Bitcoin mining made easy

[BaNa]

Cheese I was expecting some mean-spirited personal reply but you just opened a can of reasoning and went all level-headed on his ass!

<3

variko, I see you are really invested in bitcoins emotionally and I don't see any reason to argue with you on this issue any more, all I can offer up as advice is this: don't put too much money into BTC all at once and then whatever happens you will be ok. If it goes up and you cash out at 2k$, good for you. If it goes down and you lose some of your money, no big foul. I got lucky in 2008 with some stocks, got a 300% rise out of it, but it was playing money, not money i desperately needed.

[varikonniemi]

Thank you for taking it personally, when it was just a general reply to those who have said Bitcoin is just like tulip mania (which it is not). A quote that described some of the points i was not sure i have been able to convey properly.

[smoth]

Cheese is a pretty deep guy. I agree with many of his points

[FireStorm_]

I just see your enthusiasm as unfair, because I think you don't know what will happen in the future with bit-coin, yet you speak like you do.

[Bob_Sacamano]

Well, maybe he does :) A few month ago he wrote right here:

Jealous much? Bitcoin is here to stay and you will kick yourself later if you don't invest in it now when the price is still only 140USD/BTC

Back then I bought one bitcoin - mostly because I wanted to try out the technology. But now I can only say: Thank you, varikonniemi! :)

[varikonniemi]

You are very welcome!

And to the rest of you: I started this thread because i wanted to share something i thought was cool, and wanted to help you take part in it. Unfortunately the doubters and naysayers have once again been the most vocal ones here, and arguably it is my fault for not being able to counter everything with as thought-out rebuttals as i would have liked to (like cheesecan). I'm not a wordsmith and english is not my first nor second language. I have, however, been a pioneer my whole life, and what history has taught me is this:

"First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win."

[KingRaptor]

Bitcoin has a function that the whole worlds yearns for and needs in order to advance past wars , atrocities caused by the corruption of government in many third world countries

>this statement made while calling anyone else ignorant

[varikonniemi]

Your post is a prime example of what is wrong here. A blatantly negative expression of ignorance with absolutely no reasoning backing it up.

Now if i would go on to explain how most of history is filled with battle between gov't and banks over who controls the money supply. Then you might start to understand.

Give me control of a nations money supply, and I care not who makes it’s laws

Guess who controls the world reserve currency today? Not the people, but the most corrupt organization in the world. A private bank looking for personal gains. Next you could start researching how banks make money, and it starts to become clear why they have driven us into unpayable debt load.

PS: Bitcoin is now worth more than an ounce of gold. This is probably the most significant milestone yet. http://i.imgur.com/3DC16uD.jpg

[KingRaptor]

Your post is a prime example of what is wrong here. A blatantly negative expression of ignorance with absolutely no reasoning backing it up.

Considering the original quote is a completely unsupported assertion, I think a comment about black kitchenware or stones being thrown from glass houses is appropriate here.

Especially since the burden of proof is clearly on the one claiming that this REVOLUTIONARY new technology will produce such unprecedented massive benefits for humanity.

Now if i would go on to explain how most of history is filled with battle between gov't and banks over who controls the money supply. Then you might start to understand.

The first central bank (or precursor thereof) was the Bank of Amsterdam, in 1609. Bank of England? 1694. (The widespread use of the fiat currency you rail against is an even more recent phenomenon.) 300-400 years is not "most of history" by any standard.

Some other big years? US Federal Reserve: 1913. IMF: 1945. US going off Bretton Woods (final end of the gold standard in the US): 1971. Fun fact: Japan went on the gold standard following the Sino-Japanese war of 1894-1895.

Your statement also completely ignores causes/factors of war and corruption that have a limited at best link to currency, certainly little or none to the elements of the current system (such as fiatness) that Bitcoin actually eliminates - despite the fact that human warfare predates the existence of currency. A few of them, such as socioeconomic inequality, were specifically brought up earlier in this thread, and no answer was given as to how Bitcoin actually solves them (or even refrains from actively amplifying them - you think it's the bottom quintile of world society that's currently profiting from BTC?)

So yeah. Maybe you shouldn't be the one accusing anyone here of ignorance - but by all means continue doing so, it helps illustrate my point quite well.

[BaNa]

Variko, don't take it so personally man. Your enthusiasm for new stuff and innovation is awesome (that ski+rotor combo is still on my most awesome shit ever list), and I don't think anyone here wishes you ill. We just happen to disagree on the nature of the current bitcoin boom.

[varikonniemi]

Yes, i have read the most thought provoking rebuttals in this thread, that is for sure! Too bad none of them have successfully predicted the reality we see unfold before our eyes. Facts stand to prove that my views, how outlandish they may have seen at the time of expression, actually have modeled reality the best.

