Gundam annihilation

smoth · Post by **smoth** » 25 Jun 2006, 00:35

I have come to the conclusion that many people in the community dispise my mod. So I wonder why?

This is just a general poll to get an idea on why people do not play gundam. I will take it seriously so do reply in earnest. If you do not see your a relevent option please select other and let me know.

Foxomaniac · Post by **Foxomaniac** » 25 Jun 2006, 00:36

No one ever plays it.

I also never seen any GUNDAM anime or such, I don't have a single clue what each unit is supposed to do what, aside from basic things such as *this is bomber, this is fighter, this is etc*

.

Masse · Post by **Masse** » 25 Jun 2006, 00:40

i havent seen any gundam eighter so... and i like more games with serious bad ass "adult" looks on it

Kixxe · Post by **Kixxe** » 25 Jun 2006, 00:44

I really haven't had the time nor the energy to try it... first i gotta download it and learn everything offcourse, then i will have to FIND acual players to play agsint(I reamber when i tried to score a game with KuroTA and UH >.<).

It's an evil circle. Since no one plays it, so there's no one to play agsint, and without anyone to play it with, you stop playing it. Thefore, no one plays it...

Maybe you need to relase the next bug fixed version with alot of "Fireworks and flags"? Try to get as many pepole aware of your mod and then release the new improved version which everyone will love to test and then you will have a couple of players that will try the mod, and some players that will stay. Then the fanbase can grow from there...

Aun · Post by **Aun** » 25 Jun 2006, 00:48

Kixxe wrote:Maybe you need to relase the next bug fixed version with alot of "Fireworks and flags"? Try to get as many pepole aware of your mod and then release the new improved version which everyone will love to test and then you will have a couple of players that will try the mod, and some players that will stay. Then the fanbase can grow from there...

It looks damn good already.

DON'T STOP MAKING IT!

Kixxe · Post by **Kixxe** » 25 Jun 2006, 01:37

Aun wrote:It looks damn good already.

DON'T STOP MAKING IT!

The bugfixes are besides the point. The point is to have an event where lotsa players will be aware and try Gundam AT THE SAME TIME. If he shows off how awesome it is with some glamour shots, has some "advertising" (like pepole who like the mod who promote it at the day of relase of this new vers) and some cool features that describe the mod, gameplay wise, he's gonna get a couple of players to try it, like it and as i said "the fanbase will grow from there".

Pxtl · Post by **Pxtl** » 25 Jun 2006, 02:31

Masse wrote:i havent seen any gundam eighter so... and i like more games with serious bad ass "adult" looks on it

I've always hated this attitude. What's more adult? Computer chess, or computer strip-poker? I've always thought that Chu Chu Rocket was far more "adult" and sophisticated than Mortal Kombat. The most adult thing is to focus on the gameplay and fun of a game, rather than how much blood, realistic guns, and tits are in it.

Zoombie · Post by **Zoombie** » 25 Jun 2006, 03:39

Err...this mod is great. No, really. I despise Gundam, but I thought "hey...robots...guns...Spring...explosions. How bad could it be?". The first time I put a sniper on a transport and flew it over the enemy base and it started sniping the enemy...while ON THE transport!

How cool is that? It still sends me into hystarics. Also this mod has a lode of realy neat touch's. Like the level 4 factory's box's. The box's actually move off the trucks parked next to the factory and INTO the factory! Another cool thing is the groundplates. The metal makers have car parks next to them! Cool, huh?

Also its pretty adult looking. Well...not really. But it does have a really really cool cell shaded look, with neatness abound. Also the game itself plays very well, with many quick battles and slug matches and neat things like that. Also the coms are very cool, because they are freaken BATTLE SHIPS! They arn't just powerful units with a single big guns. They are BATTLESHIPS! BAAAAAATLESHIPS! They have huge guns, lasers, artillery cannons. Even jamming.

I mean, whats NOT to like about this. My single problem is the Federation Lvl 1 building unit is disgustingly chirpy and happy. Grrr...makes me want to strangle the bastard.

