Spring RTS Engine

awesome thread felix, I will be reading this tonight!

I like what the guy was talking about...cause anyone who dosn't think that a society can't be designed to be a nicer place is a dick. Sure, there are people who are going to be jerks...but at least we can make it harder for them, no?

Zoombie wrote:Sure, there are people who are going to be jerks...but at least we can make it harder for them, no?

Again, the point of the article is that "jerks will be jerks" is false and has been shown to be false by decades of psychological research. A person's behavior is shaped and bounded by his social environment. Or else, why is there a lot of spam and trolling and hostility here, and almost none at the comparably-sized Dwarf Fortress forum?

Felix the Cat wrote:

Zoombie wrote:Sure, there are people who are going to be jerks...but at least we can make it harder for them, no?

Again, the point of the article is that "jerks will be jerks" is false and has been shown to be false by decades of psychological research. A person's behavior is shaped and bounded by his social environment. Or else, why is there a lot of spam and trolling and hostility here, and almost none at the comparably-sized Dwarf Fortress forum?

Maybe because one must be very patient and wise to play Dwarf Fortress even once, what acts as a sort of jerk-filter :)

manored wrote:

Felix the Cat wrote:

Zoombie wrote:Sure, there are people who are going to be jerks...but at least we can make it harder for them, no?

Again, the point of the article is that "jerks will be jerks" is false and has been shown to be false by decades of psychological research. A person's behavior is shaped and bounded by his social environment. Or else, why is there a lot of spam and trolling and hostility here, and almost none at the comparably-sized Dwarf Fortress forum?

Maybe because one must be very patient and wise to play Dwarf Fortress even once, what acts as a sort of jerk-filter :)

Well, consider the rather confusing and complicated process of downloading and installing spring and then getting a mod and playing it with no prior experience... one would think that would be a jerk-filter too.

Not to point too heavily at the mods, but this is rather similar to the broken windows theory of crime - that is, when a potential "big time criminal" looks around the city and sees lots of petty crimes like vandalism, muggings, ect going unpunished, the message sent is that it is an environment that accepts such behavior.

So to compare to forums - you see lots of little things like off topic spam in serious threads, subtle (or not so subtle) jabs at other users that are not constructive (or even pretend to be constructive), or forum titles/posts filled with cussing, and then it creates an atmosphere where truly destructive flaming and general hostility is easier to come by, since mods almost never crack down on the "petty" forum abuse that creates an atmosphere of permissiveness for general jack-ass-ness.

I must agree that our forum moderators are, in general, a bit too complacent...

I have not read the article yet, I have just read the thread, my comp issues reduced my time tonight ...


anyway, I will read it tomorrow. Asshattery does happen here, a lot, so much that at one point I exploded then created my own site just to get away from it all. Honestly, getting snipped on forums, teamkilled in a server seems to be the way of the internet these days.

As the computer gaming world reaches a larger and larger audience we will see more and more of these morons and the average jerk can get on the computer and be juvenile. I'll not bore you with talk about the good old days but tell you that part of the reason I have gone to playing fps games on my XBOX over pc is that I do not have to deal with all the cheating, hacking and WHINING about said bullshit. On a console we all have the same hardware and cheating is much harder to do. god help us the day that we see more cheats for spring, I remember the one that we simply had to pretend was not posted.

I will try and submit more relevant thoughts after I (hopefully) get to read the article tomorrow.

Felix the Cat wrote:
Again, the point of the article is that "jerks will be jerks" is false and has been shown to be false by decades of psychological research. A person's behavior is shaped and bounded by his social environment. Or else, why is there a lot of spam and trolling and hostility here, and almost none at the comparably-sized Dwarf Fortress forum?

Except I've been in quite a few situations where people have been given every opportunity to *not* act like a jerk...and still do it...

Though that might be because they were shaped before by their prior experiences and became jerks, then I came into contact with them and they simply acted the way they had been brought up.

So...I suppose I should say, "You can't prevent all people from becoming jerks, but you can at least try to help them un-jerk."

Or something. I don't know, I'm not a psycholologist.

anyway, I will read it tomorrow. Asshattery does happen here, a lot, so much that at one point I exploded then created my own site just to get away from it all. Honestly, getting snipped on forums, teamkilled in a server seems to be the way of the internet these days.

i judge this type of asshattery to be the worst kind.