Those of you who listened to me, have made it good. Those of who you who have fought me, will for the rest of your lives be reminded of the fact you did.

The only thing more admirable than my investment advice is actually working

[FireStorm_]

Now if I would go on to explain how most of history is filled with battle between gov't and banks over who controls the money supply.

Why would you need to explain what is already known?
You have assumed others lack this piece of information. Why?

how banks make money, and it starts to become clear why they have driven us into unpayable debt load.

I don't see how you are going or planning to do it differently.
I think you are becoming more and more like the people you say you fight with bitcoin.
I think you over exaggerate your knowledge of history, and thus may very well be cursed to repeat mistakes.

Mini thought experiment:
Who do you think would you generally like more?
A discovery channel survival expert? or The CEO of your bank?
And If I had to say what future job of those two would seem most fitting for you now, what do you think I would logically answer?

Also I think, because I suspect bit-coin may actually be intangible, a graph of it, actually may sooner show an approximation of the rise of tangible communication infrastructure.

oh, and I don't consider myself fighting you.
If it is experienced as such, please let me know.

edit:
striking some redundancy

[knorke]

Because the only thing missing from Bitcoin for it to become a serious competitor to credit cards is a big enough market cap. Currently it would be impossible to buy a luxury mansion using Bitcoin since there only exists 12 Billion worth of Bitcoins.

12 billion worth of bitcoins should be plenty for most transaction to "send value over the internet in a matter of seconds with little or no fees at all."
How much long until market cap is big enough?
What keeps bitcoins from being a serious competitor is that its value is not stable: It would be stupid to trade anything for the bitcoins equivalent of say 100€ if its value could be double next week.

By investing (&not cashing out) that market cap is slowly being risen, thus improving the currency aspect, making it more capable.

The only reason the value is rising because people think btc will be worth more in the future. But there is no trading or similiar to back that up. Bubble. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greater_fool_theory

PS: Bitcoin is now worth more than an ounce of gold. This is probably the most significant milestone yet. http://i.imgur.com/3DC16uD.jpg

So when other other currencies or gold change their value that is bad but with bitcoins it is somehow good.

Too bad none of them have successfully predicted the reality we see unfold before our eyes. Facts stand to prove that my views, how outlandish they may have seen at the time of expression, actually have modeled reality the best.

Reality is that some people got into bitcoins early and now they can sell sell those for lots of money. That is nice for them, like winning a lottery. Nobody denied that it is/was possible to make money from the bitcoins hype.
Problem is people confuse their small personal gains with the viability of bitcoins as a whole.
Those "lottery wins" have nothing to do with building a new alternative currency.

[varikonniemi]

You keep on belittling it as lottery wins, when in fact it was enthusiasts who were of great importance to allow for Bitcoin to come alive, who spent resources against all odds to make it happen. If everyone jumped on the bandwagon only after it was in motion, we would have zero innovation in our society.

My estimate of a "big enough market cap" would be about a hundred billion dollars. Then almost no normal fish could manipulate the market anymore. Currently the whole Bitcoin economy is mere pocket change for many people. And thus very easy to destroy (or significantly disrupt) if one would allocate enough billions of dollars towards that goal.

[FireStorm_]

Why do you see knorke's 'comparing' as the same as 'belittling'?
Please explain, if you would be so kind.

when in fact it was enthusiasts who were of great importance to allow for Bitcoin to come alive, who spent resources against all odds to make it happen. If everyone jumped on the bandwagon only after it was in motion, we would have zero innovation in our society.

Who is denying this?
Please pin-point if you would be so kind.

no normal fish could manipulate the market anymore

Does 'normal fish' mean person?
So the system would become like a natural law? Like the gravitational constant or the speed of light? Truly something that can't be changed?
How is this possible?

[Anarchid]

[varikonniemi]

I really recommend to watch this video, he explains Bitcoin very well and he has many of the important points covered.

Stefan Molyneux explains why Bitcoin may be the biggest revolution in economic history. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cs6F91dFYCs

[dimm]

Relevant! Asks a critical question! That I did not think to ask! http://theworstthingsforsale.com/2013/1 ... oin-miner/

[zwzsg]

This article is super biased. Bitcoins wasn't just for Silk Road, and Silk Road wasn't a FBI/DEA honeypot.

[klapmongool]

This article is super biased. Bitcoins wasn't just for Silk Road, and Silk Road wasn't a FBI/DEA honeypot.

I thought the most important line in that article was this though:

Of course, the fundamental problem with Bitcoin mining hardware is the obvious: if the devices were profitable, wouldn’t the manufacturers just keep them and use them to mine Bitcoins themselves?