Spring RTS Engine

I'm working on new shots graphics for the CPU:

zwzsg is awesome. this is a scientifically proved fact.

Is anyone planning on making a graphical upgrade to the Hacker side? They feel a bit unfinished compared to the System's polished look, but it's only a visual complaint. The Trojan, the DoS, and the Bug all look like they're untextured.

I will give the trojan some sfx arcing between their nose and the window they're building, but otherwise, no Hacker side graphical upgrade is planned. I agree that Hackers they don't look as good as System, I wish they had a more abstract look like Systems, however whenever told so KDR_11k replies that Tron also had flat shaded units! And personnaly, I don't have the skill nor the inspiration to texture Hacker's units.

This isnt tron, he should take pains to realize that.

I wanted both sides to have different styles. System has lines on black, Hacker has shaded stuff.

It just looks unfinished...

The hacker side doesnt even fit in with the maps, thats why it sticks out.

What about unit textures like this for the Hacker side?



Something like that will match the theme of the mod and look very nice to boot, while at the same time looking very different from the System's units.

Well, if you're volunteering to give the hackers a retexturing job, please go ahead. I know you've got all the artistic talent and skill needed. Indeed bodies covered with curved tatoo like that would sure give the hacker an awesome evil look. Will be quite tricky to wrap them on shape such as the trojan without visible seam though.


I reuploaded KPCA7 which lifetime had elapsed, since I'm not yet fully done with KP 2.0, and don't want to make yet another version number since the changes between KPCA7 and KP2.0 are so far almost only cosmetics.

I handed over KP to you and KDR_11k, and I was serious about it. This is your decision.

As an avid Kernel Panic player, though, I am really opposed to releasing the Kernel Panic Corruption as Kernel Panic 2.0. This is for three reasons:

First of all, the people who play Kernel Panic do it because it's extremely simple, quick to learn, and makes for fast games. I think doubling the amount of units and adding things like stealth takes away from these things, thus making KP less attractive. KP was never meant to, and never will be, a full alternative to real mods like BA. It only works, and is only played, because of it's extreme simplicity.

Second, graphics and style. While I lolled really hard at the goatse lab, and the horsey trojan horse, they somewhat ruin the game for me. I like the style which KDR did so brilliantly because it's so extremely simple, merging with the game style. Adding horses, little bugs with legs and Dune-like worms just doesn't feel right to me.

And last, gameplay. I think part of the fun is that everybody has exactly the same handful of units. And I think it's hard enough balancing two factions for one map, but two factions balanced for Marble Madness won't be balanced for Speed Balls 16 way at all, for example.

All in all, If think if you add factions and change things just to make it cooler, KP will end up like Nanoblobs.

Imho Kernel Panic: Corruption should keep it's name.

Just my two cents.

edit: I would make a 1.1 version with the auto-lab-rotating thingy and zwzsg's new graphics, in a zip bundled with the LUA widget for auto-repeat. Then wait for The Next Version (TM) of Spring and use LUA there to change the interface and make it more minimalistic. Also add more cool effects and stuff.

Adding horses, little bugs with legs and Dune-like worms just doesn't feel right to me.

I agree with that. Their look doesn't suit the rest of the KP experience.

For the goatse, thanksfully it is so stylised I hadn't even recognised it, so it hasn't turned KP into yet another cesspool of the intarweb such as 4 chan, Second Life, or wherever people rehash the same worn out annoying pictures forever.

I think Runecrafter proposed texxing style could work out very great for hackers, I'm just not sure how to convince him to work for us.

First of all, the people who play Kernel Panic do it because it's extremely simple, quick to learn, and makes for fast games. I think doubling the amount of units and adding things like stealth takes away from these things, thus making KP less attractive. KP was never meant to, and never will be, a full alternative to real mods like BA. It only works, and is only played, because of it's extreme simplicity.

Imo the Hacker side doesn't add that much complexity, as the hacker side is similar enough to the CPU side that you don't have to relearn everything. Tactics such as cloacked worms or bugs morphing into mines play a small enough part that you can win while ignoring them.


The main reason behing my wanting to make Kernel Panic Corruption the official Kernel Panic 2.0 is to keep it simple for new players. I am pretty sure that when proposed the choice between something, and exactly the same thing plus more, every people would find the option with more more attractive. If new players are told that ok there is KP 1.0, and that other branch with lots of new cool stuff such as a whole new race, they'll wonder why not everybody doesn't just get the full version. Having one official KP with everything in it makes it more simple and more attractive than a confusing maze of branches.

Especially considering how the CPU units haven't been changed*, and the adding of a new side doesn't prevent people to do System vs System matches. Host a KP Corruption game, play with only System, and it's exactly like a pre-corruption KP game.

