RIP BA - Page 2

RIP BA

Various things about Spring that do not fit in any of the other forums listed below, including forum rules.

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OPAdolfSatan
Posts: 35
Joined: 28 Nov 2016, 10:27

Re: RIP BA

Post by OPAdolfSatan » 19 Apr 2019, 18:51

Forboding Angel wrote:
19 Apr 2019, 01:56
Probably because it isn't a problem.

Please avoid making posts which belittle other users and offer no constructive response. (Silentwings)
You say its not a problem? Well i cant really take you seriously when you never played B.A and you did tried to balance the mod with no ingame time, i think thats the huge issue. A confuse man who thinks he knows alot of things but actually only knows how to afk at his own mod with 2 players. Tell you what i'll do your evo mod a favor and balance it for you. It makes logical sense for me to balance a mod that i never once played in. If this post is considered "unrelated" then you shouldn't be posting in any topics related to B.A hmmm... curious Dolfy. Very suspicious Forboding angel makes me wonder...
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Bigfonzie2
Posts: 4
Joined: 12 Jun 2016, 20:39

Re: RIP BA

Post by Bigfonzie2 » 19 Apr 2019, 19:06

Well, all I can say is that I am not happy that the older engine 103 and BA V9.46 are no longer fully available to be hosted onto the Spring Lobby Official Host.

I just want to play BA and I don't understand why things cant be maintained so that both engines can carry on.


I enjoy all of your inputs, but it will be very difficult for new players to join if no matches can be played.


I hope we can all come to a reasonable solution to all of this.


And I hope BA continues..... as its an amazing (prbly the best) RTS on PC currently.

PEACE
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dansan
Server Owner & Developer
Posts: 1192
Joined: 29 May 2010, 23:40

Re: RIP BA

Post by dansan » 19 Apr 2019, 21:36

While there is noone preventing you from using Windows XP, there isn't a single modern website anymore that supports IE6.
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cghislai
Posts: 7
Joined: 19 Aug 2010, 17:21

Re: RIP BA

Post by cghislai » 19 Apr 2019, 21:43

Indeed, it is so sad players left.

I totally understand the dev team wanting to push forward and drop support for legacy code/api.

Shutting down a service - event tho the term could be debatable in this case - is never a good idea tho.
Although it is not a software rewrite neither, I wish dev read https://medium.com/@herbcaudill/lessons ... 5e4c8f7c22

Hopefully, being open source, ba is not dead and i notice an alternative lobby is already up running ba9.46 games. springfightclub.com:8200
It is sad to see the community splits tho, I would prefer to see it embracing spring104, ba10.
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Forboding Angel
Evolution RTS Developer
Posts: 14606
Joined: 17 Nov 2005, 02:43

Re: RIP BA

Post by Forboding Angel » 19 Apr 2019, 22:33

You guys realize that it would only take like a day to make it 104 ready...

Isn't phoenix annihilation 104 ready? Wasn't that Ares grand plan to wrest BA from the clutches of those evil evil doers?

What happened to that? If PA is 104 compatible, play that instead?


Also, regarding dead projects, it was never really about the player count for me. I wanted to have a fun and accessible RTS game that vets and noobs could both enjoy. I've effectively accomplished that.

You and people like you are what has hurt spring the most. We used to have 300 people constantly playing games in the lobby, but when AA was discontinued, warc took AA, turned it into BA, the lobby mods got tired of playing wackamole and let your games fester with your own toxicity. Over time people left because of your behavior and now you're left with people just like you.

People who continually bite the hand that feeds them, then whine about not being fed.

Bottom line, spend some time learning how to update your game. It isn't hard, hell, I personally have updated BA twice to 104 compatibility. It took me about 30 minutes. But at this point due to the way that you have continually lied about me, made up random shit about me, lied about what I have actually done with BA, lied about my supposed influence on floris' and Doo, lies about me inventing botflags (lolwut?🤣🤣🤣🤣), metaphorically speaking, if you were dying of thirst in the desert, I wouldn't piss in your mouth.
Last edited by Forboding Angel on 19 Apr 2019, 22:47, edited 1 time in total.
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cghislai
Posts: 7
Joined: 19 Aug 2010, 17:21

Re: RIP BA

Post by cghislai » 19 Apr 2019, 22:46

I don't realize, it is good news and I hope ares will succeed.
I must admit that this was a bad move however. The ba community clearly did stay put on the 9.46mod/103 engine although the ba10/spring104 was out for a long time. Forcing it out could only lead to a bad outcome.
Moreover, the current ba10 mods require unreleased engine that - if im not mistaken - could lead to an unplayable game if an invalid combination is used. Im not talking of mac support as I dont own one.

