Upspring 1.54

KDR_11k · Post by **KDR_11k** » 02 Apr 2007, 16:23

Why does it only mirror two pieces of the object? And why does Upspring load them mirrored after I just saved them unmirrored?

KDR_11k · Post by **KDR_11k** » 02 Apr 2007, 18:47

I apologize for my aggressive behaviour when I should've filed a normal bug report, I was angered by bugs.

I have had it happen quite often that pieces end up rotated and sometimes mirrored in the s3o in some way. The model that is saved doesn't match the model that is displayed. If I load the s3o with Upspring again it shows the same errors that Spring does with the s3o. This tends to happen more often with complex hierarchies, especially when I do bipeds. I often mirror the limbs by making a copy, scaling it by -1 in X direction and flipping its polygons. The incorrectly rotated pieces int he s3o I uploaded were built like that.

In this case after I saved the s3o for the first time and reloaded it the affected limbs had their Z and Y axis flipped I think. Either way, enterring rotation values would result in the rotation text fields containing values like 00#inf and other strings composed of a few digits, a # and letters. No, wait, I think first I tried to rotate around X by 90├é┬░ but instead x reverted to 0 and Y and Z were rotated by 180├é┬░. Either way, it was some completely strange behaviour.

This happened with both 1.54 and 1.43. I almost consider it normal now that Upspring corrupts the model in one way or another and that I have to fix it in additional passes but this time I couldn't find ANY way to fix it.

The uploaded model will ignore scaling of -1 when saving, any mirrored pieces get drawn as mirrored by Upspring but end up unmirrored in any s3o I save.

All models I make are made in Blender, the root piece is always rotated 270├é┬░ around the x axis (because of the different up axis) and scaled up by a large factor (like 16) after import. I use objs to assemble the model, one piece per obj (since objs always end up as one piece no matter how many objects there were before export, no idea which program causes that) and then move them into their places (the origin is placed where it should end up in Blender already).

EDIT: Also when I assemble the model the "insert object from file" dialog always defaults to s3o in 1.54, in 1.43 it used to default to the last filetype used so when I'm loading 10 pieces I don't have to tell it that I'm looking for an obj each time.

EDIT2: Oh and a minor bug that's been annoying me for ages is that if you make a new model, create an empty root object and insert an object from file that object isn't displayed in the parts list until you create another empty object.

rattle · Post by **rattle** » 02 Apr 2007, 21:12

EDIT: Also when I assemble the model the "insert object from file" dialog always defaults to s3o in 1.54, in 1.43 it used to default to the last filetype used so when I'm loading 10 pieces I don't have to tell it that I'm looking for an obj each time.

Click, W, double-click. I know it's annoying if you have like 20+ pieces. You could try 3ds, saves you some work.

EDIT2: Oh and a minor bug that's been annoying me for ages is that if you make a new model, create an empty root object and insert an object from file that object isn't displayed in the parts list until you create another empty object.

Actually you only have to move the camera once so it updates. But it is annoying. Furthermore how about assinging the pieces a default name, like filename (without extension).

edit:
About the mirror problems, could it be blender?
The normals seem to be wrong too. At least when I turn cull faces on in upspring the mirrored parts look all like they have inverted normals.

PS: This has nothing to do with the issue but one side of the sword blade should be flipped on the UV map so both sides match each other.

KDR_11k · Post by **KDR_11k** » 02 Apr 2007, 22:09

The normals are wrong because the parts were mirrored and I flipped normals. I have no idea how to enable backface culling in Upspring.

rattle · Post by **rattle** » 02 Apr 2007, 22:37

Right click in the 3D window where it says "3D". It's the first option there, above lighting and so on.

Post by **jcnossen** » 05 Apr 2007, 15:55

I apologize for my aggressive behaviour when I should've filed a normal bug report, I was angered by bugs.

No need to get all nice and formal and stuff..

Anyway, if I mirror an object using X scale=-1, then it shows up inverted until I press apply transform (Apply transform automatically flips them when you have used a scale < 0). During the whole time, the normals will be untouched (but mirrored like they should) and showing up fine when I enable "render vertex normals".

So I don't see any problem. If there was, Argh would probably have written another one of his lengthy posts as well

AF · Post by AF » 05 Apr 2007, 18:46

maybe he has writters block?

Snipawolf · Post by **Snipawolf** » 05 Apr 2007, 23:57

Ahh, I am missing a piece ingame, yet it appears in UpSpring... Would this fall under one of UpSpring's saving problems? or something?

