Fallout 3

[SwiftSpear]

I still have not bought the game. I have to wait a bit because being sick for 2 weeks hurts my account.

To all the people crying about not being able to shoot kids mod it.

To all the people crying about no sex/stds. get a bitch drunk or buy a real sex game FFS

"an oblivion mod"
-red orchestra was a mod.
make you wonder, is that statement a positive indicator for the modding community or just another biased wanker.

The game DOES feel like oblivion. Don't get me wrong, it improves on oblivion in every conceivable way, but it still feels more like oblivion than fallout.

Honestly, I'm hoping some modder goes into the game and restores the many things fallout did so much better. The junkies, the sex, the kidkilling, stuff that was left out for the sake of the ratings. To me, it just needs to be there to be a real fallout game.

I'll say it again though, I'm having a ton of fun, it's at least as good as stalker was, and almost equally buggy

[smoth]

swift it isn't ratings, it is responsible development something that has long been forgotten.

[Fanger]

Honestly dont know what you are all talking about.. granted I didnt play fallout 2 extensivly and cheated through a good portion of it because I found alot of the "plot" tedious and uninteresting. I prefered fallout tactics because of the combat system and emphasis on combat.

Id see Fallout 3 as fitting somewhere in between Fallout 1/2 and Oblivion in game feel. As for being a fallout game though it certainly is and I also fail to see how it in any way shits on the previous games storylines.

Mostly what im reading here from you guys is that the game is not "fallout" because you cannot do the following:

-have sex
-contract STDs
-kill small children
-find people who are addled on drugs

Honestly I dont really care about that sort of stuff.. yeah I suppose it adds an extra sense of immersion to find that level of gritty doom and gloom in the apocolyptic wasteland. However on a gameing sense those things are not something that keeps you coming back to the game. You arent going to play it the second time or third time through to see which children you didnt kill, which STD you didnt contract or to have sex with a different person.. or to even find new and exotic drugs to take. These items are extremely minor and only mildly contribute to the atmosphere of the game not to the actual quality of it. So complaining about their absence is nitpicking.

[SwiftSpear]

Honestly dont know what you are all talking about.. granted I didnt play fallout 2 extensivly and cheated through a good portion of it because I found alot of the "plot" tedious and uninteresting. I prefered fallout tactics because of the combat system and emphasis on combat.

Id see Fallout 3 as fitting somewhere in between Fallout 1/2 and Oblivion in game feel. As for being a fallout game though it certainly is and I also fail to see how it in any way shits on the previous games storylines.

Mostly what im reading here from you guys is that the game is not "fallout" because you cannot do the following:

-have sex
-contract STDs
-kill small children
-find people who are addled on drugs

Honestly I dont really care about that sort of stuff.. yeah I suppose it adds an extra sense of immersion to find that level of gritty doom and gloom in the apocolyptic wasteland. However on a gameing sense those things are not something that keeps you coming back to the game. You arent going to play it the second time or third time through to see which children you didnt kill, which STD you didnt contract or to have sex with a different person.. or to even find new and exotic drugs to take. These items are extremely minor and only mildly contribute to the atmosphere of the game not to the actual quality of it. So complaining about their absence is nitpicking.

Fallout, to some degree, was the game you play to do heinous shit that you normally wouldn't even think of in an average day, and still be looked upon as a hero. Anything that gets in the way of my ability to believe the world in which I'm doing heinous shit isn't substantial or valid wreaks the game experience.

It's not "responsible development" that every child in the game is arbitrarily made invincible Smoth. It's just an arbitrary limitation. I don't really see how it would be irresponsible development to project the realities of drug use either... if anything, fallout painted that world far worse than it is in real life. It certainly wasn't a "oh shit, that's something I really want to do!" situation. I certainly would agree, there's a limit of taste... I just don't think dulling the harshness of the fallout universe is really any more tasteful.

