Balanced Annihilation Reloaded

Balanced Annihilation Reloaded

Balanced Annihilation with remade Units

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Regret
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Balanced Annihilation Reloaded

Post by Regret » 21 Feb 2010, 02:09

[self deleted post]
Last edited by Regret on 05 Aug 2011, 02:42, edited 10 times in total.
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Google_Frog
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Re: Balanced Annihilation Reloaded

Post by Google_Frog » 21 Feb 2010, 02:22

You've forgotten sounds. It's a largely overlooked part of IP freeness.

From my work with CA sounds I can conclude that real pros made TA's sounds and it will take a lot of work to do anything near as good. I have managed to replace most of the unit replies and a few weapons. Feel free to take them so that I can feel free to take anything you do and so that anything you do is not the same as things I have done so that taking them will not be useful. (TLDR: I have replaced some sounds, it is hard, do not duplicate so I can take yours)

That is if this BA IP free push is any different from the last dozen failed attempts.
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Pxtl
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Re: Balanced Annihilation Reloaded

Post by Pxtl » 21 Feb 2010, 02:32

All the sounds in Ur Quan Masters are professional sounds released under the CC:Noncom Sharealike license. Many of them are pretty distinctive (for example, the He-man-esque Ur-Quan fusion cannon) but some are solid explosions and bangs.

@Frog - however, this free-IP BA has one advantage: CA. CA's is still close-enough to BA unitset to replace over half the Arm and Core mobile units and defenses. You'd probably have to do some resizing to account for the fact that CA's Logos units tend to dwarf the Nova units in both size and power, but otherwise - yeah, a Jack's a Can, a Ray is an LLT, etc.
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Mav
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Re: Balanced Annihilation Reloaded

Post by Mav » 21 Feb 2010, 03:47

Pxtl wrote:@Frog - however, this free-IP BA has one advantage: CA. CA's is still close-enough to BA unitset to replace over half the Arm and Core mobile units and defenses.
I'm not trying to start another BA/CA flame thread, but I actually strongly dislike a lot of CA's units. They're a little too round for me, and look sort of amorphous. I like BA's units because they are easier to recognize at distance, at least for me. I think the worst offender is (I think) Slasher, which just looks flat out weird to me. I like the harder edges of BA a lot more.

I also know that CA was attempting a little more playful theme, and the CA devs definitely pulled that off. It's nice having a "serious" mod and a "playful" mod. That being said, using CA's units in BA will reduce the distinction between the two.

Remember Halo's human vehicles? That's how I'd like to see BA's units look. Cool, high-poly, but still very sharp-edged and angular. They look like WAR MACHINES OF DEATH, not Italian sports cars.

It's a matter of preference,

Image
Image

P.S. That Scorpion tank looks sick. In my imagination it's a Penetrator replacement.
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Saktoth
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Re: Balanced Annihilation Reloaded

Post by Saktoth » 21 Feb 2010, 03:51

If you want to be IP free with the -whole- of BA, then you cant afford to be picky.

I'd suggest just replicating the important units and gameplay of cometcatcher with one faction and a couple of factories. You could make that fairly easily given the current unit set, and its what BA's balanced for.
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Regret
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Re: Balanced Annihilation Reloaded

Post by Regret » 21 Feb 2010, 19:24

So after some thinking about the feasibility of this project:

There are currently 367 units used in BA. From some looking around I think there are at most 50 units already remodeled / completed. So around 317 units would need to be remodeled / textured / scripted.

For each unit there is a wreck, except for air (42 units) and some miscellaneous units like mines etc. That's around 315 wrecks.

>_>

I think it would be good to cut BA into smaller parts that would be remade, starting with Arm T1 Vehicles (without amphi units).
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Tribulex
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Re: Balanced Annihilation Reloaded

Post by Tribulex » 21 Feb 2010, 19:48

oh dear regret. you realize this is how ca started out? Now look what became of that project... :/

Edit: This would be possible as far as models go if you can enslave Mr. D to do Core and Cremus to do Arm. (or Hardcore Fisting whatever you are going to call them.)


check on CA's flash tank (seems to stick to original concept).

Also for wrecks I suggest using the unit script to generate the wreck using the same model and using a "poopgenerator" shader to draw blood, oil, scars, and blackness all over the unit. Maybe i can provide you with an example if u pm me and ur actually serious about this project.
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Gota
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Re: Balanced Annihilation Reloaded

Post by Gota » 21 Feb 2010, 19:59

At the current rate of model making(if you only consider cremuss's and Mr.D's work as something you can use in BA it will take a decade(maybe more) to remake everything... Even if you'd have a model every 2 days you'd still need around 2 years(such a rate seems like an impossible dream)...
If BA really wants to be IP free in a reasonable time frame it will have to compromise a lot,just like CA did.
Butcher and cut models,Break them apart,reassemble or change proportions to create several units out of a single model etc..
Unless we could find some source of free,textured models...


