Spring RTS Engine

smoth wrote:so boirunner, are you saying that the current version you would like to be kept as unmodified and all modifications after this to be mutators so we can preserve the origonal concept?

More or less. As I said, there are some fixes to do. But yes, a more complex game mechanic would warrant a fork/mutator, imho. This mod will be niche anyway, it will never be a full fledged mod like BA. So I think it should not become too complex, you should have to spec one game an be able to play pretty well after that. Imho this is why nobody really plays Nanoblobs, it became too complex a game for quick fun, but too abstract to be appealing for many people wanting to learn an in-depth and involving gameplay. So yeah, I'd like to keep KP as simple as possible, at least in the main version.

If any one you disagrees and feels the game would benefit from additional units or factions or whatever, please go ahead and add them and make a mutator. I look forward to playing it :D

KDR_11k wrote:The decision is still how much damage it should do. Area bombardement that merely weakens bits? Area bombardement that rapes everything that can't run away fast enough?

Merely weaken bits, but do so enough to make it worth the time you wasted making those pointers. (this will probaly be the hard to balance part)

Tried that, area bombardement pointers are pretty useless or overpowered since they either kill bits in one shot or barely scratch bytes and still don't hit jack.

Just make them do less damage to bits and more damage to bytes

I always used pointers for harassment; they rape structures pretty hard tbh...

Dragon45 wrote:I always used pointers for harassment; they rape structures pretty hard tbh...

Yeah. Maybe if we leave pointers as they are they will be usefull anyway since they reduce how much you must push the front back before being able to attack the enemy structures.

In KP location isn't that critical because there are no fixed defenses, being in pointer range is just as good as being in bit range, you'll fight the same battles anyway and once his deployed forces are dead you can lock his buildings down and win.

What an excellent mod!

So, no more development is being done on this mod? Not even to fix the fact that the logic bomb doesnt explode unless you are RIGHT on top of it (Has no kamikaze distance and no sight radius)? Or to fix the fact pointers dont fire to their max range on most maps?

Saktoth wrote:What an excellent mod!

So, no more development is being done on this mod? Not even to fix the fact that the logic bomb doesnt explode unless you are RIGHT on top of it (Has no kamikaze distance and no sight radius)? Or to fix the fact pointers dont fire to their max range on most maps?

I understand your concern. In two weeks I will spend a few days addressing these problems.

Okay, arced missiles work provided the missiles are homing.

BTW, Edit 6 is up on Unknown Files. Since it's a temp file you should download it within 7 days if you want it.

KDR_11k wrote:In KP location isn't that critical because there are no fixed defenses, being in pointer range is just as good as being in bit range, you'll fight the same battles anyway and once his deployed forces are dead you can lock his buildings down and win.

There are no fixed defenses but there are chokepoints and enemy fire that keeps your guys from reaching the buildings that easly.

After having played KP some more, I have some more thoughts that have developed from the experience (besides the fact that this game is incredibly awesome.

1) the kernel/assemblers don't need so much armour. It takes forever to kill even after the game is yours. Once a player is harassing your kernel,. the game is practically over anyways.

Try the KDR Edits, I've reduced the HP significantly and made it much easier to intercept a construction (you do four times as much damage to a socket under construction). BTW, I assume you mean sockets, not assemblers. Assemblers have 2500 HP or so, two shots from a pointer and they're gone, especially since they can't move while building.

KDR_11k wrote:Try the KDR Edits, I've reduced the HP significantly and made it much easier to intercept a construction (you do four times as much damage to a socket under construction). BTW, I assume you mean sockets, not assemblers. Assemblers have 2500 HP or so, two shots from a pointer and they're gone, especially since they can't move while building.

Having played, that's DEFINITELY a good set of changes. I just tried a game where my enemy first cranked out two assemblers, where I first cranked out 10 bits and rushed him. The assemblers and sockets soaked up so much damage that my bits got wiped out after only taking down a single assembler while his small team of bits took them apart.

Do you mean a match of 0.7 or an Edit?

I also try to attack early now to prevent my opponent from making his first socket fast. In 0.7 you can still use the pointers to harrass him (aim for the assemblers, just look where the build laser ends) but only if you're on Marble Madness.

KDR_11k wrote:Do you mean a match of 0.7 or an Edit?

I also try to attack early now to prevent my opponent from making his first socket fast. In 0.7 you can still use the pointers to harrass him (aim for the assemblers, just look where the build laser ends) but only if you're on Marble Madness.

Yeah, 0.7, Marble Madness. Still hard to make an early rush better than just focusing on getting those sockets up.

Just played a game - I've always been using random start spots on the Marble Madness map, and it ended up top-v-bottom. We ran into a problem with exit directions - I didn't notice, but players in the south half complained their stuff had to turn around before attacking.

Perhaps an XTA-style "rotate-while-building" setup would be good? Does the kernel allow exiting from any side?

Personally I just put a waypoint below the kernel to make the units exit fast enough and then a waypoint where I want them to be. The kernel can be exited from any side, yes. Problem with rotation is that it always results in a turn on the construction platform (which blocks all further building until the unit leaves) and if you use a waypoint the units can wait on the platform for up to a 180° turn.

KDR_11k wrote:Personally I just put a waypoint below the kernel to make the units exit fast enough and then a waypoint where I want them to be. The kernel can be exited from any side, yes. Problem with rotation is that it always results in a turn on the construction platform (which blocks all further building until the unit leaves) and if you use a waypoint the units can wait on the platform for up to a 180° turn.

I know, but then at least it's fair to all players - with a turn every player has the same random chance of the speed of their exit. Without the turn, everybody must remember to make sure units exit the correct side.. which is non-obvious since the units don't even look like they have facing.

It's a shame that kernels have so much health without something like a static defense laser or cannon.