Arco · Post by **Arco** » 25 Jun 2006, 03:53

Regardless of its playability (I'm in the "I just don't know how to play it" group), I think the idea itself is cool and worth pursuing. Even though I am a Gundam fan, I've just had little opportunity to learn how to play it properly, and generally it's not what I want to play with when I load up Spring to waste an hour or two. But still, it's fantastic as a demonstration: "see, you can even do this with Spring." There aren't that many "let's try to do this in Spring" ideas floating around--there's Gundam, realism, and for some reason everyone wants to do Battletech.

Personally I think there could be plenty of other ideas worth pursuing--something based on the Metroid universe for instance, that franchise never gets done. Anything more organic--think of SimAnt in Spring. But since these ideas just aren't being done, Gundam stands as the real "look how far away from TA we can get" example.

I think you're taking things too personally--no one (well, no one worth listening to anyhow) hates your mod. It just isn't what people play. That doesn't mean they don't like it, or don't like the idea, it just means they feel like playing something else. Maybe you need some nice "learn how to play Gundam" guides with cool replays to demonstrate how awesome it can get. Honestly your mod suffers from a lack of marketing more than anything else--you're a respected contributor to the community and there's nothing wrong with the mod itself.

Just keep making it awesome and you're bound to ensnare more players, especially as Spring's abilities increase and you can exploit more of it. (Also take into account that Spring's development is based around making TA-style mods cooler--it's not really based around making Gundam cooler. So don't worry that the TA-style mods are more popular.)

esteroth12 · Post by **esteroth12** » 25 Jun 2006, 05:19

Arco wrote:....Maybe you need some nice "learn how to play Gundam" guides with cool replays to demonstrate how awesome it can get....

there is a guide

Dragon45 · Post by **Dragon45** » 25 Jun 2006, 06:44

Well, I would have to learn new build tree, new playstyle little, etc.

And I love Gundam, but topo much work when I could just play AA! :D

Neddie · Post by **Neddie** » 25 Jun 2006, 06:57

I like your mod, I just don't get many chances to play it. I would love to play a big 4v4 with Gundam, I really would. It is a worthy mod, with numerous good aspects.

Felix the Cat · Post by **Felix the Cat** » 25 Jun 2006, 07:14

I haven't downloaded it and am not likely to do so, simply because it is anime and I hate anime with a passion.

So nothing against you or your modding skills... I just don't like anime.

Zoombie · Post by **Zoombie** » 25 Jun 2006, 07:45

That is a horrible and abomnibal attitude. Try everything.

Felix the Cat · Post by **Felix the Cat** » 25 Jun 2006, 08:41

Zoombie wrote:That is a horrible and abomnibal attitude. Try everything.

I've watched anime before.

It has zero redeeming value whatsoever. I feel like I get stupider just by watching it.

Arco · Post by **Arco** » 25 Jun 2006, 08:56

esteroth12 wrote:there is a guide

If you call a short Wiki outlining the general content of a mod without actually specifying what a given unit does to be a "guide", well, sure. But compare that to AA's unit guide, which details the capabilities of every unit and how to best employ them.

In Gundam there are, what, three or four variations on the Gundam frame that arm them with long-range weapons? What's the advantage of a given one? It's not at all obvious. This is the gameplay/accuracy divide: Gundam is about a (semi-)realistic futuristic war encompassing earth and nearby space. The factions were not "balanced". Units were developed on a basis of cost, logistics, and increasing technology, as well as the developing skills of the pilots. It encompasses a history similar to the arms race of WWII--something that simply doesn't reflect gameplay sensibilities of unit balance. Take modern combat as another analogue--in what way is the US "balanced" against other countries? It's not! It has an economy and technological capability that allows it to design and build F-22s and B-2s, which have no reasonable competition in the world. While Gundam allows for considerable advances on both sides, it still doesn't have the simplicity of TA's system.

