Spring RTS Engine

Gota wrote:
[...]

Want your great looking maps to be played, host them.
Dont wanna host them so people get to know them than dont expect them to be played.
small community with some maps around which entire mod balanced are based by now will have a hard time playing a gazillion different maps.
If you want your maps to be played more than maps that everyone is used to and maps that fit played mods perfectly than you need ot host it and you need to attempt to fit it to the games you want it to be played with.

This isn't really a valid argument. Don't blame the mapper if the playerbase is so reluctant to play new releases. Hosting a game shouldnt be a part of the process of a mapping! That should be purely mapping.

Then you release it. If theres a lack of attention, It's either a problem with the map or with the connection between releasing media and the audience.

Im willing to donate so cheesecan can buy all the OpenSource Tools nessescary to create a map. Somebody pm him the mapping tutorials, im looking forward to see your maps. Say cheese :) can do it.

SirArtturi wrote:

Gota wrote:
[...]

Want your great looking maps to be played, host them.
Dont wanna host them so people get to know them than dont expect them to be played.
small community with some maps around which entire mod balanced are based by now will have a hard time playing a gazillion different maps.
If you want your maps to be played more than maps that everyone is used to and maps that fit played mods perfectly than you need ot host it and you need to attempt to fit it to the games you want it to be played with.

This isn't really a valid argument. Don't blame the mapper if the playerbase is so reluctant to play new releases. Hosting a game shouldnt be a part of the process of a mapping! That should be purely mapping.

Then you release it. If theres a lack of attention, It's either a problem with the map or with the connection between releasing media and the audience.

Shouldn't indeed but it is so.
One can either adjust to it or not have his maps played...
Of course there is a problem cause there is no real way to be exposed to new maps...there is no proper map rating system as well,so people cant easily find the truly high quality excellent gameplay maps...
the only way to truly be exposed to a new mp is if you're a forum goer or if you see it hosted in the lobby..

"But on the other hand if you know that something you do is not appreciated, and keep going anyway, that means you are doing it for yourself"

Btw, I am posting from iPhone today so forgive the lack of detailed argument and that I am outright ignoring yan. This quote is exactly my point. Why bother, there is no reason for me to put out maps on the level of gunmetal or rocky. I have peole like knotke who say th maps have no gameplay in gundam or etc
Yet they have been revised more than any map in alll of spring's history each time incorporating feedback.



So forgive me if I am jaded but frankly this community only wants one type of map and I am not making another dsd clone

I have peole like knotke who say th maps have no gameplay in gundam or etc

well, thats only just like my opinion man.
But for example gunmetal is too porcy for gundam and the features (street lamps etc) hinder unit movements in frustrating ways:
http://springrts.com/phpbb/viewtopic.ph ... 7&start=29

Then there was this other map where vehicles could only leave the base area with a lot of clicking/trying (because of terrain) and even then it only worked in 2/3 start positions.

How you get from this to "this community only wants DSD clones", I do not understand.

Most of that sounds like pathing or unit selection issues, knorke. I remember Gunmetal being fairly good given you focus on non-land units.

i played all ur maps smoth ! with ba and sa ! :D

also, idont rly think that cheese played all ffa maps, and for sure, not more than 3-4 times each of them, so...

PicassoCT wrote:Im willing to donate so cheesecan can buy all the OpenSource Tools nessescary to create a map. Somebody pm him the mapping tutorials, im looking forward to see your maps. Say cheese :) can do it.

*dripping sarcasm* Yes please send me money so I can pay for open source tools. <_< */dripping sarcasm*

Anyway I have been making maps for a while now. Besides those I never posted my first two maps which I only put up on FU, one of which I have seen being played in the last 3 months. So I made 10 maps in total, not counting several maps which I never bothered to release because they sucked too hard.

Picasso, you made a bunch of maps for your own enjoyment, never bothering to care if anybody actually wanted to play them. Just saying that with all that time you put on those maps, I think you could have produced something people actually might have wanted to play instead.

smoth wrote:Why bother, there is no reason for me to put out maps on the level of gunmetal or rocky. I have peole like knotke who say th maps have no gameplay in gundam or etc

As I said, I liked at least one of your maps. I don't think you are the kind of person who gives up just because one person says something you did is crap. If you don't want to make any maps because you are fed up with not having your maps played, that is fine, my first post was never directed at you specifically. Somewhere out there is someone who is willing to make a map just on the odd chance that it might become popular. I am just trying to steer that person toward making an FFA map, because I personally enjoy those kind of maps.