The original fallout would go "Hey, take a look at this!" and then show you how obscenely horrendous it was. It gave the game alot of character. But the ratings boards won't rate games that do that less than AO any more. So like it or not, most game studios won't choose to depict horrifying realities as horrifying, they will instead be pushed to opt just not to depict the situation in question at all.

What we have now is WAY too violent to dump into the hands of kids anyways. I don't see who they are benefiting by decreasing the scathing realitys depicted in the original fallout games.

[smoth]

Fallout will just make drugs trippy or something. they can hardly simulate all the pain or the very real mental damage.

I think that bitching about drug use and the ability to kill a kill are minor issues. I see it as responsible because no one should want to kill a kid. It's all gimmicks. "fallout 1/2 are the most hardcored etc" baw. Have you ever played rapeplay? that beats the fuck out of the gimmicky sex in f1/2. Personaly I'd rather sbeach3 it is consentual.

if I want to see hard core I watch the whole urotsukidoji series. that is hardcorefuckeduppostapocalytipic.

I am against all these modern "look at me you can do drugs and fuck" it is damn stupid. It degrades the moral of children. The industry had such potential but they sold morality for money.. hey kiddies try our game you get to HAVE sex. And bullshit the parents will buy it and the insdustry fucking knows it.

TO DATE I still refuse to touch GTA.

I don't know it is just a damn gimick and the fact that you guys act as though it is the KEYSTONE TO THE GAME is fucking dumb. Just have sex with real chicks, it is a lot more interactive.

Also Fallout(all) cannot touch starcontrol2. that game had more wit and depht. Plus their key point was STORY with exciting combat, not look we are more hard core than X.

[Fanger]

Yeah swift the vibe im honestly getting off you is the same one you see overused in comics which /co/ commonly points out and that is that a female character that has been raped is "deep" this whole I can do morally reprehensible things in a video game because the setting is the post apocalyptic future and that means it should be so is kinda getting old. Sex/drugs != gritty edgy realism...

Id have to say that Fallout 3 has a very gritty edgy realism thingy in that the main plot essentially presents you with a rather complex and hard to easily resolve moral dilemma.. one that could have books written about it..

[SwiftSpear]

GTA isn't "hardcore". It's just morally reprehensible because it makes utter light of some of the most serious crimes a person can possibly commit.

Fallout was definitely a hardcore series. Part and parcel of the game was that it basically addressed every taboo known to man, and it took a very down to earth, and sarcastic look at all of them. Junkies WERE fucked up beyond repair, you could exploit them and murder them because they were so fucked up. There was seriously fucked up shit in that game, rape, incest, homosexuality were all addressed. That game was as much a serious social cometary as it was entertainment. Black Isle was not the kind of company that just made games. Black Isle made outright art.

Fallout 3 is deep... but it just doesn't have nearly the gravity it's little brothers did.

I don't know... It matters to me, I personally can't help but see it as a failing in terms of an attempt to pass the torch. It doesn't really make the game any worse, but it does make it less fallout. To me it's just part of what fallout is. It's a social commentary, it's like bethesda missed the memo entirely. Try having the book 1984 without sex and violence... it just doesn't mean anything any more.

I never really expected Bethesda to do what Black Isle did... but I still can't empathize with the morality of fallout3 the same way I did with fallout2. It's all I'm saying.

[Teutooni]

So, for the ratings, you can shoot a frying pan through a mans head, shattering it to "eyeball strewn paste", showed to you up close in slow motion, but not have sex or drugs? What kind of fucking sense does that make? Educative? Haha.

I'm not criticising F3, but the ratings. ~~

It's an excellent game. It has the potential to be a true classic, perhaps even "a fallout game" with some modifications.

[SwiftSpear]

So, for the ratings, you can shoot a frying pan through a mans head, shattering it to "eyeball strewn paste", showed to you up close in slow motion, but not have sex or drugs? What kind of fucking sense does that make? Educative? Haha.

