Spring RTS Engine

well i dont think it's fair to compare KAI with any other AIs since it's cheating

unfortunately 2 AAI vs 2 KAI games get too slow in late game (i use a core2duo e6600), it seems KAI uses a significant amount of cpu power in late game. But in the beginning KAI is definitly stronger than AAI due to its fast expansion

Engine Of Darkness wrote:RAI handeds KAIK ass on Supreme Battlefield (32x32) after 1.35h a historic moment appeared: 4 AIs (2core vs 2arm (KAIK vs RAI)) managed to END a GAME. END!!!!.

once again i tested the kaik 0.13 again rai 0.551 on supreme battlefield and kaik 0.13 took everything except the water because it never makes boat ... making test with kaik on water map is stupid anyway

@Satirik: Actually no, making test on different maps with different scenarios only reveals weak points of the AI, therefore helping the dev to potentially make the ai better.

submarine: What I generally observed was that the game slows down alot as soon as there are "xxx can't reach it's target" stuff and "build pos blocked". Most AIs spamm the commands like crazy then for some time, therefore slowing the game down.

I noted that first in QAI, it sometimes spammed these commands for a few seconds and frames dropped like crazy, not just 10-20 fps, more like a drop of 40 fps and more.

submarine: What I generally observed was that the game slows down alot as soon as there are "xxx can't reach it's target" stuff and "build pos blocked". Most AIs spamm the commands like crazy then for some time, therefore slowing the game down.

I noted that first in QAI, it sometimes spammed these commands for a few seconds and frames dropped like crazy, not just 10-20 fps, more like a drop of 40 fps and more.

This sounds awfully familiar. The usually AI mentioned isnt AAI or QAI though.

Please look at the last 5 months of NTai development, then compare.

Qman solved alot of the slowdown we had first. Actually I think I was the only one investing hours of my free time just watching his AI play, writing down what problems occured, what could be done better, took screenshots of bugs I noticed...

It's a shame QAI came to a stop after some time though .

The QAI code is available on unknown files but I was under the impression that it was never really a very competitive AI. Certainly not when compared with RAI and AAI at the time.

is there a new (working) aai?

the-middleman wrote:is there a new (working) aai?

There is, but it's made for svn version of Spring. That means it won't work with 0.75b2, but it will be in the next release.

DJ wrote:The QAI code is available on unknown files but I was under the impression that it was never really a very competitive AI. Certainly not when compared with RAI and AAI at the time.

He was mostly fixing bugs at that time. We made some sort of "Bugs/Ideas" document some time ago. But Qman stopped working on QAI soon after that, so the AI didn't get developed further.

I'm not sure if he actually did, but he tried to use no maphack (well only letting the ai know the start positions, but that's no hack, seeing as you as a player can also predict the start position as long as it's not "choose ingame" or "random").

Anyway, I hope that atleast RAI and KAIK stay around.

Nothing against AAI or NTAI, I certainly respect the work done by the devs of them. However I doubt that random users who want to play a mod other than the standard one are going to make configs for them.

We the AAI configs are really trivial to make, in reality there should be a config included with any mod that is downloaded seeing as AAI is bundled with Spring. Seems to me if you've gone to the trouble of creating a whole mod a 20 line text file isn't a massive piece of work...

NTai is a difficult one, potentially it has all the potential in the world. I have a config on my pc for BA that beats all the other AI's hands down. Unfortunately its built using a 4 month old version of NTai which happens to be the last build without a crash bug, but also has some performance issues... I think when (probably more if) we get a stable version of NTai it could become the most popular AI. The configs may require work but they do present a much greater opportunity for the AI to play a mod how it is intended to be played.

My own hope is that someone will adopt the config format and start a new AI. TSI (the polish one I think) was a config based AI but they never released the code or the config format which is a shame as it was quite competitive.

the-middleman wrote:is there a new (working) aai?

you can download a spring svn installer from buildbot (have a look at the aai 0.83 thread for the url), current aai and kaik are included