In TA you have unit descriptions like "medium tank", "bomber", and so on. You know exactly what the roles for those are. If instead you were presented with "Arm TX-4772 'Tanklord' Mk. 1" and "Arm TX-4772-6 'Tanklord' Custom Build Mk. 3b" you'd have no idea what to do. Do they even have different roles? Maybe! But it's not obvious to the player. AA's approach is to take this idea even further and reduce the multirole nature of many units so that they fill a particular role more solidly--the player knows exactly what to build to accomplish a given goal.

If the Gundam mod wishes to stay true to its roots (a perfectly fine attitude) then it will necessarily be a bit less clear from a gameplay perspective. If it goes for ease of gameplay, it must necessarily stray from the source material a bit more.

Now, I'm not saying that units in Gundam don't have specific roles to fill, or that the gameplay is in any way not full of intricate strategy, just that it's less obvious that this is so to the player. It's the interface between the strategy inherent in the content and a player who is not entirely informed about the intent of each unit that presents a problem here. And I believe its lack of popularity is largely explained by that--as opposed to an actual weakness of the mod content.

You might as well ask why Linux hasn't taken over the computing world--it has a lot to offer, but most people just can't be bothered to figure out how to make it worthwhile. I think that's the last awkward analogy I'll make in this post.

Edit: and please, no one jump on Felix's flamebait. You really don't need to acknowledge posts like that.

smoth · Post by **smoth** » 25 Jun 2006, 09:17

*cough* while outdated a bit.. look at the WEBPAGE FOR THE MOD. the little www below

Arco · Post by **Arco** » 25 Jun 2006, 09:35

smoth wrote:*cough* while outdated a bit.. look at the WEBPAGE FOR THE MOD. the little www below

That's certainly better, but still doesn't make some things clear. Like, are beam weapons preferable? Why? The units with them certainly seem to be more expensive in general. Why build them instead of the other long-range ones? Are they more efficient on a DPS/cost basis? If so, why bother building the others? Are they better against multiple weak targets? I have no idea. You mention which units have them, and what you might use those units for, but I have no idea what makes them effective in that role.

On the other hand, I know that Beamers in AA don't hit as hard as Sentinels but can dispatch weak swarms more quickly since their fire has finer granularity. This is the kind of strategic simplicity I'm talking about.

Edit: I really didn't intend this as a critique of the specifics of the mod or anything, I'm just trying to demonstrate what I think is the basis of the issue you're having.

Oh yeah, also, the units generally look very similar to each other. This is just how it is in Gundam; it's an artifact of building new designs on common frames to save development costs. Things like that just don't mean anything in Spring, and just make it harder for people to tell what's going on. I just think this is what you have to deal with if you're aiming to make a faithful Gundam mod--suffer a bit in terms of player-game interface.

rattle · Post by **rattle** » 25 Jun 2006, 10:14

I like the mod!

Haven't seen the anime either but played several games (some SD, some normal gundam) and I'm pretty happy this didn't turn out to be some more super deformed bullshit :)

The only other games I played were on the SNES and GBA. This is one of the first Gundam RTS iirc. There's a pretty OK mod for Zero Hour too, with erm much better animations but that's a different story (OK because you were able to annihilate the entire map with the Whitebase mega-particle cannon in one go).

Masse · Post by **Masse** » 25 Jun 2006, 11:11

Pxtl wrote:
Masse wrote:i havent seen any gundam eighter so... and i like more games with serious bad ass "adult" looks on it
I've always hated this attitude. What's more adult? Computer chess, or computer strip-poker? I've always thought that Chu Chu Rocket was far more "adult" and sophisticated than Mortal Kombat. The most adult thing is to focus on the gameplay and fun of a game, rather than how much blood, realistic guns, and tits are in it.

i didnt meant adult like that

i want dark and sinister looks... like lets say... starcraft or diablo umm... dawn of war is just perfect in style...
maybe i do like BLOOD ^^

[edit] weird again i remember how much blood i like...

Spring RTS Engine

Gundam annihilation

Gundam is not my cup of tea because:

Gundam annihilation