I think the most reasonable thing to do is break a deal with the owners of TA IP ...
Is that really so unimaginable?Say if WE change all the names and not refer to TA at all..
Why would they not allow us to use 11 year old models and low quality sounds as long as we don't use or try and present the mod/game as a ta sequel.
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Tribulex
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Re: Balanced Annihilation Reloaded

Post by Tribulex » 21 Feb 2010, 20:08

Gota wrote:I think the most reasonable thing to do is break a deal with the owners of TA IP ...
Is that really so unimaginable?Say if WE change all the names and not refer to TA at all..
Why would they not allow us to use 11 year old models and low quality sounds as long as we don't use or try and present the mod/game as a ta sequel.
Do it. Its a race between you and Regret.
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Pxtl
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Re: Balanced Annihilation Reloaded

Post by Pxtl » 21 Feb 2010, 20:14

@Mav - don't let the better be the enemy of the good. You know what's different between a nice, warthog-esque SAMtruck and the CA Samsonoid?

One of them has been modeled, imported, scripted, and is already running in the Spring engine.
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Tribulex
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Re: Balanced Annihilation Reloaded

Post by Tribulex » 21 Feb 2010, 20:18

ca samsonoid has nothing to do with the samson, and everything to do with looking like crap.
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Mav
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Re: Balanced Annihilation Reloaded

Post by Mav » 21 Feb 2010, 20:38

Pxtl wrote:One of them has been modeled, imported, scripted, and is already running in the Spring engine.
You know what the difference between a Samson and a Samsonoid are? One of them looks like shiat. For it to be changed, it needs to be BETTER than the original. I'd take the Samson all day long.
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Pxtl
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Re: Balanced Annihilation Reloaded

Post by Pxtl » 21 Feb 2010, 20:57

Depends on your goal. If the goal is "look better than BA" then yes, the CA Samson is fail. If your goal is "IP free ASAP", then the CA samson is sitting there waiting for use. After all, it's not like you can't use the CA samson now and then replace it later.
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KaiserJ
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Re: Balanced Annihilation Reloaded

Post by KaiserJ » 21 Feb 2010, 22:25

you can remake all of BA using lego parts.

Image

posted this before; nobody seemed to care, but hey. i like the idea of ip-free BA.

Image

Image

a rookie modeller with a basic knowledge of how to delete faces and set object origins could crank out a model every 10 minutes.

reskin it once; you have a set for arm and a set for core.

i have another set in the works that would be better suited for buildings and will include all of the parts you see there.

and yes, i know its not the -best- way to do it. but in terms of having factions looking similar, and being able to make/play this mod sometime this century (which i assume is the bottom line, rather than making something visually stunning) i hope you'll at least consider this method.
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Tribulex
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Re: Balanced Annihilation Reloaded

Post by Tribulex » 21 Feb 2010, 22:28

actually that looks and sounds like a lot of fun :D. Automagically detailed too!

Could look like crap from a distance but meh, who cares eh? I usually play spring in fps mode anyway.
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Regret
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Re: Balanced Annihilation Reloaded

Post by Regret » 21 Feb 2010, 22:29

KaiserJ wrote:you can remake all of BA using lego parts.
Those models look awesome. What tools are needed for this and what is the output format of said tools. Details needed etc. :regret:

Also there's the question of whether it is 'ok' to use for non-commercial purposes.
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Master-Athmos
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Re: Balanced Annihilation Reloaded

Post by Master-Athmos » 21 Feb 2010, 22:35

What tools are needed for this and what is the output format of said tools. Details needed etc.
The same you need for every model. You just could use certain parts on multiple models you put together as you wish...
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Regret
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Re: Balanced Annihilation Reloaded

Post by Regret » 21 Feb 2010, 22:47

Master-Athmos wrote:The same you need for every model. You just could use certain parts on multiple models you put together as you wish...
Oh, I thought he meant using actual lego parts from some software lego designer thing.
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KaiserJ
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Re: Balanced Annihilation Reloaded

Post by KaiserJ » 21 Feb 2010, 23:49

ja; its just a 3ds file, all of the bits are mapped to the same texture.

you can assemble in max or wings or whatever you like. most of the sizes and angles are in whole numbers and normal angles... you won't see much deviation in terms of "this plane is 4.3323516 units long" or "i need to rotate X 29.692169 degrees for it to fit" so there wont be much dicking around like that.

also the origins should be set nicely for construction; if you break off a part of the model (first thumb) and reset the origin the the centre of the model, it should sit in a clear position (ie 20x, 20y)

sorry to dissapoint about the actual virtual legos :P i also would like to have them.
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Tribulex
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Re: Balanced Annihilation Reloaded

Post by Tribulex » 22 Feb 2010, 00:18

Lego Digital Designer:
Image

MLCAD:
Image

Any questions I over a years experience with the former and many years experience with the latter.

Yes, you can get these into model formats, but its not easy.
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