Spring RTS Engine

I'm re-packing everything, making a big zip, with a test map that works, naming conventions, a readme.. and all the textures working, good lighting, colors.. etc...

I'll update this when I get done...

I do have some questions however... (at bottom)

expect a very EASY to use way of putting them in maps, VERY easially, and VERY readially...

but as usual

you can CUSTOMIZE THEM TO YOUR HEARTS EXTENT! I don't care....

I just reccomend not to stray TOOOO far on sizes... cause of two reasons..

1- if enlarged the textures will either blur like crazy, or if shrunk and spammed, cause low FPS.. (if you shrink the models for whatever reason, I would scale the textures to match it won't hurt the mapping... and it'll help the FPS issue if spammed.. also... if spammed, reducing the tex size will help FPS, and again, it won't hurt the mapping orientation, only quality)

2- model "geometry" will look poor if made too large, and crazy scaling of the geometry require footprint and height changes on upspring, and in the TDF file... (if you don't mind the model looking "clunky" with a low-res texture... SURE! go for a 10x scale... and have cactuses ~10,000 feet tall and what not...



but yeah.... on to my questions:

1- the TDF file...
what are ALL! the possible lines to add?

I.E.

metal=
energy=
damage=

etc....

and what the heck do they all mean? (most are self-explaniatory.... but I'd hate to take something for granted and be wrong)

2- you think I should both with compiling all this crap into more than 1 zip?? I mean... urgh... its just MORE work... and I'd rather have a starting zip, and ~5 meg "updates" that just "add" to it... (I've actually got intentions to add EVERY FEATURE, not even mine to this archive... just so its organized 100% uniform.. making things easier...) **YES YES! I will credit the authors on ALL of their work.

3- If ANYONE!!! has anything to add... lets get it going.. start dumping into unknown-files.net and linking your stuff... I'll do what I can as fast as I can to get it all "united"....

but yeah... any other suggestions, comments, etc you guys give me... I'll take...

and FYI, right now, I have 52 different features on the list of "completed" (only my stuff) and 36 more "in progress"

we're gona need more than 255 different shades of red to do this...

coders?

maybe I'll make "Pack A" with updates 1, 2, 3, 4, (until I get to 255 features...) then make "Pack B" etc....

anyways... back to line by line text editing, and photochoppin... I'll get done eventually

urgh... damn map converter is driving me nuts...

its not finding "any" of my features....



unless you wanna step-by-step me thorugh it

wish me luck.. lol

btw, YES I followed forbodings tutorial

the files are IN the proper directories, and IN the fs.txt file....

when spring launches the test map... it gives me a buncha "Unknown Feature XXX" errors.. its buggin me...

tdf files are fuxxored?

was my directory structure in the .sd7

I figured it out... tweaking some of the textures now...

then gonna piddle with the tdf's a lil bit more to determine the "damage" values....

I assume thats the amount of damage the thing can take before it dies???




but yeah.. the models are V E R Y pretty

edit: expect EVERYTHING I have posted as "done" + the tyranid stuff by this evening... 100% working perfectly..

NO MORE EXCUSES!

its up !!

(23.2 MB tho.... )

screens of the "showcase" map that I've started... will add the "other" files soon..



http://www.unknown-files.net/browse.php?dlid=1557

read the readme, and use em!

Argh! dangit.. I messed one of em up... I missed flipping Cactus7.tga vertically...

its just ONE !! texture.. you guys can figure that out I hope....

but yeah, I'll fix it on the next update..

urgh... the damn snow trees didn't line up on the map right...

PNG is for graphics NOT things like photo's or screenshots!

Otherwise, nice work.

Das Bruce wrote:PNG is for graphics NOT things like photo's or screenshots!

Otherwise, nice work.

meh, I've just gotten used to PNG's....

LathanStanley wrote:

Das Bruce wrote:PNG is for graphics NOT things like photo's or screenshots!

Otherwise, nice work.

meh, I've just gotten used to PNG's....

Well get unused to them.

I'm taking all this down. Spring's community has proven that it does not deserve my help.

