View topic - re: Citalopram


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 Post subject: Re: re: Citalopram
PostPosted: 08 May 2012, 18:06 
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alcohol is a depressant. You would need a stimulant.
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 Post subject: Re: re: Citalopram
PostPosted: 08 May 2012, 19:55 
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That classification doesn't really have anything to do with depression - you don't feel depressed when drinking, right?
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 Post subject: Re: re: Citalopram
PostPosted: 08 May 2012, 20:00 
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Depresant doesn't mean depressing... you could have googled that.
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 Post subject: Re: re: Citalopram
PostPosted: 08 May 2012, 22:30 
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well, that was kinda what my post was about
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 Post subject: Re: re: Citalopram
PostPosted: 08 May 2012, 22:32 
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Before anyone tries anything silly like comparing depression to cancer, realize that cancer is an actual disease that lolpwns your own immune system.

Depression isn't something tangible (eg, see it, smell it, fuck it -- Rule 34 on depression?) and is cause by any number of factors, not because of an invasion of your body by some foreign entity (unless you happen to be the foreign entity).
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 Post subject: Re: re: Citalopram
PostPosted: 08 May 2012, 22:33 
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Depression quite often has physical symptoms. Next?
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 Post subject: Re: re: Citalopram
PostPosted: 09 May 2012, 00:04 

Joined: 03 Jul 2011, 10:54
I am a future paramedic, and have been working in the psych ward in a hospital. I have nothing good to say about antidepressant medications in general, neither about Citalopram.

I think controlled and skillful use of benzos, especially Alprazolam (Xanax), to be some of the most effective "cures" for depression.

I say "cure" since no medicine cures the depression, they only offer ways by which one can start addressing the underlying problem that causes the depression.
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 Post subject: Re: re: Citalopram
PostPosted: 09 May 2012, 06:05 
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Depression can be caused by a chemical imbalance in your body.
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/03/120330081352.htm That's why => healthier food(animal fats are good, few carbohydrates) and sunlight for vitamin d production
http://www.patient.co.uk/health/Vitamin-D-Deficiency.htm
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 Post subject: Re: re: Citalopram
PostPosted: 09 May 2012, 06:07 
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varikonniemi wrote:
I am a future paramedic, and have been working in the psych ward in a hospital.
People in a psych ward are often on much larger doses than normally prescribed to someone like ivory.
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 Post subject: Re: re: Citalopram
PostPosted: 09 May 2012, 08:21 

Joined: 03 Jul 2011, 10:54
smoth wrote:
varikonniemi wrote:
I am a future paramedic, and have been working in the psych ward in a hospital.
People in a psych ward are often on much larger doses than normally prescribed to someone like ivory.

People like paramedics go through extensive training, all the way from your nursing homes to ER and surgery. I have seen quite a bit of different use cases for antidepressants, and citalopram, and would say maybe 20% of them were successful/indicated.

The rest go from moderate to worse to trainwreck as doses are stepped up and medicines switched/added.

Antidepressants are like reverse withdrawal. You flood your brain with completely different levels of serotonin/noradrenalin, and then your body tries to figure out the new balance. After this 2 week - 1 month period when "the meds have started taking effect" your 'withdrawal' is over and you can begin to feel relatively normal again, and your emotional capacity is usually back close to normal. BUT when you decide that you have been "cured" from your depression and want to go off the meds, your body will again start the withdrawal process as your natural balance is reached by tapering down on the dosage and you are left where you started.

There are valid theories and methods of completing an antidepressant course, but it almost requires inpatient setting with extensive rehabilitation during the treatment. It is based on the idea i explained in the last paragraph, and combining to that behavioral therapy. As beneficial neural pathways are encouraged (exercise, social contacts, daily routines, healthy food etc.) and depressive ones are kept back, the dosing/withdrawal process can leave you with a more healthy neural map.

The thing is you do not need to poison yourself to achieve this change. The same rehabilitation and behavioral therapy will do the same changes on their own.

This is why i prefer especially Alprazolam over antidepressants. It starts acting immediately, it lowers inhibitions and calms the patient down, so even traumatizing experiences can be accessed without the patients ego shutting it out. It also has an unique serotonin modulating activity that is not found in other benzos. The downside is the extreme misuse potential. And if the dose is increased anywhere near the FDA approved maximum, alprazolam addiction may become far worse a problem than your depression ever was.


Last edited by varikonniemi on 09 May 2012, 09:56, edited 3 times in total.
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 Post subject: Re: re: Citalopram
PostPosted: 09 May 2012, 09:24 
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FLOZi wrote:
Depression quite often has physical symptoms. Next?