Guessmyname · Post by **Guessmyname** » 06 Apr 2007, 00:34

Check your script first - you may have hidden the piece by accident (thought this only really happens when you copy-paste scripts)

Snipawolf · Post by **Snipawolf** » 06 Apr 2007, 00:49

I didn't since it doesn't aim correctly yet and I am continuosly fine tuning it...

Edit: Whatever I did in my recent script change, fixed it.

Edit: While I am here, I might as well ask.. Does reflectivness affect whole objects? If so, damnit...

rattle · Post by **rattle** » 07 Apr 2007, 14:15

Snipawolf wrote:Ahh, I am missing a piece ingame, yet it appears in UpSpring... Would this fall under one of UpSpring's saving problems? or something?

Use save as instead of save in upspring.
This usually happens when you rename pieces.

KDR_11k · Post by **KDR_11k** » 08 Apr 2007, 19:36

Okay, sorry for the late reply, I was on vacation...

It seems to me that Upspring is more likely to have saving issues the more complex transformations are within one branch of the hierarchy. If I do all the rotating and scaling before I parent the objects to each other, apply transforms and then start parenting them it seems to work fine, at least I got the problematic model to work that way.

Post by **jcnossen** » 08 Apr 2007, 20:32

It does apply transform before saving, because the model formats dont store rotation and scaling (only piece position). So if you apply transform before saving, it saves exactly the same model as you see.

I don't know of a situation where apply transform actually doesn't work though...

KDR_11k · Post by **KDR_11k** » 08 Apr 2007, 20:49

Is there a way to make Apply Transformation not apply to translation?

For an example of when it fails, try the file I gave you.

Post by **jcnossen** » 08 Apr 2007, 22:44

Dump this in a .lua file in scripts/plugins (name doesnt matter)
I'll put this in the new version, but I'm waiting for some linux code before i release it.

Code: Select all

-- Adds 2 menu items to the object menu

local function ApplyTransform (rotation, scaling, position)
	local objects = upsGetModel():GetSelectedObjects()

	for i=0,#objects-1 do
		objects[i]:ApplyTransform(rotation,scaling,position);
	end
end

function menuObject_ApplyTransform_All()
	ApplyTransform(true, true, true);
end

function menuObject_ApplyTransform_RotScale()
	ApplyTransform(true, true, false)
end

upsAddMenuItem ("Object/Apply transform/Rotation + Scaling + Position", "menuObject_ApplyTransform_All");
upsAddMenuItem ("Object/Apply transform/Rotation + Scaling", "menuObject_ApplyTransform_RotScale");

Doesn't register an undo operation though, i'll fix that for next version too.

For an example of when it fails, try the file I gave you.

I can see the model is weird, but that doesnt tell me anything... the damage has been done before that

Bobcatben · Post by **Bobcatben** » 12 Apr 2007, 22:48

is there a way to, once i click the convert to S3o texturing button, export or save the converted texture map, i found the spot that displays it, but i would like to save it, is it possible?

Edit: stupid me, it does automatically, sorry.

MadRat · Post by **MadRat** » 13 Apr 2007, 06:31

And don't be boneheaded like I was the first time trying to look back at my work. I loaded the 3do model and tried to import the texture map to no avail. Then I realized I should of loaded the s3o model first. :)

SpikedHelmet · Post by **SpikedHelmet** » 17 Apr 2007, 03:29

Hi, I don't know if this has been addressed before, but I still can not get Upspring to load UV Co-Ordinates.

I don't know how to explain it, other than to give directions to duplicate the problem. So here goes!

1. Open up any .S3O or .3DO model (if .3do, convert to .s3o and save)
2. Select "Export model for uv mapping" and export it.
3. UV map it.
4. Select "Import UV coordinates from model" and import new uv coordinates from uv mapped model.
5. Select "Show UV mapping"
6. Observe that no UV map was infact loaded.

It used to be that this problem rarely occured (several versions ago). Now no matter what I do I can't get uv coordinates to load. I use Ultimate Unwrap 3D, and I've tried both .obj and .3ds to do this. Also, I can load the entire model itself with Upspring (file>load model) and the UV co-ordinates show up fine. its just when trying to import uv coordinates to place them onto the spring model that they fuck up.

Argh · Post by **Argh** » 17 Apr 2007, 03:55

Spiked, no offense... but why not just map it and paint it BEFORE importing? With 3DS imports, you aren't going to screw up Piece placement, so there's simply no reason not to do it this way imo.

Post by **jcnossen** » 17 Apr 2007, 04:04

There might be a bug in that area I guess, vertex handling has been modified a lot in the latest version IIRC, and i havent tested the particular UV import feature for 1.54.

But i have no time :/

Spring RTS Engine

Upspring 1.54