Absolute Annihilation: Spring[old]

Decimator · Post by **Decimator** » 07 Jan 2006, 00:08

Level one bombers seem overpowered. They're fast, and two of them can kill a factory in one run. They are strong enough to fly around over defenders and kill them off, and anti-swarm turrets barely dent them, while anti-bomber turrets are extremely expensive in the early game.

Felix the Cat · Post by **Felix the Cat** » 07 Jan 2006, 01:44

Got an error message when a commander exploded today in play, was being attacked by a bunch of brawlers and banshees:

"CobError: Unknown opcode! [or 1, I can't read my writing]
(in scripslcmgeo.cob: Killed at 15A)"

Did not affect gameplay one bit, the game went on fine, just thought I'd let you know in case it's something important.

Caydr · Post by **Caydr** » 07 Jan 2006, 02:30

hmm... cmgeo is core moho geothermal. Got nothing to do with a commander... is it possible you lost a moho geo at about the same time?

MR.D · Post by **MR.D** » 07 Jan 2006, 02:54

I dont remember LvL 1 bombers dropping so many bombs in OTA, maybe just me but I remember them having only 1-2 per attack.. always seemed to me that LVL2 were the strip bombers and lvl1 was fairly low yield.

Everything else seems to be running smoothly, nice work on 1.35 Caydr.

FizWizz · Post by **FizWizz** » 07 Jan 2006, 03:12

lvl 1 bombers dropped a line of bombs (6-8?) in OTA. Lvl 2 bombers just had a laser and some stronger bombs, that's all.

Caydr · Post by **Caydr** » 07 Jan 2006, 04:33

Correct. Up until now AA Spring has been the one with the bug on L1 bombers... in OTA, L1 bombers drop 6 bombs, L2 bombers drop 8 of higher yield.

Felix the Cat · Post by **Felix the Cat** » 07 Jan 2006, 04:58

Caydr wrote:hmm... cmgeo is core moho geothermal. Got nothing to do with a commander... is it possible you lost a moho geo at about the same time?

I think so - I was watching the commander get killed (not mine, an opponent's), and the rest of the attack force was attacking the base, which IIRC had a moho geo in it.

Forboding Angel · Post by **Forboding Angel** » 07 Jan 2006, 11:35

Damage with l1 bombers is borked

L1 bomber weapon does 100 dmg per bomb. 6 Bombs-600 dmg

L2 2 bombers only do 650 dmg per run.

Scale down l1 bomber damage to 300 per run and it should balance it out I think.

BadMan · Post by **BadMan** » 07 Jan 2006, 18:01

Don't tone it down too much. Bombers in ota were able to kill mexes, and mts easily. Just one drop and bam. Factories too were an easy target if you targetted them along their long edges. Going left to right on a vehicle plant at the top of it yielded most damage. For kbots, it was going up and down along the left or right sides. For air plants, along diag.

Bombers are too powerful cuz they can't take hits. Those anti swarm work great for me. They are great for any lv 1 unit, but they suck when it comes to lv 2. Sams and jeths also own lv 1 and 2 bombers if you keep them spread out and not bundled.

The lv 1 bomber has its usefulness back. Just be thankful you can't line bomb them like in ota or the damage caused would skyrocket.

NOTE: In ota, the core lv 1 bomber dropped more bombs than the lv 1 arm bomber. It was the bomber of choice.

Forboding Angel · Post by **Forboding Angel** » 07 Jan 2006, 21:31

ok time to use our brains.

If one bomber is doing 600 damage per run, lets take a swarm, say 15. 600*15=9000 dmg!!!!

Add in fighters and BOOM. dead com(arm com has about 4k health, core com has about 6k health) in just 1 pass for hardly any resources because you used level 1 bombers.

ok now 6000 / 600 = 10 meaning that if you want to kill a core com in one pass with level 1 bombers, you only need 10.

I'll stop here with the math. Any good player can pump out level 1 bombers like it's nothing.

THe level one bomber should do roughly 45 - 49% of the damage that a level 2 bomber does. THis just makes sense.

Aun · Post by **Aun** » 07 Jan 2006, 22:50

Forboding Angel wrote:ok time to use our brains.