I'm not criticising F3, but the ratings. ~~

It's an excellent game. It has the potential to be a true classic, perhaps even "a fallout game" with some modifications.

Games are allowed to do utterly obcene things in terms of violence. The ratings boards are rediculous when it comes to depicting sex though. God of war is a good example...

[Teutooni]

Speaking of utterly obscene, I'm glad you can't kill children...

Imagine some fucked up weirdo with the cannibalism perk and a ripper... That's just too much, even for a game.

[smoth]

However swift, because it doesn't have what you feel is important social commentary in the exact same way and still is a good game you comdemn it on those points alone.

People are saying, look it has all the features, fuck that I cannot rape a baby NO ONE BUY IT.

That seems pretty shallow. I live on /b/ and I don't want to play a game about it's awwwwwwwright and wincest. Judging a game based on it's predecessor is pretty lame. SM2 was not Mario, but people openly embraced it because game history was still young. Now people like to say oh well it is this or that instead of embracing what is different like people once did.

The reason I this whole culture of people who are retro fans. They don't want new they want the same old shit and like that warm feeling of having their head in the sand. There were many great old games, I have a binder of shit all the way back to 93 and still play rogue 10 on occasion but it is wrong to view games with previous bias. Doom feels a lot like dn3d just they each have different weapons and some extra features.


People say something like oblivion mod when they look at fallout3. What about oh, I don't know STUBBS that was a fun game and very creative, used the halo engine and really felt like a TC but they did a lot of great stuff. With mods like counter-strike becoming games and people still playing natural selection over half-life, I think people need to drop that goofy statement. The modding community these days pretty much just use the game's engine and make a whole new game. Frankly I have looked a lot at fallout 3's screens and videos I can see that the movement is similar and I am sure some of the combat is if you just move and shoot. I still ask the question is it that modding communities have become that impressive or do people just not realize what goes into a game. I am sorry but the same designers using the same engine are probably going to use a tweaked combat system and movement system as the last one was what they wanted and they are mearly hone what they feel is a good movement/combat system.

I still have to play it but I can't right now. The main thing is that there was a time when players openly embraced changes and would gladly try a new system now they just want carbon copy madden 9001 and cry that all the games are the same. Yet look for reasons to say it is the same as another game and cry about that also.

[pintle]

smoth i think that is a bit of a reductionalist argument.
I WUBBED the old fallouts, and having played fallout 3 a bit, I do enjoy it, but to nowhere near the same degree that in enjoyed the other 2.

You cannot accuse me of being nostalgic etc as i first played a fallout game ~18 months ago when a friend passed me his copy.

I think it is fair to level some criticism at fallout in the sense that does not quite convey the same feel or atmosphere that made F1/2 so special to me.

I liked oblivion, but i loved morrowind. If you played both you may understand what i am hinting at: I think Bethesda have slightly genericised the Fallout franchise in order to appeal to a mass market, and in doing so have fallen prey to the loss, as i perceive it at least, of quality of user experience that is inherent in the comodification of art.

I'm still prolly gonna buy it

[smoth]

I am probably doing a poor job in the discussion to, I am not very collected today but the thread has been going into an area that I am really interested so I wanted to jump in, I should probably wait until tomorrow maybe the thread will still be talking about it when I am better

they probably did generalize it a bit. To be fair, I tried fallout and hated the combat system so I blew it off. I hated the combat system of morrowwind for the randomness of the old school hit/miss but hated oblivion because spells always succeed but felt the combat of oblivion made me feel much more *in* my character. I think some of the simplifications of fallout and the ability to be IN the character and actually control him will increase my enjoyment and I am interested it the world of the game, it seems really detailed and like I will actually want to explore it. I didn't see a lot of the same dungeons like I did in oblivion. As I said about oblivion, I find Bethesda to do a good job creating worlds I can really get into. I might be weird and maybe fallout 1/2 had this stuff but I was really interested in the radios and radioactive areas, I wonder how all that is going to play out to. I won't know till I can play but even if I had the budget right now I still cannot play it I think I would throw up trying to play any fps right now.

