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Michilus_nimbus wrote:I'd rather go to hell than worship the Christian god.

Hell is a christian idea, meaning that you are saying that you believe in the Christian god, meaning that you are saying that you would love to go to hell :)

Gota wrote:This is wrong.

look, you can't say that in the middle of a discussion, which, up to this point, has being mature. You have an opinion (which i didnt bother reading) which is fine, but on this issue you cant go out and flatly say "This is wrong".

and you wonder why people dont read your posts.,,

A better start would of been " My view is .." or "My opinion is... "

Michilus_nimbus wrote:I'd rather go to hell than worship the Christian god.

Incorrect...

. . . . . .

SwiftSpear wrote:

Michilus_nimbus wrote:I'd rather go to hell than worship the Christian god.

Incorrect...

That has to be, possibly, the dumbest oxymoron I've ever read.

If you honestly believed hell existed you'd do anything to avoid it. That being said, I consider myself Christian and I don't believe in hell. Hell is the religious authoritarians tool of oppression. I don't believe there is any authoritative information God has ever given humanity based on the afterlife aside from that he does something good for those who he deems worthy. Effectively the afterlife should be irrelevant to the life of a human, since there is no way we can possibly gain information about it, or control it with any sense of authority.

God doesn't tell people where he's sending them after they die.

SwiftSpear wrote:If you honestly believed hell existed you'd do anything to avoid it. That being said, I consider myself Christian and I don't believe in hell. Hell is the religious authoritarians tool of oppression. I don't believe there is any authoritative information God has ever given humanity based on the afterlife aside from that he does something good for those who he deems worthy. Effectively the afterlife should be irrelevant to the life of a human, since there is no way we can possibly gain information about it, or control it with any sense of authority.

God doesn't tell people where he's sending them after they die.

Jesus talks about Hell all the time (or He alludes to it at least). In Revelation it talks about the Lake of Fire being the second death. It comes up numerous times in the Epistles. How can you then say that Hell is simply a tool for oppression?

I think it's a misunderstanding of Hell that allows it to be used for oppression. It's really a misunderstanding of God overall.

LOL RELIGION!

If you wanna be real technical, there is not hell yet. It is being prepared (Actually for that matter, so is Heaven as we percieve it).

Gota, once again your are a person confusing catholics with protestants (sp :<). Catholics pray to Mary, the mother of god, which actually is breaking two of the ten commandments:

Thou shalt not put any gods before me.
Thou shalt not worship idols

Wording is not 100% exact, but that is what they mean.

Boirunner, you have to understand something tho.

The simple fact is that everyone is born with sin, which is an abomination to god, so god is by pretense a merciful god for even allowing us to live in the first place...

More later, work is kinda busy tonight.

The idea we've all be cursed from birth with some prehistoric primordial sin bugs the ever loving snot out of me.

It strikes me as just as bad as all those jackass cynical atheists who say we're nothing more than a bunch of psychotic apes.

As anyone who's spent more than five minuets talking to me would realize, I am a optimist and thus far nothing has been able to change my mind, though I'm sure saying something like that is cue for life to kick me in the nuts.

Bah.

Zoombie wrote:The idea we've all be cursed from birth with some prehistoric primordial sin bugs the ever loving snot out of me.

It strikes me as just as bad as all those jackass cynical atheists who say we're nothing more than a bunch of psychotic apes.

As anyone who's spent more than five minuets talking to me would realize, I am a optimist and thus far nothing has been able to change my mind, though I'm sure saying something like that is cue for life to kick me in the nuts.

Bah.

I imagine there are many atheist optimists who believe that we're a bit more than psychotic apes ~_~

Many of the Protestant divisions don't believe in original sin. Calvinism IIRC believes that you go to heaven and hell based on something before you were born and there's nothing you can do in life to stop it, which is pretty lol.

you're all a bunch of idiots for trying to debate this point online

You're acting like there is a huge flamewar going on, and I don't see that. From nearly anything I have read from the main contributors in this thread, everything ahs mostly been in discussion form as opposed to religion bashing.

As far as boirunners view vs mine, as an agnostic I can actually pick a side, plus in a way his viewpoint facinates me, so therefore, I play advocate of the other side and we discuss. I don't think either of us have offended the other.

Just chill people. "The flames of a million posts that decimated the forums" is not likely to happen.

Zoombie wrote:The idea we've all be cursed from birth with some prehistoric primordial sin bugs the ever loving snot out of me.

It strikes me as just as bad as all those jackass cynical atheists who say we're nothing more than a bunch of psychotic apes.

As anyone who's spent more than five minuets talking to me would realize, I am a optimist and thus far nothing has been able to change my mind, though I'm sure saying something like that is cue for life to kick me in the nuts.

Bah.

don't worry, just put some water on your forehead.

manored wrote:Hell is a christian idea

Hell is a germanic word, from Hel. Same with God, for what its worth, related to Odin (God, Godan, Odan, Odin).

Both ideas and words predate christianity significantly, if you dont buy the linguistic evidence of presence of the words (germanic) and concepts in pre-christian paganism (esp egyptian) then you can at least admit they were jewish concepts first.

just for fun

watch me

in advance, the movie does not present counter-points at all and it's pretty bias.

Watch yoursleves with that movie.. It is not factual..It takes many things and sticks them together plus makes some things up whcih are not supported by any true evidance.. more of an opinion mixed with some scientific theories.

Saktoth wrote:

manored wrote:Hell is a christian idea

Hell is a germanic word, from Hel. Same with God, for what its worth, related to Odin (God, Godan, Odan, Odin).

Both ideas and words predate christianity significantly, if you dont buy the linguistic evidence of presence of the words (germanic) and concepts in pre-christian paganism (esp egyptian) then you can at least admit they were jewish concepts first.

Well it was the christian religion that made the concept of hell and heaven be know by virtually everone :)

Many of God actions on bibble are based on the concept of that if one sins not only him but his dencendents must too pay (I believe this is because sons are similar to their fathers), so that would make the idea of original sin make sense.

manored wrote:Well it was the christian religion that made the concept of hell and heaven be know by virtually everone :)

Pretty much every mythology ever had a good and a bad version of the afterlife. Christianity is nothing special concerning that.

Many of God actions on bibble are based on the concept of that if one sins not only him but his dencendents must too pay (I believe this is because sons are similar to their fathers), so that would make the idea of original sin make sense.

And in our understanding, this is horribly unjust. Just about every system of law on the earth forbids punishing family of a culprit. It's even in the human rights declaration that this is forbidden.

guys

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