Physical symptoms/Chemical Imbalances != Foreign invaders munching on your organs. Moreover, symptoms/chemical imbalances are usually caused by your brain doin' it rong (Whether or not you have any control over it is a different argument), amirite?
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 Post subject: Re: re: Citalopram
PostPosted: 09 May 2012, 09:36 
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Does it matter whats "physical" and whats "metal"? "Mental" is physical too, its determined by brain, its connections, its neurotransmitters..

All that matters is personal experience of the person suffering. Pain can be very real even if you dont see its reason.

Don't discount personal experience. It's all that matters.
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 Post subject: Re: re: Citalopram
PostPosted: 09 May 2012, 09:45 
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Physical symptoms/Chemical Imbalances != Foreign invaders munching on your organs.

Cancer is not a foreign invader. It's your own cells doing it 'rong, quite often without any need for any external carcinogenic agent. Just internal chemical imbalances causing failure of apoptosis and consequent biochemical clusterfuck.

Also, filing off depression as "purely mental" based on it a) not requiring foreign agent b) being constrained to neural cells, also provides basis for filing off sclerosis, alzheimer's, parkinson's, etc, as "walk it off" diceases that don't warrant medication.

(and i tend to agree with those: on vain assumption that working your brain enough will, at the very least, stall these for a decade or so, which is more than medication can do. If there is no Big Brother to control your mind, then it's your responsibility)

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realize that cancer is an actual disease that lolpwns your own immune system.

Here you are mixing up cancer with aids, i believe. Cancer doesn't cause immune system to fail; indeed, it's quite as good as caused by failure of immune system to exterminate (your own) deviant cells on time.
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 Post subject: Re: re: Citalopram
PostPosted: 09 May 2012, 11:39 

Joined: 16 Apr 2012, 09:48
Your brain affects your mental state, controls bodily functions and can harm your body. Of course that means depression, or just feelings in general are chemical imbalances. Just as you can become happy or sad from certain actions, other actions can make you manic or depressed. Those actions can be either your thoughts, events that disrupt you in some way, etc.

Point being: depression is not some special snowflake disease caused by evil forces. It's just you, your attitude and inability to cease control of your own body, weak will and delusions.

You can keep rationalizing it as a disease, comparing it to cancer or broken legs or whatnot if it helps you, just don't expect others to delude themselves similarly.

It's like being bad at math, just you're bad at emotion.

There I said it, go hit that report button because you don't like my opinions.
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 Post subject: Re: re: Citalopram
PostPosted: 09 May 2012, 12:53 

Joined: 03 Jul 2011, 10:54
You have no clue what you are talking about or tried to be provocative on purpose. Now let me try:

To be healthy and well adjusted to a sick society means you must be insane. And oh boy let me tell you our western society is breaking apart... So does it give you hope that our depression rates and psychological problems are skyrocketing in the west?

To me it is an indication of inflammation. The organism has identified the illness, and is reacting.
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 Post subject: Re: re: Citalopram
PostPosted: 09 May 2012, 13:27 
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Cancer cells are your immune system attacking your own body, lolpwns your immune system. I.e. Tricks it into killing itself.

That's like saying HPV isn't a foreign invader because it binds with your DNA.

But cells turning from the light side of the force to the dark side is quite different than your brain deciding that your mantits aren't large enough and deciding that you need more estrogen (I'm half kidding :-).
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 Post subject: Re: re: Citalopram
PostPosted: 09 May 2012, 14:11 
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I always was a strong supporter of lobotomy. Dont laugh, its neuro sience.. not new neuro-sience, but neuro-sience. Cant deny that.











(Srsly, the good advice has ended a while ago)
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 Post subject: Re: re: Citalopram
PostPosted: 09 May 2012, 14:52 
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Forboding Angel wrote:
Cancer

You keep using that word, but I don't think it means what you think it means. Cancer is unrestrained cell growth. You're talking about auto immune diseases.
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 Post subject: Re: re: Citalopram
PostPosted: 09 May 2012, 15:02 
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Azhukar wrote:
Your brain affects your mental state, controls bodily functions and can harm your body. Of course that means depression, or just feelings in general are chemical imbalances. Just as you can become happy or sad from certain actions, other actions can make you manic or depressed. Those actions can be either your thoughts, events that disrupt you in some way, etc.

Point being: depression is not some special snowflake disease caused by evil forces. It's just you, your attitude and inability to cease control of your own body, weak will and delusions.

You can keep rationalizing it as a disease, comparing it to cancer or broken legs or whatnot if it helps you, just don't expect others to delude themselves similarly.

It's like being bad at math, just you're bad at emotion.

There I said it, go hit that report button because you don't like my opinions.

ignorant privileged troll presumes to lecture without experience, expertise or evidence

expects to be taken seriously


Last edited by KingRaptor on 09 May 2012, 15:26, edited 1 time in total.
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 Post subject: Re: re: Citalopram
PostPosted: 09 May 2012, 15:11 
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Das Bruce wrote:
auto immune diseases.

it's never lupus silly
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