Updated site layout ready?

[Argh]

How typical. All three of you, trying to destroy the energy and enthusiasm of a genuine community effort, and not one of you can find the time to actually do anything but type

If Fnordia destroys my art, takes it down, whatever, that's his call, but I will not make more and will require that it's all taken down, as the copyright holder. I understand that what was done with the PNG was an experiment, but as an artist, I'm not happy, it basically ruined hours of my time and talent put to the task.

I'm not going to obey your stupid rules, guys, and if you get your way, I will not be participating. If we cannot market with the 'site, it's worthless to me and I have no incentive to help.

There's obviously no way for us to reach a compromise here and please everyone, so it's just going to have to go one way or another on this.

Either we can market effectively, which means no bullshit, if it's not in violation of TOS then we can use it... or we can't, because everything looks the same and nobody cares.

I won't help with that vision- I stepped up because I thought I'd be given freedom to figure stuff out, and before you guys wrecked my day with this vile nonsense, I was having a good time with it, and happily anticipating competition that would help drive improvements- not a bunch of wankers who are too lazy to step up.

Fnordia, if you want me to compromise on the banners, meh, I'll think it over, but honestly, I think caving in to these guys, and not requiring them to put their time where their mouths are and demonstrate that they actually know what they're talking about is just going to mean nothing worthwhile gets done, again.

I think it's very telling that me and NOiZE came in, and just started working, while these guys sat and took potshots all day, even though I made a very public statement about what I was doing, and when it would be done.

If you want them to run this show and set up their rules and other bullshit, be my guest, but it's no way to run a railroad and I will not help. This is Open Source, not Reward the Guys who Do Nothing Useful.

[Warlord Zsinj]

Argh, I don't think anything I said warranted a lecture, and I had imagined I had earned enough respect from you as a modder (rather than a 'guy that does nothing useful' to not be spoken down too. I don't want to get into an argument, but I'm offended.

Besides which, we are having a level-headed discussion, and you've just issued an ultimatum and refused to cooperate, and I'm destroying the energy and enthusiasm?

All I'm saying is that having large mod logos on the frontpage is wrong, and shouldn't be done. Having rules is necessary when you've got 20 people making images for a single site, and you want to maintain a cohesive design. There is no impact difference between having a big "PURE" logo, and having a small bit of text that says "pure". None. Your impact is from the image itself, not the logo. If someone likes the image, they'll read the source text.

My interests don't vary at all from yours. I want to advertise my mod on the frontpage too. But I don't need to stick a huge "IMPERIAL WINTER!!!!!" logo there. The images will speak for themelves, and if someone wants to know where it's from, they can read the small unimposing text.

[Warlord Zsinj]

In between posting first in this thread and posting now, 3 hours have passed, all of have been while I am work, so I can't sit down and make some serious banners.

Nonetheless, I still did post a picture showing exactly how the picture with the white text would look. Have you been reading my posts at all?

[aegis]

the main spring page is for advertising spring

mods are an afterthought

someone already said this, but if you put too much on the page, people won't know what to think

this is the spring home page

the largest text and the largest logo should say "Spring"
the next largest should be talking about spring

I vote for a 12 pt font in the bottom right corner of the banner/welcome screen pointing to the mod
i.e. "from P.U.R.E." and have a link

[aegis]

argh, the front page isn't for downloading mods

it's for downloading the engine

pretty pictures with huge text advertising things other than the engine send a mixed message

[smoth]

WOw, nice edit argh.

Again, I was supporting you man. However, the frontpage of spring would be showcasing projects for the promotion of the engine. In the post you ignored I said that it is a GREAT honor to be featured as a representation of what the engine can do. After all the work that has been done for you by the devs you are standing on the shoulders of giants man.

[aegis]

You just don't get it- if there isn't a big splash with 0.77, this project is probably toast, people.

we have no shortage of players

Code: Select all

Active accounts in the last 1 day:	1157

None of you seem to understand that we need to emulate the commercial world, which has certain practices and rules because they WORK.

yeah. when someone buys Windows, it's because it has a picture of Crysis on the front with large text explaining such.

[Argh]

More correctly, when you go to Microsoft's website, you may see an advertisement for Crysis on Vista.

Are you just being willfully stupid, people? Go to GameSpy- it is about GameSpy's hosting and other services? No, they're promoting games that hook into them. That's what works.

If the front page gets turned into a mausoleum of pretty graphics, that's fine... I'm just not going to be there. The engine is there to make games with- it has no purpose otherwise.

And a weekly playerbase of 1100 people is not very large. Freelancer probably still pulls three times that, and it's closed-source, had no modding support, and the main website was shut down for almost six months.

