enemy checkign radius means

if(emptygeospot has enemies within x radius of its location)
----skip geo spot

This too is hardcoded atm.

[1v0ry_k1ng]

1) there is still a problem with the threat matrix not resetting after a threat has been destroyed. all the units move to one location forever, even though more enemy units remain. spawning high threat units like krogs elsewhere does not reset the attack point, troops will just mass endlessly at a threatpoint.

2) new to this version, units that retreat to be repaired are never given new orders, they sit idle at the retreat position forever

both still issues after everything ive tried with the learning file.
how can I change the increase in groupsize? seeing its not built into the confrig maker, whats the tag to add in manually?

3) by making the learning file read only i was able to set values for efficency. setting the commanders effeiceny as 1 and the metal extracts efficency as 9000 did nothing, it still sent all units to the enemy commander.

what does "automatic targeting values" do when toggled on/off?

[AF]

Say NTai has an AK and 2 enemy untis approach it, a flash tank and a stumpy.

If Automatic targetting is on

Target the one with the highest efficiency.

if automatic targetting is off

Look inside the config under the AK section which unit has the highest priority and target that.

Considering each faction in XTA has around 200 units, making 400 units, thats 400! entries which works out as 6.4034522846623895262347970319503e+868 entries. This feature is intended for small mods with only a handful of units. There are measures you can take to lessen this number such as default targetting priorities per unit allowing you to only specify those which are the exception but its best to keep it dynamic and use efficiency in large mods.

Also could you tel me what values mexes and a generic attack unit have play a game and tell me how they change?

[Lippy]

Considering each faction in XTA has around 200 units, making 400 units, thats 400! entries which works out as 6.4034522846623895262347970319503e+868 entries.

Which incidentally is much much more then the number of atoms in the universe.

[Peet]

It actually has 273 units total.

[imbaczek]

I can't see where the ! in 400! comes from. Could you elaborate, AF?

[lale]

Well IK , a guess based on this:

I added 2 new tags to the configs (but havent added them yet to toolkit)

One defines wether attack group size is increased by a number or a percentage, the other controls the percentage increase/increment.

And the two new variables hidden in the dll, file:

[AI]/increase_threshold_value

[AI]/increase_threshold_percentage

I would say that setting the later variable is used for increasing attack group size, by a percentage. And indeed that├óÔé¼Ôäós what my test does indicate. (But I haven├óÔé¼Ôäót tested small percentage values, so this might still be affected by rounding)

And the former variable does an increment in x units, for each group.

Using both variables at the same time,

-------

AF: the new geo test is working fine for TA mods, and the 1944 mod.

btw AF,:when you changed the code for identifying assault units (attackers) you still left the unit-check-exclusion for attacker being able to build?
- Or is the unithandler for constructor├óÔé¼Ôäós somehow overriding unithandling for an attacker?

I├óÔé¼Ôäóm asking; because in 1944 mod they have attack units capable of constructing mex├óÔé¼Ôäós (I know,├óÔé¼┬ª fubar ). And these units will NOT work as attackers in NTAI, only constructors.

[1v0ry_k1ng]

inserting the tag
increase_threshold_value=4;
didnt seem to do anything