Argh wrote:... and use DDS for your textures, not TGA. I'll take a look at doing a really quick conversion... I suspect I can get that filesize down in a jiffy to something reasonable... that will also work better with the game engine!

from what I understand TGA is a better quality anyways?? am I not correct? and the size comparison is less than 10%...

I'm taking all this down. Spring's community has proven that it does not deserve my help.

oh I understand argh... but the rate videocards are growing in MB in ram etc..

to pattern clone textures, unless you are hoping for crazy, utterly.. C R A Z Y amounts of objects on the playing field... a 1024 or 8 isn't gonna slow you down.

1- if you REALLY believe that the .dds are gonna be a better deal, when you have the time, since you've converted everything allready... (that was like a 2 second convesion with a DDS converter..) and do yourself and me a favor, and prove to me with screenshots of identical images that the framerate does SIGNIFICANTLY improve with DDS files...

2- I enjoy making detailed models as pieces of art... thus the edges of EACH polygon wether crossing across different parts of the same UV map, or just bending around the geometery... they are continiously painted "correct"... a tiling, or something of the like, (if used on something organic like a LEAF, or a building wall with corners and edges, that are set edges without textures wraping around them) its going to cause issues... (Think of wrapping a christmas present in wrapping paper... when you hit a corner, 1 of the edges, WILL not match the pattern, and it WILL cause it to look "off"... now... since thats a square object, and most square objects won't cause issues... (think of most buildings...) but now... take those tyranid towers, or the large shoreline rocks... the irregular geometry will generate SERIOUS stretching, overlapping, or breaks in the mapping... the only way around it, to make it CORRECT is to use a larger map, and hand draw every pixel, one at a time, to match where the joints of the UVW meet. If you are willing to try to do them differently, go for it....

I WILL, don't get me wrong, I'm not denying your advice.. I KNOW I need to use those "workarounds" more often... to stack UVW's on the same space on the texturemap... and I will use that ability at the opportunity when it presents itself... as of now, for the most part... (the tiberium, I'm sure I coulda spammed the crystals with a tighter texture... but meh, I was lazy) there hasn't been much of the chance to do that kind of work...

when I get into the more "structured" models, buildings and the like... you can do that more effectively...

I've worked very hard to get this done, its free material... if you want it in the map, use it... if you don't then don't.. but again... its not my fault to have to tone and twist the artwork I enjoy making into something that can run on a 32 or 64 mb videocard and reduce its quality to that of Quake2...

please understand why I am defending my work, and my judgement of why I took the approach of painting the features in the way I did.

Try not to be frustrated with me, but rather, just aid/help/encourage to get better.

Resizing my textures down to 512x512's WILL reduce their filesize by 4x... YES!! but it reduces the image quality TERRIBLY..

I spent a GREAT DEAL OF TIME to get those models to the quality they are at...

if all you want to do is BUTCHER my work, and then post it as "better" you can blow me... I don't care how tired and cranky you are.

Mose modders will understand things like that ARE NOT TO BE SPAMMED all over the map..



I've got nothing "good" to say about your modification to my features.. you've only deteroriated their quality.. 4+ fold.

I've got a 5.0 GHz machine with 2 gigs of 800MHz DDR2 ram (with fast timings), and a 512 mb Videocard... I can handle running the game with the level of textures I've produced.. and I'd assume most people will be able to catch up, or run along side me without too much effort.

if this game is gonna last much longer than a year more... than these features with the texture size they have, are FINE. I'm planning ahead.

Do me a favor, and don't try to encourage people to build "poor" maps with such textures...

what we CAN do, on a nicer note... is package the features WITH Spring... input a "rotation" ability into the code, and then offer a "high quality, medium quality, low quality" versions of the textures... (1024+, 512, 256) .... and make it a seperate download from the game itself...

so thus:
1- download spring
2- download features
3- download the texture pack for them

play.

if you have an old card, get the low quality, if you have a high end card, get the high quality... using a different texturemap from what someone else uses, will NOT count as cheating, or cause a net-split, crash, or de-sync... it'll just reduce your framerate if you can't handle it....