[Warlord Zsinj]

Your images are fine argh, I just think you don't need a huge logo because it works against the information on the page, makes the page too busy, and distracts from the point of the page, which is advertising the Spring engine.

Again, I have no different interests then you. I have a mod that I make, and I want it to be advertised as well. I think it'd be in the best interests of my mod if the Spring front page looks slick and professional. In the image you presented it didn't. This was because of the logos, not because your images were ugly.

I actually thought noize's Balanced Annihilation logo in the header distracted a lot more then your pure logo, but both were not working, in my opinion. However, I did indicate this in the mockup that I did, which you appear to have not seen.

I strongly recommend against calling me a mealy mouthed asshole.

[Forboding Angel]

Well, it does help when people arguing against an idea, have some meat to back up their comments as opposed to sarcasm and jabs.

Sweet jesus I love this place.

Ain't it grand?

@argh, 18 pt sounds reasonable, but 12 is just ludacris.

I as well am going to bed, I suppose I've fueled the fail enough for one night.

[SpikedHelmet]

See, this is why communism will never work. It offers no forum for addressing conflicts of non-material interests between two parties without the overhead structure of a semi-centralized judiciary system.

Kidding. But anyway, if designing game banners is such a point of contention, then it would seem obvious to me that there needs to be some sort of arbitrator, someone who can honestly say they have no biased, vested interest one way or another, who will either oversee or themselves design said banners for all mods. Someone with graphic design capability, who's part of the Spring community, who would be willing to work with dev teams to create "equal" banners for all.

I nominate NOT ME.

[AF]

hmmmm

Do you remember the spring delusion blogpost? And the CA vs BA blogpost? . Ive long considered Noize a friend, not that this doesn't excuse him from being the subject of blog posts, just as it doesn't stop me making posts praising PURE blogposts.

While I do not object to people putting logos in the main image, those logos should not stand out. If I want to know where the screen shot came from I should look at it and see a logo but it should not be so imposing as to clash or conflict with the site itself. A 32x32 logo in the bottom right corner would be fine imo, it doesn't stand out but can be found if looked for.

The point that we should follow commercial practices does not support what you want either. If we did that we'd have a clean minimal site geared towards coders, developers, and business people. End users would fear our website as some corporate advertisement aimed at large companies who are looking for game engines for the next big game.

If anything the commercial practices argument supports my own idea that it is the P.U.R.E website not the spring website that should serve as the primary gateway for new P.U.R.E users. It would certainly prevent old BA players from arriving at the spring front page looking for P.U.R.E and going 'ooh I've been here before, tried it already, kthxbai'

As for doing nothing, I seriously doubt any site work would have been done beyond tim blodjiks site if I hadn't pushed forward. Remember I built an entire site and theme on my own for the most part sitting in the svn. Which is why its so important we deploy what we have and continue working on the site so we can deploy the final version, because what we have right now at nyspring.clan-sy.com is still miles ahead of what this site is.

[Hoi]

instead of discussing, most of you want to be right, and you dont even know about what, whats wrong with archs big pure 'logo' make that the standard size or something, not too small, not too large, the front should be about spring and whats a better way to show spring than with pictures of its mod? at the same time you can advertise for the mod. look you've just done two things at once! the only thing that annoys me is the box, i suggest not making a box but just darkning the image below that, it might look better, atm the box distorts the image, which looks kina unpro

[Warlord Zsinj]

Why do you think it's ludicrous? The point is really that it's a subtitle, sort of like this:



The image is really there as an example of what the Spring engine is capable of, and then as an aside, is also a nice way to advertise our mods, but this is secondary. If a player's attention is caught by the image itself, then they might want to know which mod it is (if they don't already know), so they'll look, and it'll be there. It's just an information bite, not an advertisement billboard - the billboard is the screenshot itself.

Hope I'm making more sense.

[AF]

Here is an example of what i meant overlaid ontop of the original:

[Warlord Zsinj]

Yeah, I guess that'd be fine too. I prefer simple stripped back sansserif text, but that'd be ok, it's not too dominating on the page.

RE: Spike's idea of having a single person to adjudicate on those sorts of things, I would strongly recommend getting roflcopter to do this, if he can spare the time.

[AF]

I would also propose myself neuralize and aGorm alongside roflcopter for that duty with the intention that the list should grow as necessary so that no one person is taxed or should one be absent for a week or two the others can pick up

[Warlord Zsinj]

If aGorm has any free time to be spending on photoshop he needs to spend it texturing IW units

[Crayfish]

...Blimey

I think you all need to sit down over some beer and do some bonding.

[Machiosabre]