I understand the urge to move forward. I don't understand the need to clean up behind so quickly.
I must admit that I haven't checked the reasons for the ban beyond the homepage announcement details.

EDIT-havent checked those other mods neither, but you probably know the reason the community didn't move from ba9.46, and you probably know playing a clone mod with a different name is like playing a different game for some people :)

EDIT-waw, i wans't aware of the animosity between the dev team and this community. I only enjoy ba as it reminds me ota. I wish we would move to ba10, really. dont care much of the balance tweaks personnaly.
Last edited by cghislai on 19 Apr 2019, 22:53, edited 1 time in total.
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Forboding Angel
Evolution RTS Developer
Posts: 14606
Joined: 17 Nov 2005, 02:43

Re: RIP BA

Post by Forboding Angel » 19 Apr 2019, 22:50

< 104 contained a DOS exploit for one thing

And that's the thing about nicknames, they can change *mind BLOWN*

Edit: @cgh , that wasn't aimed at you, it was aimed at Adolf, Ares, etc.
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very_bad_soldier
Posts: 1371
Joined: 20 Feb 2007, 01:10

Re: RIP BA

Post by very_bad_soldier » 19 Apr 2019, 22:58

Forboding Angel wrote:
19 Apr 2019, 22:33
metaphorically speaking, if you were dying of thirst in the desert, I wouldn't piss in your mouth.
Would you at least stop joining every forum thread remotely related to BA and flooding it with your toxicity? Also every time you say "you" you actually mean Ares, no?
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Flash
Posts: 32
Joined: 12 Dec 2010, 18:03

Re: RIP BA

Post by Flash » 20 Apr 2019, 01:41

Forboding Angel wrote:
20 Apr 2019, 01:12
Forboding Angel wrote:
19 Apr 2019, 22:50
Edit: @cgh , that wasn't aimed at you, it was aimed at Adolf, Ares, etc.
very_bad_soldier wrote:
19 Apr 2019, 22:58
Would you at least stop joining every forum thread remotely related to BA and flooding it with your toxicity?

Just as soon as you and others publicly apologize for the lies. Otherwise, suck my massive botflag. I invented the botflag, FYI.

I also bathe in the hot blooded mantears of BA players.
Is this how SpringDevs want to be represented?
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Forboding Angel
Evolution RTS Developer
Posts: 14606
Joined: 17 Nov 2005, 02:43

Re: RIP BA

Post by Forboding Angel » 20 Apr 2019, 01:51

I don't represent the engine developers in any capacity.

That said, I could ask you the same... This is how BA players want to be represented?
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Flash
Posts: 32
Joined: 12 Dec 2010, 18:03

Re: RIP BA

Post by Flash » 20 Apr 2019, 02:17

Forboding Angel wrote:
20 Apr 2019, 01:51
I don't represent the engine developers in any capacity.

That said, I could ask you the same... This is how BA players want to be represented?
Me and other players are asking for an explanation why our favorite mod is banned.

Only explanation we get is :
"ba9 is in stoneage and it will die if we dont ban it" (meanwhile it dies because of the ban)
"BA= TA or BA= PA" (can only be said by people that never played)
"its not banned you can still play quality 4vs4" (since most of the players aim for 8vs8 or 16 players FFA this makes me speechless)
"just fix ba9 it just takes 2 hours" (i watched the ba10 development and im pretty sure it would take a lot longer)

Of course me and others havent been too pollite in this frustrating discussion but you just pour oil into the fire
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gajop
Moderator
Posts: 3023
Joined: 05 Aug 2009, 20:42

Re: RIP BA

Post by gajop » 20 Apr 2019, 02:48

This discussion has started badly and only gotten worse. Try to maintain some level of civility - we will have to lock it if all you do is throwing punches around.
Please remember, despite the obvious lack of appreciation for the community, Forb had nothing to do with this decision. Aim your grievances better...
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Forboding Angel
Evolution RTS Developer
Posts: 14606
Joined: 17 Nov 2005, 02:43

Re: RIP BA

Post by Forboding Angel » 20 Apr 2019, 03:37

Flash wrote:
20 Apr 2019, 02:17
Me and other players are asking for an explanation why our favorite mod is banned.
If your premise is flawed, your conclusion will be as well.