Sleksa wrote:

anyway, I will read it tomorrow. Asshattery does happen here, a lot, so much that at one point I exploded then created my own site just to get away from it all. Honestly, getting snipped on forums, teamkilled in a server seems to be the way of the internet these days.

i judge this type of asshattery to be the worst kind.

Oh, the irony.

Careful with your dealings with the league, lest that post be deleted too.

Seriously though, the amount of flamewars need to be reduced somehow. I'm not sure how this would be applicable to online communities, but I think the only somewhat satisfactory solution to the general tendency to form conflicting opinions is democracy. Then again, dictatorship is as good a form of arbitrary rule as the dictator is good in the eyes of his/her subjects.

Teutooni wrote:

Sleksa wrote:

anyway, I will read it tomorrow. Asshattery does happen here, a lot, so much that at one point I exploded then created my own site just to get away from it all. Honestly, getting snipped on forums, teamkilled in a server seems to be the way of the internet these days.

i judge this type of asshattery to be the worst kind.

Oh, the irony.

Careful with your dealings with the league, lest that post be deleted too.

Seriously though, the amount of flamewars need to be reduced somehow. I'm not sure how this would be applicable to online communities, but I think the only somewhat satisfactory solution to the general tendency to form conflicting opinions is democracy. Then again, dictatorship is as good a form of arbitrary rule as the dictator is good in the eyes of his/her subjects.

my first post was apparently deleted because it didnt have much to do with this thread, although day's post lived t.t



I meant the general human thinking of counting yourself to be superior to everyone around you. Smoth's post was just the perfect example of it.

Asshattery does happen here, a lot

IE you are all asshats

so much that at one point I exploded then created my own site just to get away from it all.

IE my presence was not needed in this band of raving ragtag-lunatics and i created a safe-heaven of enlightement and wisdom for everyone

Honestly, getting snipped on forums, teamkilled in a server seems to be the way of the internet these days.

IE i have unjustly been snipped on forums and teamkilled in server, which seems to be the standard of the internet these days, Oh the degration of the golden times when everything was better and everyone behaved.

Seriously though, the amount of flamewars need to be reduced somehow. I'm not sure how this would be applicable to online communities, but I think the only somewhat satisfactory solution to the general tendency to form conflicting opinions is democracy. Then again, dictatorship is as good a form of arbitrary rule as the dictator is good in the eyes of his/her subjects.

popularitycracy is the last thing we need.

part of the reason I have gone to playing fps games on my XBOX over pc is that I do not have to deal with all the cheating, hacking and WHINING about said bullshit.

Yes.

I generally don't have my head up my ass, sleksa. However, that does not make me holier then thou. that was your assumption. Can we not derail the thread with discussion about the drama of this site. I honestly never see anything good come from it and frankly it just gives the trolls a great party time thread.

Sorry Sleksa, I thought you were just trolling him. I apologize.

there is a good chance he could be but only your mortician knows for sure.

Felix the Cat wrote:Caydr, perhaps you might read the article, or at least the first page or two of it. The author's main point is that people are not naturally fuckwads - or to put it another way, "jerks will be jerks" is not a valid assumption. 60 years of psychological research tells us that the way a person behaves is dependent upon the social environment. The entire point of the article is that by changing the social environment in such a way as fuckwadism is not accepted, people will not behave like fuckwads.

Aye, I think my first post was more moderate like this one... then I got a call from work and my life was ruined. Bloody bunch of twits, they are...

Teutooni wrote:Sorry Sleksa, I thought you were just trolling him. I apologize.

I never troll

Caydr wrote:

Felix the Cat wrote:Caydr, perhaps you might read the article, or at least the first page or two of it. The author's main point is that people are not naturally fuckwads - or to put it another way, "jerks will be jerks" is not a valid assumption. 60 years of psychological research tells us that the way a person behaves is dependent upon the social environment. The entire point of the article is that by changing the social environment in such a way as fuckwadism is not accepted, people will not behave like fuckwads.

Aye, I think my first post was more moderate like this one... then I got a call from work and my life was ruined. Bloody bunch of twits, they are...

Don't feel bad, most of the people posting in this thread haven't read the article either, despite the fact that the thread's topic is to discuss the article.

I read it, and responded with all 50 IQs i have.

I read it <.< >.>