* beside mines and debugger tweaks, new graphism for shots, and kernel autoturning, which anyway are things you want in KP1.1.

I would make a 1.1 version with the auto-lab-rotating thingy and zwzsg's new graphics

I don't want to make this simply because it's too much hassle to maintain two branches especially considering you can simply not play hacker for the exact same result. Since host can't forbid races, I made and will maintain the eviless mutator.

My plan was to pack a slightly improved KPCA7 renamed into KP2.0, the eviless mutator, NTai and profile, KP maps, single player scripts, the autospam widget, into one single download. So that in one go, newcomers would be all set. If you insist, I could rename the eviless mutator into "Kernel Panic 1.2", and rename "KP 2.0 including corruption" into "Kernel Panic Corruption v8", but imo it would cause people more confusion to have the version with most stuff being labelled as the minor one. I think I'll just split the naming issue in two, by naming them "Kernel Panic Eviless 1.2" and "Kernel Panic Corruption 1.2". Still I think having only one mod would have made it simpler for newcomers. (But anyway I still wish to also make a KP ONS mutator, so there might be branches and mutators anyway.) And anyone can tell me how many L in evilless? KDR said to use Kernel Panic Google, but frankly, I'd rather have a bland but clear name than a nudge at google motto that'll confuse everybody not as net savvy as KDR.

use LUA there to change the interface and make it more minimalistic.

I agree. Not so much about making the interface more minimalistic, but about making the interface more styled. I like having all the buttons even those you find useless such as "hold fire", "repeat" and all. However, some are clearly irrelevant for KP, such as ressource bars and load/unload. And I feel a new UI design would be the perfect complement for KP styled map and KP styled unit models. But being rather untalented with 2D art, and not particularly knowelgeable in lua aera, I won't make one but rather wait for someone to make one for me.

Also, someone hands me two sound files for kernel and hole under attack notifications, please.

And I think it's hard enough balancing two factions for one map, but two factions balanced for Marble Madness won't be balanced for Speed Balls 16 way at all, for example.

Loads of play testing! And I must find a way to get players give me feedback. Currently I feel like Hacker is slightly underpowered, but that's actually nice if it translate into people choosing the System side most of the time.

All in all, If think if you add factions and change things just to make it cooler, KP will end up like Nanoblobs.

What about adding factions but without changing things? And yes, I seriously considered adding a third race!

just my random $.02 about naming, how about:

KP Corruption: has bothe sides

KP System War: has only the system side (i thought is was User????)

And another useless person chimes in:

If you want both the version number, and a mutator name, I think

Kernal Panic 2.0: Corruption
Kernal Panic 2.0: Evilless

would make it more explicit that they were the same game.

For any that might missunderstand me, I think
<game name> <version>: <mutator>
is the way to do it, regardless of what those end up being.

Yes, I'll name them like that ILMTitan. Clearest naming scheme.

I just noticed that mines are not blocking, which means they are stackable: you can build several mines on the exact same position: While I'm tempted to see that as a bug and fix it by making mines impassable, I'm afraid maybe there was actually a good reason I'm unware of. So, KDR_11k, is that normal that mines are freely passable and stackable, and what's the reason behind that?

One thought: since it's already been decided that Corruption will allow greater complexity than the original Evilless KP, are there any plans to add more sides? Like a side that's about esoteric non-Von-Neumann modelled computing (a distributed-neural-network thing)? A "User" side seperate from "system", representing the actual input from the outside world?

User units:
Kernel = User.
Socket = Stdin.
Bit = Char
Byte = Reboot
Pointer = Kill-9
special turret unit = disconnect.

You could easily mix up the sides by having a few bizarrities for each side. Give user turrets instead of mines, and a cloaked crawling bomb instead of a Byte. For neural-networking, follow a repair/regen theme - their weakest units (the Nodes) have regen, and can repair anything larger than themselves - the catch is that neural-units don't have much health.

zwzsg wrote:Yes, I'll name them like that ILMTitan. Clearest naming scheme.

I just noticed that mines are not blocking, which means they are stackable: you can build several mines on the exact same position: While I'm tempted to see that as a bug and fix it by making mines impassable, I'm afraid maybe there was actually a good reason I'm unware of. So, KDR_11k, is that normal that mines are freely passable and stackable, and what's the reason behind that?

They are in all other mods and I didn't want to make minefields block friendly units from moving through. You can even hide mines under your sockets or walls though I don't think there's a good reason to do that.

Pxtl wrote:Bit = Char

Actually, a char should reflect a byte.

Char is a hero unit, fool!

rattle wrote:

Pxtl wrote:Bit = Char

Actually, a char should reflect a byte.

Suggested char because it's the smallest unit of input from a user typing at the console. In hindsight, "interrupt" might be better.

Was about to say impulse but interrupt is better, yeah.