Wombat wrote:i played all ur maps smoth ! with ba and sa ! :D

also, idont rly think that cheese played all ffa maps, and for sure, not more than 3-4 times each of them, so...

Then think again.

i dont have to, im sure of it, but w/e.

@ smoths map, nobody said his maps are crap, its bannable :D tbh i see 1 big issue with most ffa maps, and actually all 'big' maps - they are big. usually when i manage to convince ppl to change map, its like 'WTF 5 MIN,FU' = back to old crap

I have played all the common FFA maps at least a dozen times. What, you thought I had a life? No..

Cheesecan wrote:I have played all the common FFA maps at least a dozen times. What, you thought I had a life? No..

thats my point, 'common'.

Seems like this thread only became a magnet for bitter ppl. I really don't like this type of negativism. This thread is spiraling off topic and serves no good purpose so will some mod please lock this thread thanks.

rofl, im just suggesting u should try to search for new ffa maps, i bet u will find some u didnt see before. spring got almost 3k maps, there is no way u know them all. already mentioned arguments like 'there is no point in making new maps' is kinda answer to ur 1st post, im trying to give u some solution to this problem. stop rage, i didnt notice much 'negativism' here, life is just brutal ;<

btw, u said mapcycle sux, yes, thats why u should go and find 'new' ffa maps, show them to hosts owners and maybe they will increase number of maps on their hosts.

Finally home and can make a proper reply:

Many mappers have stopped making maps because they no longer see the point of it. You have issues with people like yan who have no apparent need to be civil and yet others also like yan who will let 1 or 2 things keep them from playing a map. You have players who complain about low quality maps but cry about filesize and players who say everything is more of the same but reject different layout types.

It is very frustrating to devote time to something and have it mocked ignored and generally hated for the wrong reason. I am not bitter more that I am trying to speak to some of the conflicts that mappers will find themselves facing.

I am going to continue to develop my gundam maps, they will all be 20x20 or larger because we have a glut of 16x16. No point in rerereinventing the wheel there. I also continue to develop them based on user feedback. for example:

But for example gunmetal is too porcy for gundam and the features (street lamps etc) hinder unit movements in frustrating ways:

Note, both issues are fixed in the new versions, now, people have not tried them to discover that but I did read the feedback and immediately sought to see it rectified.

I think this is part of the solution with maps, trying to consider the feedback and apply it. Yet we still run into people who will say a map is bad before trying the latest complete rework.

I am not trying to in any way bog down your thread, merely trying to say I see little reason for anyone to bother with a new 16X16 as we have many many of them already. Players don't want quality. Players don't want larger maps.

Feel free to ignore yan's emotional reaction, I was not in any way trying to pick on him in particular, just that he was the latest example of overly picky player that I had in my mind.

Picasso, you made a bunch of maps for your own enjoyment, never bothering to care if anybody actually wanted to play them. Just saying that with all that time you put on those maps, I think you could have produced something people actually might have wanted to play instead.

The trench is a map I actually want to play over.

gunmetal: i didnt try the new version because in the "new version v4" thread http://springrts.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=22703 it only said "metal map has been added" (not relevant to what i wrote) and how everybody is a jerk so yeah.

back on topic, i think some 5 players map would be nice to have. for 3 players they are some maps, but not so many good ones for 5.

Heh...if you make a map not suitable for a game or inconvenient to play with, and dont follow the standard of introducing your map to the public of players dont cry if your map is not played.

Guess why, Smoth, we dont have many 40x40 maps?
Cause no games are suitable for them...
Yes TA mods are mostly played on 20x20 or smaller.
Yes TA mods need metal patches otherwise its inconvenient to play.
Yes TA mods are not usually made for 1v1v1v1 on 20x20 maps...
Want a ta map that will get played make it for ta.
You released a few maps that were made for gundam good for you but if they don't get played don't go out on a nerd rage saying the community is retarded.

You know I tried to come on mumble to talk to you and try and calm you down but you wasn't there so I left. Take some drugs or something

Gota wrote:You released a few maps that were made for gundam good for you but if they don't get played don't go out on a nerd rage saying the community is retarded.

he remade his maps to be more suitable for *ta mods (m spots). and this community is retarded