BA was never banned.
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Megatron
Posts: 36
Joined: 14 Feb 2018, 00:42

Re: RIP BA

Post by Megatron » 20 Apr 2019, 04:59

Allowing BA players to play 103/9.46 wasn't hurting anyone. Banning 103 (except for 4v4 for some unexplained reason) hurts the BA userbase.
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Silentwings
Moderator
Posts: 3597
Joined: 25 Oct 2008, 00:23

Re: RIP BA

Post by Silentwings » 20 Apr 2019, 08:20

Isn't phoenix annihilation 104 ready?
It isn't, although afaict the cause is that there was ~zero play-testing in advance, by anyone who actually wanted to use it. (Despite much opportunity to do so, and much time available to report / fix any problems that could have been found.)

There is a not-yet-ready attempt to fix up PA to work with 104.0.1-1208, as a minimal effort migration of BA9.46. Currently the work, which is small but non-zero, comes mainly from "kind folk", rather than from anyone wanting to regularly play it. This is not sustainable in the long term. There have been two notable (and welcome) contributions from players who read the wiki, pm'ed folk with questions, and put in some hard work to contribute - more of that will be needed if there is any prospect for long term survival.

As always, any major engine upgrade comes with some difference in feel, and it won't be a perfect copy.

There is a good supply of people from other projects (& the long retired, such as myself) who are able to help / support / provide access to those who want to put in the effort to produce a successor to BA9.46. What is not clear is if those who want it, want it enough to actually produce it. (And, in the free software world, no one else is going to!)
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very_bad_soldier
Posts: 1371
Joined: 20 Feb 2007, 01:10

Re: RIP BA

Post by very_bad_soldier » 20 Apr 2019, 10:39

Lots of people here seem to live under the impression that every _player_ here automatically also is a spring game developer or can become one within 15 minutes. This is not the case.
Do you contribute to every open source project you are a user of? Do you test nightly builds and give feedback of all open source projects you are a user of? I think it is up to everyone himself to decide what to do in his free time for no money and where to contribute.

Also, you are strongly refusing that players demand anything from the devs as this is a free project they do in their free time. Ok, but in my opinion you should not be demanding anything from other people back as well then (play testing, developing...).
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Silentwings
Moderator
Posts: 3597
Joined: 25 Oct 2008, 00:23

Re: RIP BA

Post by Silentwings » 20 Apr 2019, 10:59

you are strongly refusing that players demand anything from the devs
If 'you' is 'me', then no - anyone can demand anything from anyone, but I am more interested in how people actually get stuff. As it stands, any such demands are currently pointless because BA/PA has no developers or maintainers, and if it's going to survive long term then it will need to find/produce some.
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Kloot
Spring Developer
Posts: 1865
Joined: 08 Oct 2006, 16:58

Re: RIP BA

Post by Kloot » 20 Apr 2019, 11:02

Allowing ... 103 wasn't hurting anyone.
It was hurting engine development.

If said development ends (why would anyone want to contribute when all they see getting airtime is some old engine from N years ago?), the only reasonable expected outcome is that Spring's server will be unceremoniously shutdown along with it. Do you understand this?

Your argument (either out of willful ignorance or out of self-serving interest) also ignores the history of Mando's exploits, which were used to regularly hurt players (viewtopic.php?f=16&t=36556 etc), so it holds no factual weight.
demanding
Having an actively maintained game compatible with a certain minimum Spring version isn't a "demand". Rather it is a well-founded necessary condition for being (bot-)hostable on this server, and as has now been said many times before (e.g. in viewtopic.php?p=590653#p590653) you can always choose to set up your own infrastructure.
Last edited by Kloot on 20 Apr 2019, 13:36, edited 1 time in total.
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hokomoko
Spring Developer
Posts: 585
Joined: 02 Jun 2014, 00:46

Re: RIP BA

Post by hokomoko » 20 Apr 2019, 12:58

You want a working game, talking isn't going to do the work for you.
I'll make it clear - the engine project will not put itself in any risk for the sake of any one game, BA or otherwise.
Therefore you can either:
1) Port the game you want to play to a recent engine.
2) Hire someone else to do it.
3) Maintain your own infrastructure.
4) Play smaller games.
5) Play something else.

As a side remark, this whole argument is getting quite tiresome and the way you pursue it doesn't contribute towards your goal or anyone else's.
Last edited by hokomoko on 21 Apr 2019, 00:04, edited 1 time in total.
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PicassoCT
Journeywar Developer & Mapper
Posts: 10239
Joined: 24 Jan 2006, 21:12

Re: RIP BA

Post by PicassoCT » 20 Apr 2019, 21:05

Never before have i been insulated lik this. To demand - i work for my game, such insolence.
I would call my lawyer if it where not for favours i still own him.
This is very unprofessional, the open free source is about beeing free lunch, not us doing free work for you.
You ruined it.
You really did.

If i had something to throw at you, i would.
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