I'm tired too... and I've put 22 hours of labor into that release in the last 2 days to crank it out...

and frankly I'm proud of it... if you want to release a "lower quality" version... then label it as such. don't take my well crafted work, scale it down, ruin its quality, and post it as "optimized"..

thats the END of that.

Wow argh, that was really rude. Extremely rude in fact.

I mean heck.. don't take me as attacking you, just consider what you did to an artists work... you made a mockery of it.

now... you are a V E R Y highly respected member of this community, and know a VERY large amout about the spring engine and its capabilities....

to tell me I'm pushing its limits would have worked... and you could have told me that a YEAR AGO! when I started...

urgh.. I take your suggestions to heart, I like you in this community, and I VALUE your opinion... but this... its almost hurtful...

aigh... I dunno... I've got plans to release a masterpiece of a map, and its in the works...


edit: its not "I" releasing the map... but "we".... and I can't take all the credit... but you will all see
when I pump it out, if the game runs like shit on it.. I'll scrap the detail for playability...

but for now... just let my have my parade and quit raining on it...

Argh wrote:The cacti are the best models in here, despite what the drooling masses will say.

sorry for the triple post....

but I just had to make a statement on that comment.

those textures and models are the "best" from a programmers point of view, because they are the simplest, smallest, and most efficient under code.

but I am not a programmer, I am an artist.

I prefer QUALITY over quantity.

I rank em pretty low...

I hope you can see why I disagree with you so strongly...

I'm taking all this down. Spring's community has proven that it does not deserve my help.

Argh wrote:<shrugs>

I will just edit out the work I did and take down the links. Why do I bother helping people around here...

No, on second thought... I will let people download them, and compare for themselves what the FPS looks like with each version. When they see that you will understand why I bothered. We don't all have uber computers here, and this "but we will soon" stuff is simply not true, whether or not we like that cold, hard fact. Many players will find that your features, as designed, make maps using them ... unplayable. Period.

I want detail, period. You are perfectly entitled to your opinion, but it doesn't make you right or wrong, it's simply your opinion.

Argh wrote: They just aren't perfect yet, k?

And you're blocky-lego commander unit is?

You are in no place to criticize people's work.

Who are you to come in here and tell people how things should be done? What are you trying to do? Sure, you've done a lot of work, but are you trying to make the work you've done mean more than the hours that other's have done? How about the developers, I suppose without you, there's no reason to have an engine?

When does the grumpy ego trip end? Because let me tell you, it's a cold landing regardless of reaction to this post.

Lathan did a PHENOMONAL job on the features. I applaud his work and effort and the fact he posted all his work for all to use. And what do you do? Tell him it's not good enough and that you can do better. Not only this, but you go and DO IT, posting what you did. Pathetic.

Argh wrote:<shrugs>

I will just edit out the work I did and take down the links. Why do I bother helping people around here...

No, on second thought... I will let people download them, and compare for themselves what the FPS looks like with each version. When they see that you will understand why I bothered. We don't all have uber computers here, and this "but we will soon" stuff is simply not true, whether or not we like that cold, hard fact. Many players will find that your features, as designed, make maps using them ... unplayable. Period.

WORK!!??!?? you did work???

I can convert EVERY FILE IN THE SAME DIRECTORY TOO TO A SMALLER DDS WITH 1 MOUSE CLICK!..

GUI program:
http://eliteforce2.filefront.com/file/D ... rter;29412

or simple code with a batch:
http://www.flipcode.com/cgi-bin/fcartic ... show=64014

OR ANY OF THESE!
http://www.dsabstraction.com/dds_converter.htm
http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads10/dd ... er_v21.zip
http://planetcivilization.gamespy.com/V ... tail&id=11
http://www.crymod.com/index.php?showfil ... 1&categ=39
http://www.twcenter.net/downloads/db/?mod=362
http://www.fileplanet.com/118945/110000 ... -Converter
http://cs.elderscrolls.com/constwiki/in ... /DDS_Tools

Need I go on???

dammit Argh.. get off my project.. step back.. go play nano-blobs...



you have allready upset me... do you REALLY need to PISS ME OFF?