[IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure - Page 4

[IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

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smoth
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by smoth »

gajop wrote:
smoth wrote:
gajop wrote:Content such as maps, games, AIs and missions should be in ~/spring, but configs should be in ~/.config/spring probably
is ~ userland?

what about spring games that have different spring settings? what about multiple engine version installs? Seems short sighted.
Engine is technically content and should be in ~/spring/engines
Config belongs to ~/.config/spring or ~/.config/ as I said.
Nothing prevents you from having multiple configs for different games/engine versions in ~/.config/spring, i.e. ~/.config/spring/engine91.0 (folder or file), or ~/.config/zero-k
~/engines makes little sense in userland to me. I'd prefer if they did a /bin/ and /libs/ folder in the base spring dir.

A) how does your ~/configs/ scheme work with portable spring?

B) how do spring games say to set X config when springsettings is part of springlobby?

C) How would that even be managed at first run of a spring game?
C1) would it inherit the base settings from the spring config?

D) can the engine versions and games already specify which spring settings config file to use without having to run spring with parameters?
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Forboding Angel
Evolution RTS Developer
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by Forboding Angel »

hoijui wrote:a user is in general not a spring user, but a computer user. you are the ego guy, for thinking it is all about your game/spring.
So how's that job at Micro$oft coming along?
Silentwings wrote:I think putting infolog anywhere even slightly difficult to find is a bad idea - its the basic tool for bugfixing anything. Mod devs often need to see their payers infologs when they complain of some widget/gfx error, and quite a few times times a bug has been repored because I (and presumably others too) persuaded a user to upload their infolog to mantis.
^^ This... +900000000000000001.

If you cannot see the sense in that statement you should give yourself headslaps repeatedly until it sinks in.
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hoijui
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by hoijui »

@smoth
A, C & D are not affected by a change from ~/.spring to ~/.config/spring.
it is already user global as is, always was. it would just be a change from the older standard to a newer one, which splits up stuff more in terms of kind of content of the files (config, cache, content, logs, ...) instead of the application.

B would also be independent of this change
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smoth
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by smoth »

as it stands now, what I am trying to do is call gajop out on a claim that I am not sure is possible which is game specific configs. After ZK decided to fuck with my FOV and I had to hunt down a config to undo the change I have been asking, why do all games use the same config file.
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FLOZi
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by FLOZi »

smoth wrote:as it stands now, what I am trying to do is call gajop out on a claim that I am not sure is possible which is game specific configs. After ZK decided to fuck with my FOV and I had to hunt down a config to undo the change I have been asking, why do all games use the same config file.
Depends if all configs can be set via lua.. which iirc there was a mantis on, basically they can but some require a restart. But yeah I think it is 'doable' but not in a native 'my game uses this local copy of springsettings.cfg' way.
varikonniemi
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by varikonniemi »

Smoth: IMO the clearest/cleanest way is to have a button in SL that says "open game data directory" "open config directory" etc.

That said, my opinion is still to have everything in some form of hierarchy under ~/.spring/ (or implement the full XDG spec)

Where ever the configs will go, it is quite easy to have game specific configs override the default one. Just use the game name as the config file to look for. (by default springsettings.cfg is used, but if zero-k.cfg is found it overrides.)
Last edited by varikonniemi on 13 May 2013, 12:07, edited 6 times in total.
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Silentwings
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by Silentwings »

After ZK decided to fuck with my FOV and I had to hunt down a config to undo the change I have been asking, why do all games use the same config file.
Maybe submit a bug report - afaik its possible to read the fov settings, save old values, change values for game, then set back to old values on exit. But meh, its ugly either way.
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enetheru
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by enetheru »

varikonniemi wrote:Smoth: IMO the clearest/cleanest way is to have a button in SL that says "open game data directory" "open config directory" etc.

That said, my opinion is still to have everything in some form of hierarchy under ~/.spring/ (or implement the full XDG spec)

Where ever the configs will go, it is quite easy to have game specific configs override the default one. Just use the game name as the config file to look for. (by default springsettings.cfg is used, but if zero-k.cfg is found it overrides.)
I like the way you think. however, I don't think implementing the full XDG spec will happen in one shot, so I'm more than happy with incremental changes to that effect.

Its always annoyed me that spring has old defacto standards instead of the latest ones..

http://standards.freedesktop.org/basedi ... atest.html

I dont want my home dir to be filled with junk
varikonniemi
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by varikonniemi »

Thank you for your kind words.

I am quite comfortable by my opinions when i speak out, i am a product designer by profession so this is what i do.

The reason i think everything under one directory is better than the XDG spec is because it is so much easier for the end-user and no functionality is lost.

But the worst situation is to halfway implement the spec, and halfway use something home-cooked. The worst of two worlds. And this is what it seems 95 will contain :(
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hoijui
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by hoijui »

... as was already said, the new standard (XDG?) does make sense, in practice. so not implementing it DOES mean you loose functionality, namely the ones this standard was inventend for, like being able to clean the cache of many applications at once, or backing up all your configuration (and only the configuration).
as you also do not seem to get it:
it is just a matter of scale. if you think only about this one application, the old standard is better. if you think about all the applications, the new one is better. the truth lies somewhere in-between, and somewhere else in-between for every user. i think though, it is sane to assume that the general linux user that will use spring, will use his machine for more then just spring, or primarily for spring.
i agree that something in-between does not make much sense.
se5a
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by se5a »

So...

If I've got multiple user accounts on a windows7 that all play Spring,
how do I set it up without having multiple redundant installs in each userspace?
abma
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by abma »

create symbolic links of the affected folders to one folder?!
se5a
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by se5a »

What, for each user account?
abma
Spring Developer
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by abma »

yep. you can try to set a global SPRING_WRITEDIR env var, but its very likely that some tool / lobby will fail and i assume you can't guaranty that an other user doesn't use an other lobby or download tool. a symlink for each user is imo the only way you can be sure it will work.
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AF
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by AF »

I just have to laugh at the idea of a content dev, or any developer or modder of any kind, who still has hidden files hidden in their file manager....

For the average joe, the archive mover, and whatever lobby system and download manager is all they need to know
gajop
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by gajop »

AF wrote:I just have to laugh at the idea of a content dev, or any developer or modder of any kind, who still has hidden files hidden in their file manager....
I have them hidden, I rarely use a file manager when I develop stuff, as I use terminals for navigation. And when I do use a file manager I really don't want to see hundreds of dotfiles in $HOME.
AF wrote: For the average joe, the archive mover, and whatever lobby system and download manager is all they need to know
Yes, agree.
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FLOZi
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by FLOZi »

Except ArchiveMover was removed years ago.
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AF
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Re: [IMPORTANT] 95.0 will got a new folder structure

Post by AF »

I have it on good authority that a dedicated conspiracy of Archive Mover lovers are actively covering up its usage from FLOZI. It must be the icon I made for it that keeps them so besotted

But it was more the sentiment, most users have no idea what rapid or plasma or whichever downloader is currently in vogue
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