If one bomber is doing 600 damage per run, lets take a swarm, say 15. 600*15=9000 dmg!!!!

Add in fighters and BOOM. dead com(arm com has about 4k health, core com has about 6k health) in just 1 pass for hardly any resources because you used level 1 bombers.

ok now 6000 / 600 = 10 meaning that if you want to kill a core com in one pass with level 1 bombers, you only need 10.

I'll stop here with the math. Any good player can pump out level 1 bombers like it's nothing.

THe level one bomber should do roughly 45 - 49% of the damage that a level 2 bomber does. THis just makes sense.

You're lucky if 2 bombs hit a comm, because its such a small target, so 15 probably won't kill one. I've failed with 12.

smokeynseinor · Post by **smokeynseinor** » 07 Jan 2006, 23:36

Just move the Com out the way, its not complicated.

CrowJuice · Post by **CrowJuice** » 07 Jan 2006, 23:42

Bladwings are a pain in the ass to use. They hardly shot when on patrol. If I tell them to attack a unit they will just hover over the enemy unless if I tell them to attack AGAIN. Even then they take 2-3 sec before they start fireing.

Anyway to fix this?

Also the flying fortress should instead be called "Very heavy gunship". A flying fortress should REALLY be a flying fortress

Maybe a hovering fortress with a sumo speed? A krogoth of the skies?

hawkki · Post by **hawkki** » 08 Jan 2006, 00:16

give the commander a heavy laser. Those level one hammers kill one commander too easily by running away and shoothin.

Also besides that the commander should be a big, powerfull and fearsome thing like it was ages ago in original ta. Now it's more like somethin you really gotta hide if you want to keep it alive.

Give it a heavylasertower wpn and range, this will give some of it's old "commander" feel back!

Min3mat · Post by **Min3mat** » 08 Jan 2006, 00:21

a flying fortress IMO should be a guardian on the bottom, HLT on top with 6+ LLTs (weak too planes and long range AA)

Mecha Sonic · Post by **Mecha Sonic** » 08 Jan 2006, 00:24

Yes, but then the Comm would be too easy to defend. Maybe a better choice would be to make the Comm laser have a longer range than a Hammer?

CrowJuice · Post by **CrowJuice** » 08 Jan 2006, 00:32

No no! It should have one mini-bertha(or a long range dd-laser), 2 punishers, 4 heavy lasers, 2 flaks and two repair pads! And it should be a castle ontop of a floting landmass! Now THAT is a flying fortress hehe! Not sure about the balance BUT it would look 200% cool

Forboding Angel · Post by **Forboding Angel** » 08 Jan 2006, 05:24

some of you ppl do not read correctly or are incapable of comprehension. READ FTFW!

My post was not about KILLING Fing comms! My post was about THE FACT THAT L1 BOMBERS DO 600 DMG IN ONE PASS AND FING L2 BOMBERS DO 650 IN ONE PASS! GOT IT?!?

good god, trying to get a point across to some of you is like walking on needles.

Yet instead of addressing the problem of l1 bombers doing too much damage, some of you guys decide that in addition to the dgun the comm should get an hlt or anni laser (like that would be balanced).

Just read and save our collective sanity.

MR.D · Post by **MR.D** » 08 Jan 2006, 06:28

LOL?

SEriously though, LVL1 bombers are pretty freaking nasty... I didn't even find using LVL2 bombers as an option the last game I played. there wasn't a point since they do nearly as much as LVL2, and cost half as much not to mention in relation to the cost of the LVL2 aircraft plant alone..

Beefing up the other bombers to compensate for the LVL1 boost is not an answer either, what then would be the point of having the super heavy carpet bomber? or the LICHE?

LVL1 bombers now are basically LVL2 bombers with a discount, which is not fair in relation to other LVL1 powers, or vs the costs of the LVL2 bombers.

LVL 1 bombers deserve some kind of nerf for the sake of balence.

jellyman · Post by **jellyman** » 08 Jan 2006, 06:55

Or should level 2 bombers be improved to do more damage?

Spring RTS Engine

Absolute Annihilation: Spring[old]