[SwiftSpear]

However swift, because it doesn't have what you feel is important social commentary in the exact same way and still is a good game you comdemn it on those points alone.

People are saying, look it has all the features, fuck that I cannot rape a baby NO ONE BUY IT.

I didn't ever claim it wasn't a game worth buying. It's a fun game.

That seems pretty shallow. I live on /b/ and I don't want to play a game about it's awwwwwwwright and wincest. Judging a game based on it's predecessor is pretty lame. SM2 was not Mario, but people openly embraced it because game history was still young. Now people like to say oh well it is this or that instead of embracing what is different like people once did.

Fallout 3 vs Fallout 2 is like comparing George Lucas to Isaac Asimov... It's not simply an issue of ascetic differences, the whole philosophy of the game is at an entirely different level.

The reason I this whole culture of people who are retro fans. They don't want new they want the same old shit and like that warm feeling of having their head in the sand. There were many great old games, I have a binder of shit all the way back to 93 and still play rogue 10 on occasion but it is wrong to view games with previous bias. Doom feels a lot like dn3d just they each have different weapons and some extra features.


People say something like oblivion mod when they look at fallout3. What about oh, I don't know STUBBS that was a fun game and very creative, used the halo engine and really felt like a TC but they did a lot of great stuff. With mods like counter-strike becoming games and people still playing natural selection over half-life, I think people need to drop that goofy statement. The modding community these days pretty much just use the game's engine and make a whole new game. Frankly I have looked a lot at fallout 3's screens and videos I can see that the movement is similar and I am sure some of the combat is if you just move and shoot. I still ask the question is it that modding communities have become that impressive or do people just not realize what goes into a game. I am sorry but the same designers using the same engine are probably going to use a tweaked combat system and movement system as the last one was what they wanted and they are mearly hone what they feel is a good movement/combat system.

I don't disagree.

I still have to play it but I can't right now. The main thing is that there was a time when players openly embraced changes and would gladly try a new system now they just want carbon copy madden 9001 and cry that all the games are the same. Yet look for reasons to say it is the same as another game and cry about that also.

There's a difference between "changes" and "reductions". Fallout 3 is reduced vs fallout.

[[TS]Lollocide]

The ending is an utter cockslap.

My suggestion is to avoid the main quest until you've done everything else.

[Sleksa]

My suggestion is to avoid the main quest until you've done everything else.

Well you still need to visit citadel to wear power armor, and the laser minigun is available in one place which you can only access via main plot ~~

[[TS]Lollocide]

My suggestion is to avoid the main quest until you've done everything else.

Well you still need to visit citadel to wear power armor, and the laser minigun is available in one place which you can only access via main plot ~~

Well, up to the Citadel, you're alright, but not any further.

[ZellSF]

Doom feels a lot like dn3d just they each have different weapons and some extra features.

That's quite possibly the wrongest statement I've ever heard.

[TheBigPK]

Agreed on the ending. The main plot is complete junk; and they haven't released the construction set yet so I can make my own which=utter fail.

SPOILERS here's a pretty loltastic summary which I entirely agree with SPOILERS

[BigSteve]

ha thats a good one Pk, so true too, I was taken in by the nice graphics and just the fact it was a fallout gameearly on, halfway through I realised the games just junk.
Shite story, CRAPPY voice acting, horrible animation, buggy as hell, rubbish quests, STUPID perk system getting one every level ffs, making it way too easy to increase your main stats, plus most of the perks are useless anyway... sigh, if only black isle had done it... oh well, hopefully someone will mod it or something :)

Cabbage! lets become modders !

Im off to load up fallout 2, rescue Myron (best character ever) and beat up frank horrigan.